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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm watching a CZ 452 Varmint as a potential addition to my hoard...I mean collection.

I noticed something reddish color in the picture of the muzzle and I contacted the seller about it. The seller briefly responded "copper fouling" and thanked me for my interest. I can't say that I've ever actually seen copper fouling before.

I know there are experts in addition to enablers here. Could you take a look at the muzzle and tell me if that truly could be copper fouling. Or is it rust or some other crud?

There's a nice 452 Varmint listed in the classifieds here as well, but it has some discoloration on the muzzle end of the barrel. I'm thinking I may be able to pick the pictured one up for $150 or less than the one in the classifieds.

Bumper Bicycle part Cylinder Gas Rim
 

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I'm watching a CZ 452 Varmint as a potential addition to my hoard...I mean collection.

I noticed something reddish color in the picture of the muzzle and I contacted the seller about it. The seller briefly responded "copper fouling" and thanked me for my interest. I can't say that I've ever actually seen copper fouling before.

I know there are experts in addition to enablers here. Could you take a look at the muzzle and tell me if that truly could be copper fouling. Or is it rust or some other crud?

There's a nice 452 Varmint listed in the classifieds here as well, but it has some discoloration on the muzzle end of the barrel. I'm thinking I may be able to pick the pictured one up for $150 or less than the one in the classifieds.

View attachment 305197
Wont be copper fouling. 22LR wont get hot enough to make it happen.

It is an interesting little spot though. I would be leaning towards maybe some orange/red colored fiber from a cleaning rag.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Wont be copper fouling. 22LR wont get hot enough to make it happen.

It is an interesting little spot though. I would be leaning towards maybe some orange/red colored fiber from a cleaning rag.
Thats what I thought it might be but the seller said it is copper fouling. Kind of makes me hesitant on the rifle.
 

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Looks like debris of some kind to me as well. More red or orange looking than rust as I zoomed in.
Doesn't seem like the current owner galled up the crown. Appears sharp with all bluing intact.
There's a lot of folks out there that know just enough to get in trouble. Calling that copper fouling may make that individual a bit out of the know, but it doesn't mean he/she didn't take good care of that rifle. It may be a fantastic acquisition for you.
Best of luck!
 

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Yeah. That's not what copper fouling looks like, in my experience. More like a coppery smear. And as someone said here, you aren't likely to get it at .22 lr speeds and pressures. A bit of surface rust, is my guess. Clean that rifle when you get it using your standard method and the take it to the range and shoot it. Problem solved.

P.s. I say this because I think you'd see freckling and exterior rust on the bluing if it has really been stored in poor conditions.
 

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lf the seller was smart why not just do a good bore cleaning and add a new picture, if l took that picture and saw that in the picture l would reclean the bore. lf that was copper it would be green.
 

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Was it priced right? and were you looking to buy it? l had 22s from the 30s bores had some pitting rifling was good at the crown and crown was very good the bullet left the barrel with a good impression it hit its mark at 50yrds.

Too bad the picture is so poor blowing it up makes it look worse hard to tell what is going on at the muzzle.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Was it priced right? and were you looking to buy it? l had 22s from the 30s bores had some pitting rifling was good at the crown and crown was very good the bullet left the barrel with a good impression it hit its mark at 50yrds.

Too bad the picture is so poor blowing it up makes it look worse hard to tell what is going on at the muzzle.
It's on Gunbroker. No current bids as of earlier today. $565 starting bid. $35 shipping. Plus tax. I believe the "buy now" price is $690. I was contemplating bidding toward the end of the auction. But the seller's response regarding the reddish stuff in the barrel kind of has me turned off at the moment. The rest of the rifle looks pretty nice overall...decent wood with a few handling marks etc.

Here's a link to the auction. It won't bother me if someone else takes a stab at it. I'll find one eventually anyhow.

 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Barrelhorses,
IMO you are right to be cautious. You would not know what the rest of the bore looked like and that "rust-spot" makes me suspicious.
I was looking at it again last night. Also saw some spots of something reddish color on the receiver in front of the bolt handle. The pictures are poor quality and I can't tell if it's rust spots or maybe just red fiber from a cleaning rag. I'm not even going to ask the seller.
 

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That seller has a lot of other guns for sale so I doubt if he does much cleaning or checking on what he sells. His rating looks OK but Gunbroker is.......well, Gunbroker. You pay your money and takes your chances. If I were buying one, I'd lie a bit more provenance. Just me.....:)
 

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I went out and looked at the listing, and it seems apparent to me that he used a red rag leaving fibers on the receiver area and rear of bolt. There's even a piece in the dovetail. The listing pictures allow you to scroll over in magnification and there are clearly red fibers in a lot of places. I bet he just cut a patch off the red T-shirt or whatever he used to wipe it down for the picture, and made a patch to run through the bore. I think it's just too coincidental that all those fibers are the same color as what is seen at the muzzle. What is odd is that he wouldn't just have taken a gander at his pictures and responded differently to the OP - if that's the case...
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I just wish the seller would have given me a better response than simply "copper fouling" and "thanks for your interest". I may try to contact him again and ask him whether he used a red rag/patches.

Edit to add: I did go ahead and send him another question about possible use of a red rag and patches for cleaning.
 
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