I hope BCA has worked out all the issues of having a blow back in 17HMR to prevent all of the issues that other manufacturers have had over the years.

I'm not holding my breath on that one, but I might grab one to play around with. Ray-Vin dropped them for a reason...HMR needs some type of delayed blowback, I'd think.

 

I agree with you both. I would be very skeptical of any 17 HMR simple upper, especially one from BCA - who as a company seems hit-or-miss on engineering and quality.

12B - There is a gent on my other thread that claims to have just received one of the still pre-order only 17 HMR uppers (an early release pre-production version, I am guessing?). Let's see what he has to say about functionality and safety after he puts a few mags through it.

 

Savage went with a delayed blow back with their A17 rifles to fix that issue. As far as I know the Savage A17 has been very successful with the delayed blow back setup.

All other manufacturers tried using heavier bolts, heavier bolt handles, and heavier springs to no avail. Same issues with the smaller 17m2 in semi auto rifles. The pressure curves are quite a bit different with the 17m2 and 17 HMR compared to the 22lr and 22 WMR.

Marlin didn't keep their M717 around long and none of the Ruger 10/22 and 10/22 Mag conversions to 17m2 or 17 HMR lasted either. They could not get the weights correct for 100% safe and reliable functioning.

 

Hey @colonelhogan44 you might want to share your wisdom with people in the following thread in the open rimfire section.

Bear Creek Arsenal - can you trust them? Faked reviews?

 

I wrote about this in your other thread but I asked BCA to cancel my order for the 16” parkerized version because I ordered the 20” SS but instead they expedited it. If I see the refund hit my account then I’ll take this to the backyard range and see how it does.

 

I ended up returning the 16” Parkerized Barrel version and ordered the 20” 416R SS. I just got the shipping notification so I think I’m going to be one of the first to receive the upper. Here is where I need some advice…

Background info first. I shoot very little (one rifle probably 100 rounds per month) but am an engineer so I just love trying new firearms and tinkering. I’d like to use this for squirrel and rabbit hunting in the fall when shots extend past the range of my t-bolt 22lr. I don’t see much practical use in 17hmr for high volume shooting but I have AR’s in 22lr, 22WMR, 9mm, 223, 300BLK, and 308 so I see this as the last AR I would get for a while. I’m familiar with the issues with blowback 17hmr rifles but I assume I can return it if it gets dangerous to shoot. Should I give it a shot or…

I have my eye on an Anchutz 1517 HB $875 (used and not much info on it, see classifieds), a CZ 453 (basically new $750 also in classifieds), CS 452 (new $700, see classifieds) a new Bergara BXR ($500 plus fees), and a Tikka T1x ($560 plus fees). I’m leaning toward returning the BCA and getting the BXR.

If anyone has any advice, it would be greatly appreciated.

 

I would stick with a bolt action in 17HMR simply ue to the issues with any semi-auto that uses a straight blow back system such as the BCA upper does. Again Ruger and Marlin tried a straight blow back system an it did not work for either company.

 

A Friend has a Savage A-17 I’ve shot. It is reliable but the accuracy is ok but not as good as our 17 HMR bolt action Savage. I hope the BCA produces a reliable accurate 17 HMR but with their past record I’m going let others do the testing.

I really like my heavy barrel Savage and the bolt action satisfies my uses for the 17 HMR.

 

One thing that makes the Savage A22 both safe and reliable is the fact that it uses a delayed blow back system.

I definitely would not use a straight blow back system especially if you shoot left hand. Either way it is very hard to get the 17m2 or 17HMR to run reliably without case rupture issues in a straight blow back system.

 

I returned the 20" upper to BCA because I didn't feel I could trust the blowback system, especially after I just had to return my 22LR upper because of the out of spec extractor cut. I went with a Howa M1100 with the walnut stock. $489 out the door. 2 stage trigger, polygonal rifling, and built in Japan were the main reasons.

 

I got a 16" nitride version yesterday, set it up with a low powered variable scope and mated it to a billet lower with Rock River Varmint trigger and a modified BCA buffer with standard carbine recoil spring (same setup I'm using with their .22 WMR upper).

I have several blow-back 17HMR semi-autos: Alexander Arms; Volquartsen and Remington. I've not had any major issues with any of them, and so I don't fear the reaper with this one either. I also have a Garrow .17 HMR, and it has a delayed recoil setup (spring loaded balls on either side of bolt carrier) but it has a really light weight bolt carrier.

