Welcome aboard! Disassembly for cleaning - or any other purpose - has been discouraged in recent years by Browning. I believe the design change starting in 2001 had a lot to do with that. Even after the introduction of the modified slide in 2001 the owner's manuals remained the same for a period. The older manuals gave instructions for slide and barrel removal. I don't recall any disassembly described in the oldest manuals beyond the slide and barrel.

When the 2001 pistols came out, the firing pin assembly was changed for (I believe) ease of manufacturing. I have Buck Marks from before and after that date and can't say one is better than the other. Disassembly DOES require a different approach on the post-2000 pistols. Prior to that when it came to removing the slide, it could be pulled back enough to get the extractor clear of its groove in the breech and lifted straight up. The older firing pin assembly allowed it to flip up and disengage from the recoil post. The new design holds the firing pin rather solidly in the slide and it can't flip. To remove the slide without bending the recoil spring guide rod requires the back end of the rod to be slightly pulled forward to get it out of its hole in the recoil post. That can be done by inserting the tip of a small knife between the buffer and recoil post and prying gently.

Since the changes in the manuals came some time after the firing pin design change it is my assumption that Browning didn't anticipate problems with owners bending the recoil guide rods while following the old instructions. The simplest solution was to tell owners they shouldn't disassemble anything.

The redesign also created another issue with disassembly. I encountered some newer pistols where the recoil guide rod was too long to pry forward without first removing the barrel. They are not all like that. Before the end of the rod was clear of its hole in the recoil post it bumped into the breech.

I prefer to disassemble for cleaning. For me it makes sense to remove only the rearmost sight or optics base screw and the barrel screw. That way the sights can remain attached to the barrel as a unit and are less likely to need readjustment. Here's some info I posted you may find useful if you decide to work on the pistol:

http://chim.embarqspace.com/#

 

I prefer to disassemble for cleaning. For me it makes sense to remove only the rearmost sight or optics base screw and the barrel screw. That way the sights can remain attached to the barrel as a unit and are less likely to need readjustment.

Very good advice! I must admit, I'd never thought of this. I always take the whole sight rail off when stripping for cleaning. Thanks for that bit of wisdom!

My Buckmark is a 5.5 Slabside purchased in 1992, so I doubt the other issues you address would concern me, but thanks just as well.

-Jack

 

Thanks Chim,

I had read your pages several times already.. they are REALLY usefull !

I was just getting worried that the information in the manual from Browning wasn't consistent and I have no idea of knowing if I need to remove the barrel until I mess it up and bent the guide rod.

I would only want to remove the slide and clean that area, I have no intention to work on the trigger mechanisme. We really thought a long time before going for the buckmark as it looked hard to take apart, but the alternatives don't seem to be any better.

It sounds to me that you advise I remove the barrel anyway, actually it would be easier to clean the barrel this way. That means I have to go find the right hex key here somewhere :sad: and likely deal with the screw beeing very tight.

So do buckmarks just keep on working without ever cleaning the slide area? I'd say one must get residue in there?

Perk01

 

No gun will run forever without cleaning properly and I recommend not sticking a cleaning rod down the muzzle if you don't have to.

 

Mine don't run forever without proper cleaning. I had to drop out of a match about a month ago because I neglected to clean it and it quit running. The face of the slide and the chamber were really bad.

Some shooters "clean" their pistols by hosing them with aerosol cleaners and brushing / scraping where they can reach without disassembly. I don't think that is effective and can even blow crud into places where it doesn't belong.

The buffer material changed with the new design. I saw used pre-2001 pistols with buffers that were in pieces. My guess is the older black buffers may be more easily damaged by cleaning chemicals. I've had old buffers that were badly beaten but none that disintegrated. I attribute this to my cleaning method of not hosing them and leaving them wet with chemicals.

 

Go right ahead and take it apart it's not hard at all. I just bought one myself and field stripped,easier than field stripping a new Ruger MKIII. When you remove the barrel use a good quality 7/64" hex driver "don't try" to remove it with a small allen key. Mine was tight but it came out with little trouble. I also removed the mag disconnect which is also very easy to do by the way. It's not a good idea to clean it from the muzzle.

