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March NRA Light Rifle & NRA Smallbore Position Match (Post your Scores and Photos)

3.8K views 50 replies 12 participants last post by  23's Dad  
#1 · (Edited)
March NRA Light Rifle & NRA Smallbore Position Match (Post your Scores and Photos)

The RATTLE BOARD:

Image


PM me if I've goofed!
 
#2 · (Edited)
The Rules

MATCH RULES

This rules summary is based on NRA Smallbore Rule Book with slight modifications to attract as many people as possible.
The two classes will keep things fair, utilize the NRA Ladder (so you can track your progress from Marksman to Expert level),
and allow for 50ft, 75ft/25yd and 50yd ranges to compete together in same group.

We will have two match classes:

  1. 4P NRA Conventional Smallbore (for those with advanced equipment), using A-17, A-7 or A-23 target at 50ft, 75ft/25yd, or 50yd.
  2. 4P NRA Light Rifle (for those with regular sporting rifles), using A-32 / A-32-Modified or A-31 target at 50ft or 50yd.

Key modifications to NRA 4P rules:

  • Any rim-fire caliber.
  • Open, peep and telescopic sights will shoot separately.
  • Positions are:
    4P (Prone, Standing, Sitting, Kneeling - shot in that order
    )

    Note: if you cannot shoot from all four positions (either range rules, physical limitation, or any other alibi) you may shoot any combination of the following:
    Standing AND/OR Prone AND/OR Unsupported Bench (elbows on bench and sling only- instead of prone)

    These alternate positions are scored and recorded separately and are NOT a combined 2P class.

Guys & gals, don't worry about the "humbling" experience after shooting this course the first few times.
We've all been there. I promise you steady improvement if you stick to it.


As long as this online match gives you a reason to go out there, practice position shooting and move you up the skills ladder I think we have succeeded. Monthly match results are just to make it fun. Don't forget, sanctioned NRA matches are scored at each skill level separately.

Learning Links:
I strongly recommend attending a local Appleseed (http://appleseedinfo.org/) to improve your position shooting skills.

USAMU Shooting Tips:

http://www.odcmp.com/usamu/shooting_tips.htm

See these CMP pdf-s for correct body positions:

And these videos from 1989 Highpower Position Clinic:

Books to consider:

  • "Leather Sling and Shooting Positions" by Jim Owens
  • "Competitive Shooting" by A.A. Yur'Yev
  • "Ways of the Rifle" by Gaby Buhlmann
  • "Rifle Steps to Success" or "Rifle: Steps to Success" by Launi Meili
  • "Olympic Target Rifle Shooting" by Ralf Horneber
  • "Shooting for Gold" by William Krilling
  • "Rifle Shooting as a Sport" by Bernd Klingner

We will use NRA Smallbore Rifle Rules with the following slight modifications marked in BOLD RED.

1) 4P NRA Conventional Smallbore (Rules: http://www.nrahq.org/compete/RuleBooks/SBR/sbr-index.pdf)

Rifle
Safe any caliber rimfire rifle (.17 cal. use NRA .22 cal scoring gauge to make it fair), with no weight restrictions. Adjustable butt plate , palm rests, Schuetzen type butt plates, etc. can be used (see NRA Smallbore Rules).

Other Equipment and Accessories

- Clothing, padding, shooting jackets, slings, etc. allowed (see NRA Smallbore Rules).
- Use a shooting mat, a thick painters mat from Home Depot, couple of yoga/camping foam mats, or an old piece of carpet will do. I also recommend knee/elbow pads (Home Depot) and a bunch of rolled up towels to make a Kneeling Roll for comfort and thus better scores.

Sights
"O-Class" - open iron sighted rifles,
"C-Class" - closed non-magnified iron sighted rifles (aperture or peep sights), non-magnified red dot,
"T-Class" - telescopic, magnified aperture and magnified red dot.

