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Questions on Russian TOZ 17-01

17K views 9 replies 6 participants last post by  Tasman  
#1 ·
Dear readers of Rimfirecentral,

my name is Alex and I am a German target shooter.
I am looking for a .22 bolt action rifle with a magazine (no sinlge shot rifles) that were used as military trainiers. I found some models that fulfill these requirements with the help of this forum.
However, most models are VERY expensive here in Germany. For example, my favourite model the Mauser/MAS 45 sells for +700€. They are even more expensive in France, even though they have more floating around on French gun websites (+900€).
Luckily, I came across a small little Russian rifle: The TOZ 17. As far as I know, these were used as military trainers. Egun.de (the German "gunbroker") lists one offer for only 99€, but it is a TOZ 17-01.

http://www.egun.de/market/item.php?id=6150899

I searched the forum for information on this model and it seems that the 17-01 series came later in the 70s and were never used as military trainers. Is that true? Are there any differences between 1950s TOZ 17 models and 1970s 17-01 models?
What can be said about the quality of the TOZ 17-01? Do they shot well on 50m using iron sights? How about the trigger?
I want to use it in matches in the class .22 "military trainer", however most people don't know ALL models of .22 military trainers. So, I am wondering, if i can sneek in with the TOZ 17-01 if it looks just like a TOZ17. Probably I won't win any prizes because they go to the single shot guys but that is not important for me.

I just despise single shots as very many bolt action guns were castrated to single shots here in Germany in former times and many milsurp rifles suffered this fate, too. No offense to single shot owners :)

Thank you very much for your help in advance and greetings from Germany!
 
#2 ·
You won't regret. Here is an old range report for you to start (you might seen it before):
http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=587647
This is simple but very nice rifle. It could be used as a "military trainer", but mostly was used as a entry level rifle for the first timers and as a hunting rifle. Trigger is far from professional target, but good enough to be able to put all shots into 9 ring at 50 yards/meters. It is very light and feels right on position. It might need a light extractors adjustment because it meant for usage of a steel case rim round, but it might work well without it. Good luck!
 
#3 ·
Dear USGuy,
thank you very much for your reply. No, I didn't read this thread before. However, I found this sticky http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=265727 Still have to read through it. I think I will give this little rifle a shot. I bought a little .22 bolt action from Krico some years ago for 70€ and refinished the stock and put a scope on it recently. Do you know if a gunsmith can improve the trigger? Maybe by polishing it and putting trigger shims in the trigger group? Normally I use CCI Standard velocity .22, I never saw any .22 ammo with steel instead of brass.
 
#7 ·
When grass might be greener ... or not



Trigger is very simple there and you may polish it yourself if you wish to. I did not do that and it took me a couple of dry fires to get use to it. I've used an empty case as a trainer/dummy round.
If you wish to refinish the stock, you may try an alcohol to flush away old finish as it is a shellac in most cases. Make a test on a little spot and most simple restoration process, in this case, could be simple reapplying a couple of layers of shellac over. If you need a perfect finish, then complete removal and some sort of a "french polish" will give you stock with ORIGINAL look and easy future repair process.
In time of this rifle production, all Russians rim fire rounds was made with steel cases. Exception was made for sporting/target rounds. For general usage it was hard to get. Rim on a steel case is a "hair" thicker and this may cause not so sharp extraction. At least it was my case. Now my rifle has a perfect extraction for brass cases.
Good luck!
 
#4 ·
Over my way (Australia) they are cheap. An ad at random reads as follows:
"TOZ 17-01 .22 GOOD Made in the good old CCCP till they sold out to the corrupt running dog capitalists of the imperial west!!
A solid no nonsense work gun. "Is strong like Ox, smart like tractor!"---$165"

This equates to about 115.5 Euro and they went into production in 1978.
It is not uncommon to see them for (Australian $) 100, 110,120.
As for being a military trainer, you must be joking! I seem to recall the 8M series (a single shot) was used as a trainer but this was for youth and not the military.
I believe that given the U.S. was not trading with Russia at the time, they are few about and are likely to be a more recent import but the American chaps are better at confirming that than I.
Getting a magazine for them if lost seems to be like looking for hens teeth so don't loose it.
 
#8 ·
17-01.