I'm currently at four blow-back semi-autos in .17 Mach 2, all of which are based on 10/22 receivers with Volquartsen heavy bolts. One is a factory rifle from VQ, the others have barrels from Beyer, Majestic, and Sarco. Again, I don't have issues with any of them, and have no fear of shooting them.

YMMV, of course.

 

Let us know how your BCA 17 HMR shoots 9x19! I’m spoiled the Savage 17 HMR’s I’ve shot are really good. I have a heavy varmint barrel Savage 17 HMR that has seen a good bit of use eliminating nuisance critters. Those semi auto 17 HMR’s could burn a lot of ammo on a prairie dog town. I had a lot of fun shooting PD in Wyoming with a 17 HMR bolt action.

 

Range time (finally) today.

The .17 HMR upper is a keeper. Only ran Hornady 17gr VMax thru it today, but had no failures of any kind, and fired brass was 'normal' as well. Ran it with the modified buffer and standard carbine spring, straight to the side ejection, cases landed about 3 ft out.

Accuracy was really good, and it actually made me look like a better shot than usual.

My 14yo grand son and I had fun with it and we both came home with all our fingers and eyes intact!

 

But how does it run with the buffer and spring that comes with the upper?

The reason I ask is for the fact that not everyone reads forums or will make modifications to make this upper run safely like you did. And yes there is a safety issue with any blow back rifle chambered in 17m2 or 17HMR if the bolt and/or buffer weights and springs are not 100% correct.

 

No proof, but I suspect it will run fine. All three of my .22 WMRs did, but they are also running fine with the heavier buffer and standard spring, so I didn't bother.

 

Well 22WRM (and 22LR)definitely has a different pressure curve than 17HMR. And it is the pressure curve that causes the issues with 17m2 and 17HMR in straight blow back rifles.

Yes a blow back in 17HMR can be made to run safely and reliably but most manufacturers gave up on the idea since it was difficult to make them run correctly. And it is also why Savage uses a delayed blow back system in their A17 series rifles.

We can look at all the issued @colonelhogan44 and others had trying to get their AR's to run with their 17m2 barrels.

 

Thank you, for your concern.

 

Back to the range this morning, plugged in an un-modified Bear Creek buffer and spring, and ran three mags thru the gun without an issue, although ejection was noticeably stronger with that setup.

Put the weighted buffer back in with a standard carbine spring and still runs fine, seemed to have a wee bit less recoil, but that could also be attributed to just being used to it after the first three mags.

 

I would go as heavy as you can with the buffer setup and bolt and still have the rifle function reliably. You definitely do not want any OOB issues.

 

I got the BCA .17 (16" upper) as a complete rifle from BCA. It is a PSA PS-15 lower. My BCA has not been great so far - but I've only used Federal Hornady V-Max Poly tip and CCI TNT Jacketed Hollows.

Out of around 100 Federal rounds, 20-25 had puffed cases and/or didn't eject properly.
Out of 50 CCI, I'd say 10-15 had the same issue but noticeably less damage to the casings and they seemed to eject better. There did seem to be more carbon on the exterior of the cases, however.

The rifle did come with one mag, but please note it is nearly impossible to find standard AR style mags for 17 HMR. The included mag is from Black Dog Arms and is their .22 WMR style (only available in 10-rounds), and the only issue is that the 'spring follower' inside is plastic - and the bolt catch sits forward of the mag. When the mag is empty the bcg will slam into the 'spring follower' inside the mag rather than the bolt catch. I am not a fan of this because once the mag is removed, the bolt goes all the way to the chamber as if a round is being cycled. Essentially, the only use for the bolt catch is when you're at a range and they have you lock your bolt open.

I messed with the buffer spring a little because I noticed that sometimes the bcg does not push forward enough for the ejector to catch on a round when chambered. Only once I had the issue where it caught an ejected case while chambering another round.

Installed is a Franklin C-Binary AR-15 trigger with all the light springs, I should have tried it before the trigger change but I just assumed there would be no issue.

I will be taking it out today and can provide more updates if needed - I am thinking it is just a buffer spring issue. I'll be trying out the Federal .17 SPEER rounds and Hornady 15.5 poly tip V-Max as well.

