[MattJones]

G'day Guys,

I'm brand new so please accept my apologies in advance if I've posted this in the wrong place.

I know that in some forums people can get a bit annoyed if new guys don't use the search feature so I've done a thorough search and read all the existing threads on the MkIV and the Victory, also checked out the 22plinkster comparisons and other online reviews.

What I am hoping is that some folks may have some new insights or guidance as to the pros and cons of each gun.

I'm a member of a couple of gun clubs here in Australia and I currently spend much of my time on the square indoor range at one club and a bit of IPSC at the other. I'd also love to try Steel Challenge one day.

My indoor club has lots of competitions for both centrefire and 22lr and my IPSC club even has a monthly 22lr IPSC comp. I am dead keen to get a gun that will be great for all of the above. I currently only shoot 9mm and I am brand new to rimfire.

From what I can tell the Ruger MkIV and the S&W Victory appear to be the two best options for me. I plan to shoot iron sights and although I'd love something that runs beautifully and accurately straight out of the box I am perfectly happy to do a bit of tweaking with aftermarket parts if the juice will be worth the squeeze.

I've seen a thread where a bloke had a bit of slop in the Ruger MkIV, Ruger worked on it and improved it but there was a still little there. I've also seen a great deal of talk about the takedown screw issues on the Victory.

Does anyone have any thoughts or guidance they could please share? Accuracy and reliability are both really important but I guess those aren't exactly unique demands from a shooter.

Thank you in advance to anyone who can shed some light.

 

[fourbore]

I prefer the ergonomics of the Ruger and that includes the grip angle and in my case I have a longer barrel with longer sight radius. It suits me better for target shooting. I actually dont mind taking a relatively large gun out in the woods, but; I dont do a lot of that. I also have a much smaller pocket 22 revolver, for true ease of carry. I dont carry that much either.

You mention customizing, the S&W is new and not too much available. The Ruger is older than me! And, very popular with a lot of aftermarket. The MK IV parts may all be a little different from the III. The suppliers have already made the changes to support the new model. All the ruger needs is the trigger/cutout kit. If you are really into it then grips.

I was planning to get a Victory. After handling the victory I decided to wait. The Mk IV came out and that was the end of that. I dont have a Mk IV yet. I do have I and III, the IV is IMHO better.

You might want to handle a s&W model 41. Perhaps the model with the longer barrel. It has a good trigger and comfortable grips. I prefer the feel and cost of the Ruger. S&W 41 is a serious gun for serious money,but; if you might keep that one bone stock and be happy. I did not like the grip angle. Excellent rigger. Keeping my Mk III stock that was a big cost savings. Money I saved might go for a Mk IV later.

 

[fourbore]

One more thought, I would suggest you wait for the M IV competition target with the longer slab side barrel, better grips proper sights. You still will want the trigger kit.

 

[MattJones]

Hi Fourbore,

Thank you for your reply, I really appreciate your insights.

You mentioned grip angle and that is a really good point!

For 9mm I shoot Glocks, almost everyone here thinks I'm a little crazy because there are very few of us over here that use Glocks for competition but they seem to work well for me. I especially like the grip angle of the Glock! The Glock 17 and the Glock 34 shoot great for me for both indoor target shooting and for IPSC.

If you happen to have any further insight as to which 22r most closely approximates the infamous Glock grip angle then that could be an important consideration for me.

Thank you again mate,

Matt

 

[flangster]

I think it is a little like buying a pair of boots. You have to go with what feels comfortable. If you are an experienced shooter, you probably already have preferences for grip feel, finger placement on your trigger, sight picture and so on. Put your hands on both and see what seems natural. What others have said about Ruger having good aftermarket support is true. And I have several Rugers (Mk II's, 22/45 Mk III) and like them very much. What caught my eye about the Victory was the VQ barrel for it, though. That would be an interesting addition.

 

[MattJones]

Thanks Flangster,

You make great points too.

