The custom shop is done? Stories such as yours incline me to say that the company as a whole is done. Waiting two years, willing to pay what? $Can5000+,and they can't get their act together? and also lie?

 

The exact price was $4023 US funds, then ad on 13% Canadian sales tax, just a few bucks I was spending!
I sat down tonight and sent an email to the new boss at the custom shop, I'll post if any response I get from Cooper. I'm not holding my breath!!
Apparently I'm not the only custom order screwed up or waiting ridiculous time for a Cooper here in Canada.
I think I'll send my money to Canyon Creek, they seem to care about there customers!

 

Speaking from more than a little experience, I highly recommend Canyon Creek.

(In the early Dan Cooper days of the company, both of my Cooper 36 models needed to go back.One went back and forth about three times,and still wasn't satisfactory.)

ps: I've sold rifles to folks in Canada. I think that a Canadian buying a gun from someone in the US has an expense of 200-300 for a US FFL to ship it over.

 

I feel your pain....Buying a 57m CC can be a very testing exercise when you're an International customer.

I did receive mine - Prchased NIB & unfired from the personal collection of a US based Cooper dealer who had commissioned a pair from Cooper Arms - US$5,000.00 which finished up at A$7,300.00 at my door. I used the action and stock as the base for another custom built locally.

Hindsight is wonderful but if I were in your shoes looking for a single shot built to my specs., I would buy one of these and have LeRoy build an optioned stock to suit.

Good luck with whatever path you choose to take from here.

http://www.champchoice.com/store/Main.aspx?p=ItemDetailOptions&item=000131

 

This comes as no surprise to me, I bought my first two "expensive" rifles from Cooper, primarily because they were built in America, both were returned to Cooper for barrels, all repair work was done in the custom shop. One of the rifles was returned 3 times, had the barrel replaced twice, each time sent back to me with impressive targets depicting the accuracy. it took in excess of 6 months to finally tell me they would build me a new rifle, it would take a week to 10 days. Months later I received the new rifle.

 

I haven't had,a problem with my early model 36 custom classic, unsure of barrel used at that time, I assume it's a Shilen, it shoots SK Standard velocity extremely well, only issue is ejection as it bounces the scope and barrel back in the action. I love this rifle so I went ahead and special order a Custom Classic 57M with all the bells and whistles a few years ago now, it took 2 years to complete, no issues with it, it's a dam target gun accuracy with SK Standard velocity. Great gun , great workmanship, it cost me around $3600 Canadian as are dollar was up in value on par with US dollar.
I love US/Canadian built guns, so I'm sad that I didn't get my special order from Cooper 😞
Those who do not live State side that have issues is a sad note in the history of Cooper Firearms!!!!

 

Sears, Toys R Us, JC Penny and now Cooper.

 

OK, I'm worried. In early September I spoke with Andrew Mason, the Cooper Customer Service Gunsmith (his title) about feeding problems with one of my Coopers. It seemed the protrusion (a technical term) at the bottom front of the bolt was not high enough to consistently catch the rim of the next round in the mag to feed it into the chamber. I had compared it to the bolts in my other Coopers and that definitely seemed to be the issue. I asked if they could replace the bolt body. Given that this would almost certainly effect head space, he said it would have to be done by/at Cooper.

He suggested that I send the whole rifle to them and I balked at that -- too costly (this was a Canyon Creek rifle so steep insurance) and risky. So we agreed that I would send him my completed barreled action and he insisted I send the trigger as well (don't know why), So off it went. He'd said a turnaround time of about two months seemed likely.

After hearing nothing by late November, I called Andrew to inquire about progress. He put me on hold to check. When he came back, he apologized and said they hadn't even started on it yet. I was stunned and disappointed. So, I asked, when might I get my rifle fixed and returned then? He said they were very busy due to hunting season and allowed as how it would probably be another two months or so!!! That would make it about now. I'll be calling Andrew later this week. If Customer Service (Repairs & Replacements) has anything to do with the Custom Shop... In any case, I find four plus months (so far) to replace a bolt body to be well short of great service. Keeping my fingers crossed. If it still hasn't been started when I next call, I think I'm going to ask to have it sent back to me, repaired or not. Like I said, I'm worried.