Target and Distance Options
A-17 target, 50 feet, one shot per bulls-eye.
A-7 target, 75 feet / 25 yards, max. two shots per bulls-eye.
A-23 target, 50 yards, five shots per bulls-eye.
Many indoor ranges require you to use their targets ($), so just tape yours on top of theirs. :)

2) 4P NRA Light Rifle (Sitting position added to regular rules) (Rules Section 22: http://www.nrahq.org/compete/RuleBooks/SBR/sbr-index.pdf)

Rifle

Safe any caliber rimfire rifle (.17 cal. use NRA .22 cal scoring gauge to make it fair), having a trigger pull of not less than 2 pounds, and weighing 8½ pounds or less (including sights & sling). Adjustable butt plate permitted if placed in center position. No palm rests, Schuetzen type butt plates, etc. (see NRA Light Rifle Rules).

Other Equipment and Accessories

- Clothing, padding, etc. (see NRA Light Rifle Rules).
- Non-shooting leather work glove may be used to protect forehand from sling swivel.
- A basic military sling or carry sling not to exceed 1 ÂĽ" width may be used in all but standing position (get one here http://www.appleseedstore.flyingcart.com/?p=detail&pid=10&cat_id=0).
- Use a shooting mat, a thick painters mat from Home Depot, couple of yoga/camping foam mats, or an old piece of carpet will do. I also recommend knee/elbow pads (Home Depot) and a bunch of rolled up towels to make a Kneeling Roll for comfort and thus better scores.

Sights
"O-Class" - open iron sighted rifles,
"C-Class" - closed non-magnified iron sighted rifles (aperture or peep sights), non-magnified red dot,
"T-Class" - telescopic, magnified aperture and magnified red dot (maximum 6X).

Target and Distance Options
A-32 target, 50 feet, two shots per bulls-eye. This target is allowed, but not preferued. If you have these targets on-hand, you may continue to use them until exhausted.
A-32-Modified target, 50 feet, two shots per bulls-eye (modified to preserve same aspect ratio with A-31, as there is between A-17 and A-23).
A-31 target, 50 yards, five shots per bulls-eye.
Many indoor ranges require you to use their targets ($), so just tape yours on top of theirs. :)


Rest of this post applies to both 4P NRA Conventional Smallbore and 4P NRA Light Rifle classes.


Order good quality targets here: http://www.pistoleer.com/targets/rifle/
or Download printable target pdf-s
(PM CZ452UltraLux with issues):
(Make sure you have PAGE SCALING set to NONE in Acrobat Print Menu to print correct size).

A-17 (50ft - 8.5 MOA black) (be careful which bull you are shooting or cross shooting :) as they are close together)- http://www.box.net/shared/2edlrdfnmh
A-7 (75ft/25yd) - http://www.box.net/shared/4atdqu8av0
A-23 (50yd - 7.4 MOA black) - http://www.box.net/shared/m6rf4535ci - OR 2 Bulls on Legal Paper http://www.box.net/shared/9e8mngxnua
A-32 (50ft - 10.7 MOA black) - Allowed but not prefered. Use A-32 (Modified) instead.
A-32 (Modified) (50ft - 7.8 MOA black) - http://www.box.net/shared/1azpbyvr7f
A-31 (50yd - 8.8 MOA black) - http://www.box.net/shared/2rjit37svf - OR 2 Bulls on Legal Paper http://www.box.net/shared/an3qjul4yi

Course of Fire
Distance: 50 Feet, 75ft/25yd (for Conventional Smallbore) or 50 Yards (all compete together due to target re-sizing)

Positions: Prone, Standing (no sling), Sitting (added to Light Rifle class), Kneeling - shot in that order.
OR for those that can't do all 4 positions (scored separately - NOT a combined 2P class)
- Standing (no sling)
- Unsupported Bench (sitting with elbows on the bench without any support other then sling) - instead of prone.
Time: 15 minutes per position (10 shoots - average 90 sec. per shot), with 5 minute change-over (break) and 5 minute "prep time" before each position with "unlimited sighting shots", for a total of 100 minutes to complete all 4 positions.

Those shooting standing and unsupported bench have 40 minutes total time to complete (15 min each position, with two 5 minute change-overs (breaks) and two "prep times" of 5 min. each).

No. of Shots in each position: 10 (Max. 1 shot per bull on A-17 and A32-Modified, Max. 2 shots per bull on A-7, A-32, and Max. 5 shots per bull on A-23, A-31)

Max. Points: 400-40x
100-10x each (for those shooting standing and unsupported bench only)

Many indoor ranges don't allow prone shooting due to lack of space, but if you ask to be placed at the end of the firing line I think they can make an exception.

