RPF sir welcome to RFC...

Signalman

 

I have no experience with a Skinner, but I HAVE had success with a Redfield International rear sight on a Savage-Anschutz to Redfield 1411 Adapter (Champions Choice has a similar adapter) paired with an Anschutz front globe that is simply clamped to the front sight ramp. Apologies for the non-quality cell phone photos.

 

I have no experience with a Skinner, but I HAVE had success with a Redfield Olympic rear sight on a Savage-Anschutz to Redfield 1411 Adapter (Champions Choice has a similar adapter) paired with an Anschutz front globe that is simply clamped to the front sight ramp. Apologies for the non-quality cell phone photos.

+1

 

Welcome Aboard RPF! Great info here. I'll let those more knowledgeable than me help you with your info request.

 

Interesting alternative

Thanks for the info and the photos. Maybe a little to wonky for me, but we'll see.

I did call Williams to ask if the FP-CZ without target knobs would allow the 457 bolt to clear. Of course, I got their voice mail and then missed the return call. However, the caller left a voice mail for me suggesting that I look a the FP-AG and FP-GR, both clamp-on units, but didn't claim that they would work on the 457.

The FP-GR unit, available with or without target knobs, looks identical to the FP-CZ, but with more (too much to clear the 457 stock?) vertical adjustment. I'm not sure what the top screw on either of these is for unless it's an additional source of clamping force. Or, are the CZ receivers drilled and tapped for a scope in addition to being grooved? (I obviously have not yet purchased a 457 or I would know this).

The FP-AG, also available with or without target knobs, is very different in that it lacks the top screw and the adjustment mechanism is on top of the mounting plate rather than being integral with it, thus appearing to sit well above the receiver. Indeed, Williams lists the lowest adjustment for the FP-GR as 0.350" and for the FP-AG as 0.450". Might call for different front sight?

I'll try and connect with someone at Williams in the next few days and see if they can confidently say if either of these sights, with or without knobs, will work on the 457. Sort of doubt they know. You'd think they could afford to buy the least expensive version of the 457 to verify the fit of their products. Might actually lead to some sales......

 

I had a rear sight off of a Kimber 82G on my 452. Clearance was a problem and I had to run it a little farther forward than I liked but it worked. A 457 might have more bolt clearance IF you have access to one. Fortunately I do. An Annie sight should clamp right to the rail also.

 

I contacted Williams a couple months ago with the question of mounting their sights on a 457. Person I spoke with wasn’t sure, but it didn’t sound promising and I know the CZ williams sight doesn’t clear the bolt handle on the 457 (I tried it).

The Skinner works in the 457; I purchased a Lux with a Skinner installed by the original owner. Stock front sight installed. I haven’t had it to the range yet.

 

Was the Williams sight you tried the FP-CZ? Did it have target knobs? If so, was the interference only with the windage knob or with the body of the sight itself?

 

Yes, the Williams site sold by CZ with the target knobs. Interference was the body of the sight IIRC. I will try to check it again and report back shortly.

 

Yes, the body has interferes on the Williams if you want to mount it on the rear dovetail.

 

The Skinner, with a different design clears the bolt.

 

I use the Williams on a couple of 452s and really like them. Was disappointed the Williams wouldn’t work on the 457. I have a couple Skinners on other rifles and like them also. I haven’t fired the 457 yet with the Skinner mounted.

 

Thanks aasbra - your pictures are just what I needed to see. Looks like all current versions of the Williams FP series are not going go work on the 457.

The Skinner looks great. Their web site states that they are "adjustable for windage and elevation". Is this a micrometer click adjustment or a merely a friction fit? Hard to see from their photos or yours how any lateral movement of the aperture (windage adjustment), is possible.

Hope to read soon how the stock front sight works with, say, a 50 yard sight-in on your 457.

Thanks again for essentially answering my question.

 

Looks like all current versions of the Williams FP series are not going go work on the 457.

That is essentially the conclusion I came to after talking with the rep at Williams.

 

No micrometer in the Skinner, just some set screws to hold the position once you have it set for the windage. Elevation adjusted by screwing the aperture, so not as precise adjustments as the micrometer type.

If you are changing loads and distances, you may desire the micrometer adjustments, but if mainly shooting one load and distance on a given rifle (mainly what I do), I don’t find that I need to make adjustments often.

 

eagle0199's solution to this problem is looking more promising.

I suppose this is the correct adapter:

http://champchoice.com/store/Main.aspx?p=ItemDetailOptions&item=6709

However, it's still listed as out of stock.

 

eagle0199's solution to this problem is looking more promising.

I suppose this is the correct adapter:

http://champchoice.com/store/Main.aspx?p=ItemDetailOptions&item=6709

It is still listed as out of stock.

However, for casual target shooting and pest control I'll probably go with the Skinner.

 

oops. Sorry for double post.

 

aasbra sir thank you for helping out great job with the information and pictures. :bthumb:

Signalman

 

Switching gears a bit - what about the Williams WRGS-54?

https://williamsgunsight.com/product/williams-wgrs-54/

 

Williams

Some time back I contacted Williams by phone and email. Crickets! All you guys must know the password to get responses. Sent and email to Skinner and 90 sec. later I heard back that yes, their sight was good with the 457. Aasbra, yes, thank you for those photos, but will you go shoot that thing and report back...please!

 

Some time back I contacted Williams by phone and email. Crickets! All you guys must know the password to get responses. Sent and email to Skinner and 90 sec. later I heard back that yes, their sight was good with the 457. Aasbra, yes, thank you for those photos, but will you go shoot that thing and report back...please!

I will try to, but a busy schedule recently has kept me from getting out to the range. I know the front sight on my 457 Scout is adjustable for height, not sure about the 457 Lux.

Actually thinking I will mount the Skinner on the 457 Scout, as I like the tangent rear sight on the Lux pretty well.

 

I did end up installing the Skinner on my 457 Scout. Had it out to the range today. Works great; I didn’t even adjust the front sight height and it was still close to zeroed, as I was hitting steel gongs at 50 yards. The aperture is kind of large compared to my other peep sights, but it allows quick target acquisition.


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I don't have any individual photos but there's the Williams on my 452 Ultra lux. I have no issues.

 

Yeah, well, you don't have any issues because it's a 452, not a 457.

 

Please accept my apologies.

 

Gave up

I called Williams and got a couple of "within 24 hours" replies in my voice mail when I was, unfortunately, unavaliable.

Then, on a third call from Williams, I was connected with Brian, in customer support, and he had a long chat with me, confirming that their current FP series wouldn't work of a 457, and he volunteered to get a 457 from their arms room and see if a WGRS wound fit the receiver grooves. I got this reply the next day:

"Still needed to take about another thousandth off each side for fitting but it should clear the bolt very well.

(Can't seem to figure out how to insert picture from email showing WGRS half way onto the grooves of a 457).

Sight specs with peep are Lowest elevation .3792" , highest elevation ..4798" (relative to mounting surface)"

BTW, on many occasions, I've found email to customer support to be futile but that with a little persistence you get to talk with someone on the phone.

In frustration, I ended up buying a Ruger American Rimfire model 8328 which comes with a Williams FP Target series installed. It's mounted a little far forward for my tastes but I have a scheme to fix that if it really bothers me. Rifle hasn't arrived at my FFL yet....

 

Don't have any 457...... I'm stuck in the 452 453 guns.

But I've used several Skinner sights on other rifles ; they make a nice good quality product.

 

In case the skinner sight requires a different height to the front sight, is the front sight removabl? If so ,is it a dovetail or screw attachment?