Doug

 

Doug, its a shame that its come to this with Cooper, while trying to get my rifles fixed I talked to everyone there at one point or another, I think Dan Cooper would have rolled over in his grave. The custom shop was where the repairs were made at that time, some 2 years ago. Its terribly frustrating to be told that they were busy building new rifles but didn't have time to take care of a customer who had already paid for their product.
Fingers crossed that your rifle will be shipped in a few more days!

 

So if they go south by Southwest, will my Coopers be Worth more money or less. Kimber anyone?

 

Lack of support (for guns that seem to need support) isn't a good thing.
However, the resale value of plenty of guns with no support, seems to hold up well enough or even climb. Doesn't sound logical, but that's the way it is.
I often surprised by the numbers paid for Kimbers, especially 82Cs.

 

This does not surprise me at all, this situation was and is SOP for all the various Cooper companies. If you play with fire (Cooper) you may get Burned! Live and learn.

PS: Anschutz makes perfect functioning and accurate rifles.

 

Not necessarily when it comes to ejection, but still my favorite and the only brand of bolt action rifle that Ive owned for the last twenty years. (and I had six Coopers pass through my hands)

I had doubts about their business model last year, when I noted that it seemed to be geared to selling $2500+ rifles with plastic stocks.(though it makes sense and dollars from their perspective.Producing quality wood stocks takes time and skilled hands)

The person who wrote that Dan Cooper would be rolling over in his grave, if he knew the current circumstances....didn't know Dan.

 

Am shocked to read this thread but glad I did. I had just made up my mind to order another Cooper (already own 5) but now that idea is dead in the water. I had to send my 17HMR back for feeding issues right after I bought it. But that was about 6-7 years ago and the rifle was fixed right and fast.
Sad situation indeed.

 

I don't know what the situation is, but it seems the eulogy for Cooper may be a bit premature, if not unfounded. I have to point out I've read similar complaints voiced here regarding Smith and Wesson, Ruger, Remington, NULA, Dakota, ANA, Volquartsen, and others. An unpleasant interaction with a single CS rep, who may have just been hired, or who was just having a bad day; or a bad egg or two in the custom shop getting canned, should not mean the end of an organization, although it may seem so when it's your rifle and thousands of dollars are involved.

The last time I talked with Cooper, which was only two weeks ago, I was told it had discontinued the M38 series of rifles. I was disappointed, so I pressed the issue and was told it was because other rifles were selling so well. This information was not volunteered; I had to drag it out of the CS rep. Another interpretation could just be growing pains as inexperienced managers focus on the more profitable activities, and I'm sure warranty repair work, or even the custom shop, are not one of those.

For the record, I really like Coopers, and I've never had a negative experience, but I have observed that people become much more vocal about their negative experiences than the positive ones, tending to skew the general impression about a company and its products...like when ANA can't fix the chronic ejection problem on Anschutz rifles .

JMO

TBR

 

I really like Cooper rifles, too, TBR. I have two Jackson Squirrels, two Custom Classics, a Western Classic, and a Canyon Creek "Jackson Extreme", and I previously owned several Model 38 and 21 Varmint Extremes, so a pretty hearty endorsement. They are beautiful and typically very accurate rifles. Having said that, after reading about a few of the recent experiences, and my current situation -- 4+ months for a still pending bolt body replacement or fix -- like I said, I'm worried. I certainly hope your assessment is on target, as it were.

Doug

 

TBR, this is just not my issue with Cooper, but the Canadian distributer for all of the country. Mine is only one of the problems with custom ordered Coopers. I know gun with special order features get forgotten on guns to Canada regularly!
. This is straight from the Canadian dealers own mouth!
TBR I love Cooper Rim Fire rifles 🙂 and I just want my gun I ordered 2 years ago, been dreaming of shooting , so I'm sad that I didn't get it
The thing is I talked to Mike Hudgins (head of Cooper custom shop) at the beginning of this project as it was a one off rifle built to my exact spec.
Be great if I got a,call from the new head honcho ,and given the opportunity to complete my order!
Being in Canada, it's nice to see what other's in the lower 48 are dealing with Cooper?
Thanks for everyone's responses 🙂 🙂
Good shooting!
Dale Zywina, Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada

 

I doubt that Canadians are singled out for production problems.This must be going on with all custom orders ..or all orders. Cooper is still a small,limited production company.Hanging titles like custom shop or custom shop manager doesn't mean much to me. It's marketing tool. At most, it's just someone working on the other side of the shop, not isolated from the general shop effort.