 

I am new to the buckmark family and to these pistols , but the way I see it , these pistols have to be cleaned up sooner or later and disassembly of the slide and firing pin , guide rod , etc is essential . You can do that easily and will have access to the main parts of the gun that need to be cleaned .
I would not remove the barrel often , or at all . It is not a necessity for cleaning and the screw is threading into aluminum , so the less the better .
I have read about a lot of buckmarks that came with the barrel screw so tight that it is impossible to loosen it , so in my brand new Hunter I used a 7/64 driver and I got it out without a hitch . The screw is embedded on a kind of anti seize grease from factory , which is great .
Now , having said that , I only wanted to find out if the screw on my gun was correctly installed and if I cut (on a emergency , barrel replacement , etc) take the barrel out .
After that , I don`t plan on touching it again , ever , if there is no need for it .
I would recommend to do the same .
Do not dry fire the pistol , either , except when using snap caps . I went to the Hardware store and bought a pack of 100 #4 drywall plastic anchors for $4.00 they work perfectly as snap caps and cost little .

 

I have to disagree with you about not removing the barrel just make sure to use some copper grease(anti sieze) when you put it back together you won't have any proplems,only my opinion though.

 

I didn't know about that type of greese, I don't have anything like that at home. Can you use regular greese to? (like the stuff used on a slide)?

I do have snap caps, but I don't dryfire the pistol on purpose. We get most our target/trigger practice by shooting air pistol (Steyr LP10's) 10m ISSF style.

The only other weird thing is that it shoots quite a bit to the right, we had to correct this with the rear sight.

It shoots like a charm, real soft and accurate once sighted in and we love it. I don't regret buying it.

and it looks real good to

Perk01

 

I didn't know about that type of greese, I don't have anything like that at home. Can you use regular greese to? (like the stuff used on a slide)?

I do have snap caps, but I don't dryfire the pistol on purpose. We get most our target/trigger practice by shooting air pistol (Steyr LP10's) 10m ISSF style.

The only other weird thing is that it shoots quite a bit to the right, we had to correct this with the rear sight.

It shoots like a charm, real soft and accurate once sighted in and we love it. I don't regret buying it.

and it looks real good to

Patrick

It will help but the proplem is you are screwing a steel set screw into an ally frame where there could be a proplem called galling. Just go easy when retightening the set screw you should have no problems.

 

I'm first going to try and find a quality hex screwdriver set, not just the small one that came with the gun.

Then I'll just give it a try and follow the instructions on Chims site, if possible without removing the barrel. I agree that loosing a metal screw in an alu fram isn't something I want to do a lot.

Patrick

 

I just purchased my first Buckmark about a month ago . I took it apart before I shot as I do with all purchases new or used . I do not however see a point in removing the barrel . The only reason I could see is to get a cleaning rod in through the breech end but I use a bore snake so no need .
Enjoy your new Buckmark ! It will serve you well .

 

Hello Perk01. Welcome to the forum! You are not alone in Europe as the only Buckmark owner. Forum member Heggis in Finland is a rather frequent poster to this forum with lots of Buckmark experience and advice.

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/member.php?u=15383

Here are a couple of excellent threads on removing the slide:

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=454907

This one has a drawing to make the simple Guide Rod Tool.

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4065227&postcount=13

As far as getting parts, Midway carries a large selection of Browning Buckmark parts and has started opening International stores. Hopefully one will be able to ship direct to you.

http://www.midwayusa.com/general.mvc/index/international_information

Nolan

 

As apposed to Chim who is a recognized expert here, I never remove the barrel. I have swapped a barrel to another style but then it stays on the gun. I remove the top plate to do my cleaning when needed. One of Chim's ideas that you may have already come across is for cleaning the chamber. He recommends bending a brass bore brush 90 degrees leaving enough of the end to fully fill the chamber. this way, you can apply your favorite cleaning solution and put the tip into the chamber. W/ the top still on, you can rotate it maybe 40 degrees back and forth to clean out the chamber. I use this technique after each range trip and take the top off maybe every third trip depending on how much I have shot the gun.My Buckmark rifle has the newer design slide etc and I agree it is a lot more effort to get it apart. You could put in a preemptive parts order so you have the parts on hand that might get bent or might fly across the room. Include a few plastic buffers too.