SCORING and POSTING
I'm sure we all agree that an online postal match has to be based on an honor system, so just a reminder to use consecutive shoots/targets. :)

Use official NRA .22 cal inward scoring gauge in deciding doubtful shots (touching ring (not cracked) = inside ring score).
Shooters using .17 cal. use NRA .22 cal scoring gauge to make it fair.

Get a $6 plain gauge or $10 magnified here (I recommend magnified): http://www.champchoice.com/cat-Scoring_Gauges-335.aspx

For scoring Xs on 50ft/75ft A-17/A-32/A-7 targets please see NRA Smallbore Rule Book - Section 14: Scoring.

We'll score 2 classes, Conventional Smallbore and Light Rifle.
Each class will have a 4P category, plus Standing and Unsupported Bench/Prone categories separately, NOT a combined 2P category.
Those shooting 4P can have their standing and prone scores applied in the Standing and Unsupported Bench/Prone categories as well.

Post:
- 4P total and number of Xs, and each position total score plus number of Xs (or just your Standing and Unsupported Bench/Prone score with Xs) followed by your RFC name and state.
- Competition class (NRA Smallbore or NRA Light Rifle), Sight category (O, C, T class), and NRA Ladder Rating (don't forget to count just standing, kneeling and prone in Light Rifle class).
- Equipment used with details.
- Range distance and weather conditions.
- Pictures of the target if you can.
How?
Use http://imageshack.us/, browse for picture of your target, click upload, copy (Ctrl-C) the link next to words "Direct Link", in your RFC post use "Insert Image" icon (the yellow icon with the mountains) and paste the link you just copied. Image of your target should show up in your post.

E.g.
338-10X (80-1X, 83-2X, 85-3X, 90-4X) - BigGuns, FL
NRA Light Rifle, C-Class, Sharpshooter (missed Expert by 2pts 253 vs 255 - don't forget to count just standing, kneeling and prone in Light Rifle class).
CZ 452, Wolf Match Target ammo, BRNO Sights
Receiver glass bedded,
50 yd, Sunny, 86 Degrees, Wind 5mph at 3 o'clock gusting to 10mph
Pictures

NRA Skill Ladders (to track your progress from Marksman to Expert level).

3P NRA Light Rifle Ladder
Combine your standing, kneeling and prone scores to compare against 3P Light Rifle Ladder.

Image


4P NRA Smallbore Ladder

"Offhand Only" and "Prone Only" ratings in Smallbore class are to be calculated as follows (% of 100 possible points for each position):

Pro-Marksman: 50% prone/bench, 40% standing;
Marksman: 63% prone/bench, 50% standing;
Marksman 1st Class: 75% prone/bench, 60% standing;
Sharpshooter: 83% prone/bench, 70% standing;
Expert: 90% prone/bench, 80% standing;
Distinguished Expert: 96% prone/bench, 91% standing;

Image

 
#4 ·
Rule change or clarification?

Currently, our rules - formally or informally - limit our standings to one place per person. Therefore, even if you hold the top four scores in a catagory, you only are ranked by your best. This seemes the most fair (and was set by consensus in November), but I wanted to pose the question to the shooters:

Would you be more inclined to shoot a second firearm if you were eligible to hold more than one place in our competition?

I assume that the Catagories and Classes are independant, and a shooter could hold multiple spots, if they shot different configurations, but I wanted to get your input. For instance: a shooter could hold rankings in both Light Rifle and Conventional 4P. Also, I assume that a shooter have the top spot in Light Rifle in both the C and T class.

I appear to be the only person shooting more than one rifle in this little game of ours, and I'm only shooting one class/catagory, but I figured I would hang it out there and see the responses. As you can tell from the past several months, for me, it ain't the tool, it's the shooter. Either rifle, on any given day I get about the same results.

Good shooting!

23's Dad
 
#6 ·
Would you be more inclined to shoot a second firearm if you were eligible to hold more than one place in our competition?