Re the VQ barrel: I shoot iron sights and as far as I've seen VQ doesn't have a barrel with sights at the moment so their barrels are out for me until the make some easy iron sight options.

As far existing preferences, I love my Glocks and I've been really pleased with the accuracy I'm getting out of them even in stock form. That grip angle is definitely a good fit for me.

 

[flphotog]

One more thought, I would suggest you wait for the M IV competition target with the longer slab side barrel, better grips proper sights. You still will want the trigger kit.

That isn't true for everyone. I have the mark iv target because I didn't want the longer barrel, I have a buckmark hunter with the 7.25" barrel and find that the longer barrel isn't always a good thing and it really doesn't contribute to accuracy. As for the "better grips" again not true for everyone. I put a set of wrap around grips from Altamont on the target and my accuracy suffered, so I sold them and will wait for Altamont to come out with the panel grips as they say they will be at some point.
Just saying, what you like/want isn't true for everyone.

 

[TJNA]

I imagine most replies here would be pro Ruger. You would be wise asking the same question on a SW Victory thread.
My 2¢ worth...After market option for the Ruger outweigh those for the Victory.
Good luck!

 

[22/45 Fan]

That "loose MkIV" report has gotten more traction than it deserves. It was a rare occurrence. My MkIV is completely tight and is, by far, more typical.

That said, the Ruger Mk-series guns have established a tremendous track record for durability, dependability and accuracy and also have spawned an entire cottage industry in after market parts. The S&W may turn out to be a fine gun but it's a bit early to tell.

 

[frozen]

It seem that you will be shooting fast and moving around with your type of shooting sports ,,, I would highly recommend a 22/45 lite ,, that is what I shoot for my rimfire steel challenge and glock 34 for centerfire , that's what been working for me

 

[bdickers]

Having owned both pistols and still owner of the Ruger MK IV, I have to say that the only real difference for me is the sights, which for me are better on the Victory, but, it's purely a personal preference. If possible, I'd suggest getting your hands on both and see what fits you best. They are both highly reliable and well built with equal accuracy in my experience.

 

[fourbore]

That isn't true for everyone. I have the mark iv target because I didn't want the longer barrel, I have a buckmark hunter with the 7.25" barrel and find that the longer barrel isn't always a good thing and it really doesn't contribute to accuracy. As for the "better grips" again not true for everyone. I put a set of wrap around grips from Altamont on the target and my accuracy suffered, so I sold them and will wait for Altamont to come out with the panel grips as they say they will be at some point.
Just saying, what you like/want isn't true for everyone.

I agree with that, points well taken. And, here again, Ruger offers options in both grip frames and barrel lengths - while the Victory is only one frame and barrel (as far as I know). Not much for Victory in grips yet either.

 

[donnieboy]

Matt, I own Browning Buckmarks, 2 Ruger MK4 Targets, a S&W Victory and have owned S&W41s in the past.
The 41 is in a league by itself so does not belong in this conversation.
The Buckmarks, MK4s and the Victory are all good pistols as far as accuracy and reliability with ammo they like.
If I were to consider buying a popular priced 22 pistol tomorrow it would be a Ruger MK4 for the following reasons:
In your case its grip angle will be closer to your Glocks.
After market improvement kits (trigger and rear sights) are available and you will want both eventually. Both my MK4s had Lawyer triggers that Volquartsen kits turned into fine triggers. I also was not pleased with the lateral play in the rear sight blade and that was replaced with Volquartsen's fine rear sight.
Both my MK4s lock up dead tight with no play. Ruger did have a tolerance issue early on with the slide stop pin but they recalled some of those for corrective action and I feel they have taken corrective action internally. Certainly, the new MK4 disassembly method is a huge step forward. Having shot various model Ruger MK pistols for probably 40 years, I will tell you that you will be hard pressed to wear one out with proper care.I would consider the Stainless Target MK4. The 22/45s are neat but if your pistol will see lots of use,go with steel. In any case every Ruger firearm, rifle or pistol are over engineered for durability and ruggedness. Oh, and one other feature of the Ruger, when you disassemble it for cleaning the sights stay zeroed because they are firmly attached to the barrel /receiver assembly.