As a newbie this thing is VERY fun and easy to shoot (when it works) and I cannot wait to get it out more.


EDIT: I did not know the .17 Mach2/HMR blow-back issue with other semi-auto firearms existed. I should note that not once did the rifle fire because the bcg hit it too hard (I know that is only one of the issues).

 

If BCA is using the same buffer and spring in the .17 that they supply with the .22 Magnum, they're both too light. I have the .22 and while it does work with the supplied parts, I've found it to work much better with a heavier buffer and stronger spring. A regular AR15 carbine spring will do the job, but I found the Tubb lightweight(.300 BO) spring to be better for me. I'm running an A2 rifle stock with a 5.8 oz. rifle buffer, the Tubb spring, and a 1-1/2" Delrin spacer to limit bcg travel to the correct distance. This combination is the softest shooting .22 in my stable, including all the .22LRs. This thing works with any ammo I can find. If I get a .17, this is the setup I'm trying.

A heavier setup will probably take care of your bulged case problems. You could increase the weight of the BCA buffer to keep the carbine buffer tube by installing/changing weights. I did that originally, but wanted to run a rifle/fixed stock.

 

I don't think I would trust PLA to stand up to the constant shock inside the buffer tube. The preferred materials for buffers is usually nylon. Delrin would work just fine for a spacer though. Delrin is harder and more brittle than nylon. When it comes to the different polymers, too soft or to hard and it just won't last long under stress.

 

If BCA would have went with a delayed blow back system like what Savage uses in their A17 series rifles, then you all would not be having issues or have to play with spring weights, buffer weights, and shims.

Years ago people who bought semi autos chambered in 17m2 and 17HMR by other manufacturers went through the same things. And this is why most manufacturers gave up on semi auto 17m2 and 17HMR rifles. The pressure curves of 17m2 and 17HMR are a lot different than 22LR and 22WMR which makes the 17 caliber semi auto rifles harder to get running reliably without any OOB issues, case ruptures, or extraction issues

I wish all of you that bought the BCA 17HMR upper the best of luck with them. But as a left handed shooter I will never shoot or own one.

 

I was having issues with my 17 upper. It was causing the hammer to get caught in front of the bolt. I remember hearing of a trick. I put a quarter at the bottom of the buffer tube, then inserted the spring and buffer. I have not had an issue of any kind since. I am still using the spring and buffer supplied with the upper.

 

You can add weights to the BCA-issued buffer, I used 3 steel and one tungsten in each of mine. I use them with a standard carbine spring. I have two pistol (SBR) uppers in .22WMR and carbine uppers in .17HMR and .22WMR.

 

Where do you buy your weights from? The recoil from this .17 hmr upper is a lot more harsh than I would expect from such a puny round. I wonder if a heavier buffer might help?

 

I just got my BCA .17 HMR upper (20" stainless steel). Just waiting on some ammo I ordered. Took a photo of the included buffer & spring (top) compared to what was in my lower.

 

That's the same buffer and spring that BCA supplies with the .22 Magnum conversion. Both are too light for the .22 and are assuredly too light for the .17. I will admit that the supplied pieces did work with the .22, with only occasional bulging of the brass, but worked much better with different parts

Let us know your experience when you've done some shooting.

 

Both the upper and some ammo arrived this afternoon. I cleaned the bore with two wet patches (Ballistol) and two dry patches. I mated it to a PSA lower, then mounted a scope and pic rail for a bipod, then shot 40 rounds in my backyard range (50 yds). I spent about 10 rounds adjusting the scope and then 10 rounds each with CCI, Remmington, and Hornady 17 grain ammo. I hadn't planned on shooting for accuracy, but even with 15-25 mph wind from my 4-6 o'clock, I had single hole groups with all three ammos. Not a single hiccup or cycling issue. After I was done I collected my brass and inspected each and every one. I didn't find any split necks, and out of 40 casings I found 5 that had puffed ends: 2 Remmingtons, 2 Hornady's and 1 CCI. I would say that the only thing I didn't like was the "boing" noise from the buffer spring. I think with a lighter trigger this thing could be my most accurate rifle.

 

Just out of curiosity, how far were the fired casings being ejected?

 

I couldn't say, there's a wall about 3 feet to my right that the casings bounce off of.