I assume that the Catagories and Classes are independant, and a shooter could hold multiple spots, if they shot different configurations, but I wanted to get your input. For instance: a shooter could hold rankings in both Light Rifle and Conventional 4P. Also, I assume that a shooter have the top spot in Light Rifle in both the C and T class.

I appear to be the only person shooting more than one rifle in this little game of ours, and I'm only shooting one class/catagory.....

23's Dad
I have no problem with one individual holding multiple places using more than one rifle in various categories or classes. Personally I have three other rifles that I wish I had time to shoot in Light Sporter C-class, Smallbore C-class, and Light Sporter T-class. Just don't have the time, so for the time being, I focus (til the days get longer and it gets warmer) on the Smallbore T-class.
 
#5 ·
I don't really care about my ranking right now, but I did consider shooting one gun with open sights and one with the scope. I'm concentrating on the scope right now since it's easier to figure out what I'm doing right or wrong with the scope. However, in the future I might end up shooting two different guns.
 
#44 ·
Scope & Iron shooting



Hermes, You mentioned shooting 2 different guns in the future, one with scope & one without and that you are currently using one with a scope because it's easier to determine what you are doing right & wrong. I wanted to mention what I found back in the 70's shooting 4P. I shot in a local league (yea, we had them back then) that allowed scopes for all shooters. Even though I was shooting as a junior I decided to try it. I put a 16 power Weaver T-16 on my 1407 standard rifle (NRA actually still had Standard Rifle class then) and had a slight increase in my scores but then things went stagnant. What happened for me was my positions started getting sloppy because the scope would allow me to play the game of timing my shot. I switched back to iron sights and after a while my positions got more stable. I switched back to the scope and my scope scores went up a lot. After that I shot irons for most practice & when shooting the NRA qualifications, then I shot the scope for some practice and some matches, the result was my positions improved and I had fun with the scope. With that in mind, I think shooting iron sights can really help you improve your positions but the scope is sure a lot of fun.

Rich
 
#9 · (Edited)
97-4X Prone, cowboy4, KY
NRA Smallbore, T-Class, Expert
Remington 40-X, Weaver T-24, Federal Auto Match ammo,
Jewell trigger (I have no idea, but definitely under a pound)

A-17 50 ft Sunny, 58 Degrees, wind was unnoticeable.

How many times do you see seven 10s and no X count? :banghead3 :shakehead

Image
 
#10 ·
Did you gauge them?

By per our previous discussions of the smallbore rules, we'd sort of agreed that the "center shot" definition would be used to determine X counts on targets without an X ring.

See Rule 14.3.f.1 for a "Center Shot"
" Any shot hole touching the ten ring but not touching the outside edge of the nine ring with the aid of a .22 caliber plug type scoring gauge."

Therefore: I'd guess that bulls 4, 5, and 10 are X's and 2, 3, and 7 are possibles -depending on the gauge results. You may want to revise your score :bthumb:

If we start getting too many perfect scores, we can always go to Rule 14.3.g for "center shots of higher value" and only allow an X to be scored when the 10 ring is completely obliterated with the gauge.

But for me, and based on my obersations of the previous scores, we're doing okay with the more lax definition of an X

Nice shooting too!
 
#11 ·
By per our previous discussions of the smallbore rules, we'd sort of agreed that the "center shot" definition would be used to determine X counts on targets without an X ring.

See Rule 14.3.f.1 for a "Center Shot"
" Any shot hole touching the ten ring but not touching the outside edge of the nine ring with the aid of a .22 caliber plug type scoring gauge."

Therefore: I'd guess that bulls 4, 5, and 10 are X's and 2, 3, and 7 are possibles -depending on the gauge results. You may want to revise your score :bthumb:
Nice catch! I had forgotten the procedure.

You're right. 4, 5, 7, and 10 are Xs. I thought we were using the "completely obliterated" 10 ring for an X interpretation. I guess a re-read of the rules is in order. :eek:
I'll do an edit.
 
#12 ·
No worries about the multiple places thing. Unless there is money/loot on the table, everyone is welcome to whatever bragging rights they earn.