 

As I understand it , 22cal ammo is very dirty , more that centerfire ammo .
The rimfire pistol or rifle will need a deep clean up around the extractor , firing pin surrounds , etc in order not to have failures later on .
I don`t go to the range every week ; mostly once at month , when I bring a couple of rifles and one or two pistols , so I spend the day there ... no problem adding the Hunter and 200 rds of 22 cal ammo .
Since my shooting is not that frequent I can take off the top and access the crucial parts , taking off the extractor , firing pin , etc to clean them completely .
I`ll find the way to clean up the barrel and chamber without taking off the barrel ... that I would not do .
But I was just realizing that in order to take off the top of the Hunter , I would have to take off the red dot to get access to the front top screw and risk losing zero , but as I have done before with my AK and , as the parts are assembled again in the exact position , as a reference before I start I place the gun at 10 meters and with the laserlight on the barrel I mark exactly where both the laser and the red dot point out on the wall, so later on , after I put the red dot back in , I can make sure that the zero is the same .

 

thanks for the links. I'll study that tool a bit more, I don't really understand how it works but I guess that will become clear once I opened the gun and try it.

I'm pretty handy to make things out of wood/plastic. (I builld model planes to)

Ps, Chims webpage has disasspeared for me? 'server not found'

Patrick

 

If you use a flexible rod that pulls through, you can clean the chamber and barrel without removing the barrel and without risking damage to the crown. I use something called a patchworm on mine (and my other guns, too).

I've had my barrel off a couple of times; I don't remove it on a regular basis because there's seldom a need to, but if I ever damage the threads I'll heli-coil them. That's what manufacturers who put threads in aluminum really ought to do in the first place.

sent using CPIP (see RFC 1149)

 

well, the gun has started to have FTF now.

That started on Monday and yesterday evening I had to stop shooting cause it jammed all the time. The slide didn't close and the round was only partially chamberred.

The feed ramp looks pretty dirty so I think it's time to clean, nothing abnormal about that and it gives me a good reason to start this task I have been postponing to long.

I managed to find a set of US hex bits last week, and I will look into making that little tool later today.

wish me luck

P.

 

Have you ever cleaned the pistol ? Every time you shoot it,clean It !!!!!!!!! A dirty 22 is not a happy camper!!!!! Your posts seem to suggest to me you have never used a firearm before,please read completely a lot of what these people are telling you here it is great advice and when you are done shooting clean the pistiol "everytime" you shoot it !!!!!!!!!!!!! Good luck with shooting.

 

I tend to agree with Josey88 about barrel removal. When designing a joint that is intended to be disassembled and reassembled on a regular basis, it is not great practice to use a steel screw in aluminum threads. I consider this a design defect. I would definitely not take the barrel off for regular cleaning (for instance, weekly, or after every outing). Even if you don't have serious galling, you can have wear or deformation of the threads, and after a while the screw can start working its way loose while you are shooting. If you can disassembe the action without removing the barrel, and without bending the guide rod, then by all means do that. I can't, so I clean the chamber the best I can with solvent, a nylon brush and patches. Then occasionally take it apart to clean everything I can't reach without disassembly. When you do take the barrel off, be careful about over-torque-ing the barrel screw on reassembly. Unfortunatley, I have not been able to find any torque specification for that screw. I've been meaning to call Browning to see if I can get guidance on that.

 

You'll get carpal tunnel in your wrist before you'll wear out the threads in the aluminum frame, seriously, it's not an issue. Literally millions of products have threaded aluminum parts held together with steel screws in low stress applications like the Buckmarks barrel and sight rail screws.

As I posted before, torque the barrel screw to 25 inch lbs dry and the sight rail screws to 15 inch lbs also dry.

Nolan

 

+1 on using anti-sieze, and on cleaning the gun after every outing. The feed ramp is very easy to clean without disassembly, with Q-tips, brushes and solvent, as is the barrel face and bolt face, etc.. If you want to torque the screw, you can get a 6" long hex socket to use with an inexpensive 1/4 or 3/8 drive torque wrench that reads inch pounds. Check here for instance:

http://www.wihatools.com/700seri/771sockets.htm

Nolan- those torque specs sound reasonable. Did they come from Browning? Steel screws in aluminum are very common, as you say, but I was taught that, for a demountable joint, it was good practrice to use a helicoil or other steel insert, since galling or over-torquing could damage the joint. One could, of course, add a helicoil after the fact if the problem ever arises.