Certainly the Russian stuff had a good name Downunder in those days.
Budget priced and know for accuracy... despite the triggers.
I recall the 17-01's being on the shelf in 1980 so they must have not long supercedded the 17,s.
Price here at the time was equal to US$48 with our various taxes added.
They could straighten some very ordinary cartridges and were excellent with anything decent.
The 16 , according to friends book was used as some sort of trainer in the 1930's , perhaps Military, Comsomol or Youth.Sold as export sporters as far back as early '70,s that I know of perhaps a little earlier.
The 17 repeaters were not dovetailed to about '73.
The 17-01 has a far shorter lock time without the big heavy striker rear knob of the 16 & 17.
The 17-01 has same action & bolt as early 12-01 Smallbore Trainer and perhaps the same trigger which is easier to improve, the lugs being a machining where-as the 16 &17 trigger and lugs are just folded back heavy sheetmetal.
I have been thinking of a solution to these creepy triggers for some time.
Many Gunsmiths simply refuse to try claiming they are a cheap rifle and not worth doing anything with which does annoy me as they are very accurate and worth a attempt.
The lugs on my 12-01s have machine marks , a major failing considering the excelent quality of the bores and good work elsewhere.
The lugs also, only contact the action on a tiny spot at 6 oclock making wear marks which also add to the 10 stage effect.
I have been tryint to think of a solution that will be affordable and might have hit on it.
I will bore through the lugs from left to right on a milling machine and epoxy in place hardened drill shanks.Setting them in on a sheet of glass for parallel alignment at the original lug height.
Under the action I will bore in slightly with non-tapered borrer and set a hardened button in place, perhaps a flat valve shim.
It must be a shallow boring due to diameter of bearing surface required vs action wall thickness and the button will be held from about 11 to 1 oclock and 7to 5 oclock.
The button will be set to depth of orig. base of action and epoxed in and trigger and spring set in place so the lugs then align perfectly with the button surface using soft , unset epoxy as the correction factor.
This will hopefully align the surfaces without costly super accurate machiniing.
The bearing surfaces will be hard and much larger correcting the original problem of the very limited contact of lugs on the round action leading to instant wear resulting in grooves on the bearing surface.
The mags feed perfectly, without damage to projectiles but are loose and easily lost if one inadvertently touches the release when handling the rifle as it is at point of balance.
I put a couple turns of red reflective tape on mags to make them a jam fit so they do not slide out if release is inadvertently touched.
If somehow you still drop one from pocket etc. go back at night and cast torch around to find.
The rifles usually came with a spare and most folks have managed to lose both.
I have the originals still, as I used this trick from day one.
 
#5 ·
Ok, can you tell me about the general impression of the rifle? I am really considering buying it because it's "only" 100€. Are there any methods to "restore" (refinish) the stock? the finish is awful. I restored a rifle stock once and used wood stain to get rid of the old finish and applied several coats of SCHAFTOL "Schaftöl" (stock oil). I think oiled stocks look way nicer than once that were laquered.
 
#6 ·
I have shot flies that have landed on my page 50 m away so they are accurate enough. Do you know that they are a two stage trigger? If you don't like a two stage trigger then don't buy an older Toz I say so I would leave the trigger mechanism alone. As for doing up the timber work, each to their own and depends on what you want it to do and your dedication to do that which you do do, well.
 
#9 ·
My experience:
The TOZ 17 is an excellent .22.
I own many .22s; including several CZ 452s, the standard Ruger 10/22, come classic Mossbergs, and a WZ-48.
The TOZ had the best stock trigger of the bunch, is easily adjustable, and said by others, not hard to work on yourself.
I have not needed any extractor work, but clearly it is not uncommon.
Mine currently has a 4x Burris scope which for my use is perfect. The sights it comes with are adequate for sporting use but far from precision sights, but a craft person could mount a better sight using the dovetail or drill & tap.
I decided I needed a TOZ about 10 years ago, and it took a year or 2 of searching to find one; but I scored one new in box with 4 magazines.
Bolt is stiff; edges are sharp, but will wear in nicely with use or some reasonable polishing.

DSC_4005 by John Hassard, on Flickr

Below is a target from when I was doing some ammo testing with my TOZ. Show prone with a sling at 25M.
DSC_0477 by John Hassard, on Flickr

I enjoy all of my .22s but this one is my go-to rimfire.
JH