At this point, I'm using this match as practical marksmanship practice more than any e-peen measuring contest. Plus, I can still use my lack of "adequately accurate" rifles to explain away my low scores :bthumb:
 
#15 ·
354-6X Prone/Standing/Sitting/Kneeling: 96-4X, 79-0X, 90-1X, 89-1X) - timberbeast63, AR
NRA Light Rifle, C-Class, Expert class 264-5x (prone, standing and kneeling)
CZ 452 Special, Winchester SSHP ammo, BRNO Olymic sight, 2+ pound trigger
50 ft on A-32 target, overcast, 68 degrees, 1-2mph wind.

Prone:
Image

I love the two shots on target #5 -- my goal for all of my prone shots to look like that! :)

Standing:
Image


Sitting:
Image


Kneeling:
Image
 
Save
#20 ·
Today at the range, March 11th

It was predicted to be too windy for my benchrest shooting, so I brought only my light CZ Lux with the factory open sights. Wal-Mart bulk Federal Auto Match ammo. It was cool and wind was out of the North 10-15 mph. I had not shot this for a while and I shot 5 shots each at the 4 bulls on the A-31 target at 50 yards. So I guess I need to cut my scores in half so the fit with the format here. Indian River County Range has benches, so only standing and elbows on the bench. I shot one set with my elbows on the bench, a 179/200. I shot four sets of targets standing. 153/200, 143/200, 142/200 and a 169/200 for an average of 152/200.
 
#22 · (Edited)
348-4X (98-4X, 81 92, 77) - ctgmi
Smallbore, C-Class, unclassified
Remington 540 XR, CCI STD, Redfield
Modified Trigger
50-ft Indoors

Really need to work on the kneeling position, just can't seem to get my body locked.

Disregard the highlighted marker on the targets. I'm having problems with my scanner and marked it up so to scan properly.

Image


Image


Image


Image
 
#24 ·
Really need to work on the kneeling position, just can't seem to get my body locked.
Good shooting! That kneeling position is a killer for me also. The only that locks in is my right ankle and it takes a good 10 minutes to get it unlocked!
 
Save
#23 ·
A32 @ 50 ft
348-7x (91-4x,74-0x,94-3x,89-0x) SilentPea, CA (prone, offhand, sitting, kneeling)
Sharpshooter (254 subtotal = 3/3 for SS).

A32 modified @ 50ft
A32 @ 50 ft (85-0x, 22-0x, 83-1x, 68-0x)
Marksman (175 subtotal)

NRA Light Rifle, C-Class,
Ruger 10/22 in Boyds Tacticool stock, CCI Blazer, Williams peep rear w/ Lyman aperture front, Trigger stoned to ~3 lbs
mixed skies, 65 Degrees, 15mph wind from 12 and 9 o'clock
 
#25 ·
targets

hi guys
i am currently using A 32 targets will use until all gone the A 32 modifield
target that can be printed out do you use 8.5x 11 inche paper or another
size of paper and what size for the printable A 17 target.
thanks.
joe
 
#30 ·
hi guys
i am currently using A 32 targets will use until all gone the A 32 modifield
target that can be printed out do you use 8.5x 11 inche paper or another
size of paper and what size for the printable A 17 target.
thanks.
joe
Both the a32-modified and the A17 can be printed on 8.5x11 paper. I actually trimmed some of my A-32 targets down to 9x11.5, told my printer they were a euro printer paper size and printed A32-modified targets on the back.

Another good option is heavy cardstock.
 
#26 · (Edited)
338-5X cowboy4, KY
Prone: 96-3X, Offhand: 74 (ouch!!:banghead3), Sitting: 79 (ditto :banghead3),
Kneeling 89-2X :)yippee: :2p...well, its good for me :D :beerchug:)
NRA Smallbore, T-Class, Sharpshooter
Remington 40-X, Weaver T-24, SK-Standard Plus ammo,
Jewell trigger

A-17 50 ft Sunny, 59 Degrees, gusty winds, but limited as a factor.

Prone:
Image
Offhand:
Image


Sitting:
Image
Kneeling:
Image


Now that I can kneel through 20 shots, it appears that my sitting is most unstable. The materials I've found through the CMP and NRA don't get into specific enough details about how to tweak this position.
Any suggestions?
 
#28 · (Edited)
Practice Match at the Demmer Center

I went up a day early prior to the Michigan SB sectional to re-test the Kimber after I "shimmed" the main spring. Last time I tried it I must have had a half dozen FTF due to light strikes. This time only one so much much better.