 

[paukotajs]

One more thought, I would suggest you wait for the M IV competition target with the longer slab side barrel, better grips proper sights. You still will want the trigger kit.

Do you have any information about the competition target? I haven't seen anything online about a different version of the m IV other than (hunter, target, lite). I am in the same boat as OP and looking to buy one for competition. I would hate to buy one, and then Ruger releases a newer version soon after.

Reading your post made me think that there is a different version than the target. Like a Competition target. Is there such a thing?
*Edited to be more clear.

 

[22/45 Fan]

I also was not pleased with the lateral play in the rear sight blade and that was replaced with Volquartsen's fine rear sight.

Pardon the thread drift but the rear sight on my MKIV also has a slight bit of play and I was wondering how you remove it to either fit a replacement or add a Picatinny rail that requires it's removal?

I notice a small screw to the left of the elevation screw. Is it a set screw and does it have to be loosened or removed to drift the sight out of its dovetail?

The OEM rear sight isn't a big issue since I have added a Red Dot to the gun but was wondering how it is removed.

 

[fourbore]

Do you have any information about the competition target? I haven't seen anything online about a different version of the m IV other than (hunter, target, lite). I am in the same boat as OP and looking to buy one for competition. I would hate to buy one, and then Ruger releases a newer version soon after.

Reading your post made me think that there is a different version than the target. Like a Competition target. Is there such a thing?
*Edited to be more clear.

Yes, they made a special edit of the competition and I am certain that Ruger will get around to making the competition without the barrel engraving, special knife and fancy packaging. These 'normal' competition should retail for about the same as a hunter.

Here is the fancy comp:

http://www.ruger.com/products/markIVCompetition/specSheets/40108.html

I have one of these, a Mk III competition target and I really like it.

All the stainless Mk IV models are all spec'ed the same, but; I suspect a little more QC goes in the competition. The grips have a thumb rest (right handed). The balance is pretty good with the slab side cuts.

Obviously some will prefer a shorter barrel and if an optic is mounted the sight radius buys you nothing.

 

[donnieboy]

Do you have any information about the competition target? I haven't seen anything online about a different version of the m IV other than (hunter, target, lite). I am in the same boat as OP and looking to buy one for competition. I would hate to buy one, and then Ruger releases a newer version soon after.

Reading your post made me think that there is a different version than the target. Like a Competition target. Is there such a thing?
*Edited to be more clear.

As you know,Gallery Of Guns had Ruger make 1,000 WBR 100th anniversary MK4 stainless competition units. These may already be spoken for but I would expect Ruger to introduce this model without thr 100th anniversary marking.

 

[donnieboy]

Pardon the thread drift but the rear sight on my MKIV also has a slight bit of play and I was wondering how you remove it to either fit a replacement or add a Picatinny rail that requires it's removal?

I notice a small screw to the left of the elevation screw. Is it a set screw and does it have to be loosened or removed to drift the sight out of its dovetail?

The OEM rear sight isn't a big issue since I have added a Red Dot to the gun but was wondering how it is removed.

Loosen the locking screw you see on the left and using a short length of either a hardwood dowel or nylon rod and drive the original sight out to the right.

 

[22/45 Fan]

Loosen the locking screw you see on the left and using a short length of either a hardwood dowel or nylon rod and drive the original sight out to the right.

Thanks for the help. The owner's manual does not show that set screw in the parts diagram. Then again, my MkIV manual has several errors in the exploded views that I hope Ruger has corrected by now.

 

[MattJones]

Thank you very much for all your helpful replies guys, I really appreciate it.

I've placed my order and ended up going with the S&W Victory because the supplier said that the MkIV is was out of stock and that it could be a while before they get here. I also liked the idea of the option for threaded barrel with the Victory.

Thank you again for your time, happy shooting!