 

I don’t own a cooper and from reading here likely never will.
How come they don’t keep folks updated via email, phone calls.
2 months here, 4 months there. Sounds like a load of BS for a company operating in 21st century.
Not like they give their rifles away.
Where does all the money go paid for them.
They need a REAL support system.

And a good QC Dept too.
Too many problems with their high dollar rifles.
Wood btw don’t make a rifle. Sorry.
Function and accuracy do.

Don’t worry Cooper you keep dragging someone will come behind you and show you the way.

If I wanted to buy a fancy wood door stop for $2-5,000 I would just buy a stock and save some loot.

Oh yeah I can afford a Cooper. But why would I buy. Purchasers should have the red carpet rolled out for them. Don’t sound like this is the case.

 

Sell your Coopers and buy Rolex SS Sport models.....if you can even find one to buy.

 

"I don’t own a cooper and from reading here likely never will.
How come they don’t keep folks updated via email, phone calls.
2 months here, 4 months there. Sounds like a load of BS for a company operating in 21st century.
Not like they give their rifles away.
Where does all the money go paid for them.
They need a REAL support system.

And a good QC Dept too.
Too many problems with their high dollar rifles.
Wood btw don’t make a rifle. Sorry.
Function and accuracy do.

Don’t worry Cooper you keep dragging someone will come behind you and show you the way.

If I wanted to buy a fancy wood door stop for $2-5,000 I would just buy a stock and save some loot.

Oh yeah I can afford a Cooper. But why would I buy. Purchasers should have the red carpet rolled out for them. Don’t sound like this is the case."
___________________________________________________

It's not every day a person gets to witness the birth of an internet expert.

 

"I don't own a cooper and from reading here likely never will.
How come they don't keep folks updated via email, phone calls.
2 months here, 4 months there. Sounds like a load of BS for a company operating in 21st century.
Not like they give their rifles away.
Where does all the money go paid for them.
They need a REAL support system.

And a good QC Dept too.
Too many problems with their high dollar rifles.
Wood btw don't make a rifle. Sorry.
Function and accuracy do.

Don't worry Cooper you keep dragging someone will come behind you and show you the way.

If I wanted to buy a fancy wood door stop for $2-5,000 I would just buy a stock and save some loot.

Oh yeah I can afford a Cooper. But why would I buy. Purchasers should have the red carpet rolled out for them. Don't sound like this is the case."
___________________________________________________

It's not every day a person gets to witness the birth of an internet expert.

No one gets the red carpet rolled out for them. Go spend 40K on a Platinum Rolex and there's no red carpet. Want a SS Pepsi GMT that lists for $9250, be prepared to pay 5K over MSRP with no red carpet. Veblen goods.

 

I am not an internet expert.
Just a retired AF gent.
And sharing my thoughts based purely on common sense.
Like I said before, a company that drags around with shoddy service will get their number dialed in today’s world.
If a company takes folks for granted, they are indeed in big trouble.
Forums like this one expose this stuff companies do. So not so much a secret like yesteryear.

Red carpet gets rolled out by some companies. At least being open and honest is imo one aspect of the red carpet treatment.

I was in fact contemplating strongly on a new Cooper rimmie.
Not anymore. So they lost one customer, just from what I read here.

When I want service of a product I expect to get it.
So i’ll go elsewhere or keep shooting my Annie for a while longer.

 

I am not an internet expert.
Just a retired AF gent.
And sharing my thoughts based purely on common sense.
Like I said before, a company that drags around with shoddy service will get their number dialed in today's world.
If a company takes folks for granted, they are indeed in big trouble.
Forums like this one expose this stuff companies do. So not so much a secret like yesteryear.

Red carpet gets rolled out by some companies. At least being open and honest is imo one aspect of the red carpet treatment.

I was in fact contemplating strongly on a new Cooper rimmie.
Not anymore. So they lost one customer, just from what I read here.

When I want service of a product I expect to get it.
So i'll go elsewhere or keep shooting my Annie for a while longer.

Cooper most likely has sold many thousands of 57M's and I see only a few complaints. I have one and have had no problems except action screws that were not torqued to spec. Happy customer here. I think you should get a Cooper and judge for yourself and not totally base the decision on a few complaints. And it appears that Cooper is willing to make good on the rifle for zywina.