347-2X (94-0X, 77-0X, 87-1X, 89-1X) - Nimrodf, IN (Prone, Offhand, Sitting, Kneeling)
NRA Conventional, C-Class,
Kimber 84G, 50ft A-17s at the MSU Demmer Center
 
#29 · (Edited)
364-8X Prone/Standing/Sitting/Kneeling: 99-6X, 85-0X, 86-0X, 94-2X) - timberbeast63, AR
NRA Light Rifle, C-Class, Expert class 278-6x (prone, standing and kneeling)
CZ 452 Special, Winchester SSHP ammo, BRNO Olymic sight, 2+ pound trigger
50 ft on A-32 target, overcast, 72 degrees, 1-3mph wind.

PRONE (99-6x):
Image


STANDING (85-0x):
Image


SITTING (86-0x):
Image


KNEELING (94-2x):
Image


It was a great day in kneeling and prone, and I had a good day in the standing position. Sitting wasn't good today. The scoring plug got me three points that I would not have awarded myself on a visual inspection of the targets. This is the first time I've shot high expert in the 3 position (missed it by two points in the 4 position) and that felt pretty good. :)
 
Save
#34 · (Edited)
Up!!!

Sorry for the delay! I've had a busy weekend, and I had alot of scores to update! I'm glad to see all the postings, and some really nice scores!

I too got a little trigger time on Saturday

312-2X (93-1, 58, 89-1, 72) - 23's Dad, CA
Smallbore, C-Class, Sharpshooter Ranked but Marksman 1st Class scored
Remington 40X, Federal Bulk ammo, Redfield Olympic rear sight, Tigersight front, Factory Trigger
50-ft Indoors, 65 degrees, Blower Downdraft in lane
I'm still waiting on that Merit aperture...stupid back-orders

324-8X (96-4, 53-1, 94-2, 81-1) - 23's Dad, CA
Smallbore, C-Class, Sharpshooter
Remington 37, Federal Bulk ammo, Remington Factory M37 rear sight, Tigersight front, Factory Trigger
50-ft Indoors, 65 degrees, Blower Downdraft in lane

I just learned the difference between a tight sling and a short sling! Using my M1907 leather sling, I was able to eliminate the horizontal bounce in my foresight during sitting by shortining the sling one notch. It's not any "tighter" on my arm, so I still avoid the pulse, but I don't have to push the rifle with my arm muscles to hold the rifle on target. It was a revelation, and my sitting scores reflected the improvement! The OH is really holding me back. I'm trying some different stuff...

Thanks for your patience on the Rattle Board.

M37:
PR
Image
OH
Image


Sit
Image
KN
Image


40X:
PR
Image
OH
Image


Sit
Image
KN
Image
 
#35 ·
Got this done a little earlier since I'm going to be in Taiwan for the next two weeks. Could use more practice. Concentrated on practicing the standing position, so haven't looked into a sling yet. Main issue there is the 25N doesn't have any attachment points, so if I'm going to continue using this rifle at some point I'm going to have to just modify the stock to make attachment points.

306-2x (90-1x, 64-0x, 80-0x, 72-1x) Hermes, CT
Light Rifle, T-Class, Marksman 1st Class (I think this set completes the qualification for that class)
Marlin 25N with Bushnell Trophy 4x32, Federal Automatch ammo
A32 modified at 50ft at indoor range




 
#36 ·
You actually scored Sharpshooter!

306-2x (90-1x, 64-0x, 80-0x, 72-1x) Hermes, CT
Light Rifle, T-Class, Marksman 1st Class (I think this set completes the qualification for that class)
By my count, you shot 226 on the Prone, OH, and Kneeling. That's Sharpshooter! For Light Rifle, you use these three positions only for classification. The sitting position is an add-on. I think you were looking at the 4P Aggregate table for your post. The 4P Aggregate is for the Conventional Smallbore Class.

You may want to get a scoring gage too. I think you left between 4 to 7 points off your score that a gage might have given you.

Enjoy Taiwan!

I'll post the updated Rattle Board on Monday, once the weekend scores are in.
 
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