 

Nolan- those torque specs sound reasonable. Did they come from Browning? Steel screws in aluminum are very common, as you say, but I was taught that, for a demountable joint, it was good practrice to use a helicoil or other steel insert, since galling or over-torquing could damage the joint. One could, of course, add a helicoil after the fact if the problem ever arises.

No, the specs did not come from Browning, they are from industry standards.

Read the note at the end of the following torque chart. Most torque charts are for dry fasteners, lubricating the fastener will require reducing the torque. How much reduction depends on the lubrication.

http://www.federalscrewproducts.com/torque-chart.htm

Volkswagen, Harley-Davidson, Honda, Suzuki, et al have produced millions of vehicles for over half a century with steel spark plugs threading into aluminum cylinder heads. I haven't checked current production, but they are probably still threaded directly into the aluminum.

Weaver sells a very reasonably priced inch pound torque wrench.

Weaver Scope Mount Torque Wrench

A little more professional grade, but still very affordable:

http://www.wihatools.com/200seri/285vario_s.htm

Nolan

 

I also found this http://www.amazon.com/Wheeler-Firea...188-7774080-6121444?ie=UTF8&qid=1387636059&sr=8-2&keywords=torque+wrench+in+lbs
looks pretty good and is not very expensive. It did get a lot of good reviews also.

 

Not for the timid

Hello Buckmark fans,
This may cause somewhat of a comotion; but after reading many, many posts of mods to improve the performance of a well performing pistol....I decided to do a few..
1st... Heggis flip
2nd... pre-travel block similiar to the one Heggis did awhile back
3rd... cut almost 3/8" off slide spring
4th... polished the coating off the rail / underside of my slide with 400 grit / then polished with valve lapping compound...
5th....bent the ejector wire up about another 1/16" so it has a little tension to the bottom of the slide.
and last....drilled/tapped the trigger for overtravel....

I dont feel that shooting high velocity rounds seems to be beating up the buffer or gun too bad... what the heck, buffers are cheap...

All in all, almost 800 rnds later without a cleaning, besides the bolt face, breach face ....I have had zero feed/eject probs with cci mm....
I also run it close to dry as I use it mostly for small game hunting in cold weather....
This has worked out to be a very reliable pistol .... only a few hiccups BEFORE the changes and will be keeping everyone informed if anything seems to fail....

 

Hello Buckmark fans,
This may cause somewhat of a comotion; but after reading many, many posts of mods to improve the performance of a well performing pistol....I decided to do a few..
1st... Heggis flip
2nd... pre-travel block similiar to the one Heggis did awhile back
3rd... cut almost 3/8" off slide spring
4th... polished the coating off the rail / underside of my slide with 400 grit / then polished with valve lapping compound...
5th....bent the ejector wire up about another 1/16" so it has a little tension to the bottom of the slide.
and last....drilled/tapped the trigger for overtravel....

I dont feel that shooting high velocity rounds seems to be beating up the buffer or gun too bad... what the heck, buffers are cheap...

All in all, almost 800 rnds later without a cleaning, besides the bolt face, breach face ....I have had zero feed/eject probs with cci mm....
I also run it close to dry as I use it mostly for small game hunting in cold weather....
This has worked out to be a very reliable pistol .... only a few hiccups BEFORE the changes and will be keeping everyone informed if anything seems to fail....

I'm not sure what if anything this has to do with this thread? Maybe I missed something?

 

ok, so it's done... but it really didn't go as planned.

Getting the top of was easy, the screws were not set with locktide or anything, and just a bit of gentle force was enough to loosen them.

Then I tried the trick that the tool suggests. I pulled the slide back a little bit, to see the guide rod come loose from the back of the barrel. Sliding it off this way was not going to work, the guiderod was clearly stuck in that little hole in the back (throught the buffer).

Then I tried the trick with the knife, pushing the guiderod forward and prying the knife between the buffer and the stop. That felt really uncomfortable, I could barely move it and it felt like I would damage something if I pushed harder.