 

I got a prompt response from Laura Kelley of Cooper Firearms 🙂
One thing that was stressed is that at one time (time I ordered my rifle April 2017) Cooper did have a custom shop run by two individuals who are either nolonger there or have been let go. They have no paperwork on my order? I do have this though from them, apparently paperwork wasn't to organized in the custom shop. COOPER ALSO doesn't have a stockmaker at this time to make my singleshot custom classsic or time to do it.
The Good News:
LAURA did offer to build my rifle as a repeater!
It was a great offer, but I don't know ?
I had this rifle in my head for near 2years!
It may seem a small detail, I'll have to think about this a bit to get my head around it.
So You can buy a Cooper with options, but there is no longer a custom shop. This is great news for us that love Coppers 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

 

I'm glad to hear this, and Cooper seems anxious to remedy the situation...advantage Zywina! I wasn't even aware Cooper offered a single-shot 57M ...I'm thinking almost all potential buyers would opt for the repeater. I know you were envisioning a single shot, but I see no reason not to get the repeater. The so-called advantage of the more rigid receiver is largely theoretical, anyway. The cut out is so small, and the chamber and barrel will have much more effect on accuracy, especially on a .22 LR. While you have them at a disadvantage, I would reluctantly accept the repeater only if Cooper offers to comp you upgraded wood. I think they would do that to make you happy, and their cost on the blanks would be nominal for them.

Congrats!

TBR

 

Whoa, zywina, that is great news indeed! Your order has been resurrected from the dead. (I'd go with the repeater too. )

And TBR's suggestion to leverage a wood upgrade is a really good one. Do they not have a stock maker in the shop at all, or just one to make a stock for the single shot? If that's the case, perhaps you could get a good blank from Cooper or get full credit for the stock and have your barreled action stocked by LeRoy Barry at Canyon Creek, just down the road from Cooper. Its sounds like you'd have a wait for the stock either way, and LeRoy may well be faster. His and wife, Connie's, work is superb and he has a great selection of blanks. Just an idea.

Doug

 

While I understand your desire for a single shot, I wouldn't let the the notion of a repeater stand in my way. If I'm not mistaken, a forum member does offer a part that will convert a magazine to single shot, which would look better than using an Anschutz plastic item.
( I also don't think that it requires a top stockmaker to make a single shot 57M stock.Standard repeater inletting would work.Just need bottom metal without a magazine cut out.Perhaps the issue is with opening the barrel channel, but that's not so hard either.)
Given your investment of time, money,and emotions, and as someone who has done many custom projects, I would ask for photos of the intended blank.

 

Wow, Laura is still there. I met her years ago with Rob Behr at NJ Firearms Guild back when I was buying 2 coopers a year. Never had a problem. Even the guy running the custom shop was great when I got my bumblebee. Forget his name.

 

The TRP 57M comes as a single shot action on the TRP so I do not see why that is an issue for Cooper since they make a single shot version of the 57M.

What I do see as an issue is your specification of - "with 26"heavy weight sporter barrel", they do not make a heavy weight sporter barrel as a stock item so it would have to be a special one of a kind item which may lead to a long wait for the barrel.

Possible solution -
I had a 57M (repeater) built somewhat similar to your barrel specs though - I had an LVT contour barrel put on my 57M. The 24" LVT contour barrel starts at 1.00" and tapers to .750" at the muzzle which makes it a heavy sporter contour in my opinion.
My intended use was for smallbore silhouette, I had the barreled action fitted to a Jackson Hunter stock and the barrel channel opened up a bit but there was more than adequate room and it still looked good.

Things I learned after building mine - The LVT barrel contour was too heavy for a sporter stock configured rifle, it fit the barrel channel fine afer opening it up but the rifle was unbalanced - too much muzzle forward weight.

IMO you would be better served by the standard barrel contour which is .580 at 22". If you really want a longer barrel and more weight forward perhaps see if they could finish the standard contour barrel at 24" rather than 22".

The issue I see with your custom classic stock specified as a single shot though is that the stocks are rough turned on CNC stock machines and for the sporter stock the program is written for a repeater, not a single shot, which, if my understanding is correct, would require having a new CNC program written just for one stock.

As mentioned previously you are not giving up anything by having it made as a repeater.


drover

Additional info - when I said that there was too much forward weight that was meant as in reference to the amount of weight a person would want in a well balanced easy handling sporter - for a silhouette rifle the forward muzzle weight was good.