So I noticed that the guiderod was actually pretty loose in all this. I could lift the entire slide up quite a bit before the rod would stop the movement (again, with that little hole in the back)

Then I figured... if I could just lift the top of in such a way that I can get the whole slide to go forward without bending the rod? But no... just not enough clearance at the top of the barrel. That would bent things.

In all this, I didn't want to apply any force or pressure.

Then I noticed that the firing pin assembly actually was just sitting loose in the slide. Guess what... I just managed to lift the firing pin assembly out of the slide (while that was still on the gun) just with my fingers, no tool or force needed, and have that come forward with no effort at all. That was just enough to have the guide rod come out of that hole and slide forward.

This surely wasn't any of the ways I seen in all the internet posts or youtube video's. But well, it worked and it felt like I had to use no force, so little risk of bending anything. Did I bent it? Don't think so but time will tell.

Assembly was done the same way, actually that was a little bit more tricky. I could use a 3rd hand

I think on this gun, a boresnake would work well to. I really don't like cleaning from the front. No, I didn't take the barrel off.

Will this fix the FTF? I run some snap caps trought it and it looked ok, but I will try this evening at the firing range an let you know.

As I know you all love pictures, I took some.

notice the guide rod peek trought the buffer

yes, it's dirty

but now it looks a whole lot better

P.

 

ps, I was thinking to next time use an electric toothbrush to clean it without dissasembly. Now that I have seen the inside of the gun, I think that might work to.

P.

 

The easiest and safest method for cleaning the Buckmark without field stripping is with a manual (non-powered) double ended m16 brush, a wooden toothpick, a couple of cotton swab (Q-tips), and a bore snake or patch worm.

Lock the slide back and using a wooden toothpick (I like the thick round double ended type) scrape all the powder buildup off the barrel face, carefully use the m16 brush to clean off anything you missed with the toothpick, then finish up the barrel face, feed ramp, and frame rails with the Q-tips.

Next use the pointy end of the wooden toothpick to clean the case rim recess in the face of the slide making sure to get under the extractor, and clean any heavy build-up around the firing pin. Use the toothpick to clean off the rest of the breechface.

To avoid bending the ejector wire while using the brush, hold the slide in your left hand, release the slide stop and let the slide move forward just far enough to cover the ejector wire. While holding the slide in place, carefully brush the face of the slide to clean off anything you missed with the toothpick.

I've seen many ejector wires and guide rods that have been bent while carelessly using the brush.

Lock the slide back and use a Q-tip to finish up the slide face, and frame rails.

Use a dry bore snake or patch worm to clean the chamber.

I stopped worrying a long time ago about using solvents and trying to clean the barrel. A barrels natural state is dirty!

As far as lubrication, ask 50 shooters and you'll get 50 different recommendations.

My method is with the slide locked back, I put one very small drop of oil (I use needle oilers) on both sides of the front of the slide in the gap between the slide and the frame. Turn the gun upside down and put another small drop into the disconnector notch in the slide right behind the rear frame post. That's all.

I use two stroke motorcycle oil, ELF HTX976, or Motul 800, both are 50 weight which is nothing like thick heavy conventional 50 weight automotive oils. Two stroke oil has very good adhesion (cling), and does not leave carbon deposits.

Others here use Eezox, which may or may not be available in Europe. It works OK and is good in colder weather, but I live in California and cold here is 50 degrees, but I prefer to use either of the two oils listed above. Besides, one quart lasts for many years.

Nolan

 

thanks for the tips, I will try and avoid having to take it apart if not needed.
But I might have to do it anyway, as my wife is using it a lot.

I didn't figure out how the ejector rod works, that I need to take a closer look at.

Yesterday we tried it out at the range and had no malfunctions at all. I did greese the slide a little bit to.
It worked again like a charm, and my impression is that it actually was a lot smoother than before.

P.

 

Don't be afraid to take it apart it won't bite you I promise,you need to keep it very clean,looking at your dirty photo it is a wonder it worked at all. "DON'T"clean it from the muzzle you will ruin the crown. Good Luck with it.

 

Don't be afraid to take it apart ......................

Oh yeah? I loosened the one grip screw on mine and look what happened! Now what?