Why should BB have a better scope mounting options: Extended Rail & Cheekpeice - How? - RimfireCentral.com Forums

Go Back   RimfireCentral.com Forums > >

Notices

Join Team RFC to remove these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-15-2007, 04:33 PM
midwest swiss's Avatar
midwest swiss
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Sep 2005
Location: 
minnesota
Posts: 
5,209
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Why should BB have a better scope mounting options: Extended Rail & Cheekpeice - How?



Log in to see fewer ads
I think the Russian built BB should have a better scope base because.
1. It wouldn't cost them any more to do it.
2. It is about impossible to get the proper eye relief with the short little mount now.
3. More flexibility with the use of different scope powers.
4. It would sell more rifles in the USA.

All the books that I have read about shooting a rifle to get the most
out of them for constant repeatable accuracy your rifle must be set
up properly for the use of your sights iron or scope sights.

To get the proper fit of the rifle to find your natural point of aim.

This how its done,you should close your eyes & bring your rifle up into position
as if you were going to shoot it, now with your eyes still closed find the
most comfortable position.
Now open your eyes & you should be looking
down threw your sights.

Now I have my BB set up to do this now by installing an full length scope
rail & building up the cheek portion of my stock.
Here is a picture of how the Russians set up there BB rifle with a scope.

The scope is as far forward as it can go. (If you need more eye relief your screwed.)

The scope is also to hi, you would have no cheek weld.

Here are a few pictures of how I set up my BB rifle to be my hunting rifle.
Keep on eye on how the full scope rail did to the position
of my scope to get the proper eye relief....compared with the Russian picture.

This 1st pic. is my 1st sq. hunt with my BB. Scope BSA 2-7x32MM AO


After that hunt I would like an better cheek weld so I fixed that.
Also with a full scope rail it is very easy to swap the scope off for an
higher powered scope for target shooting.


If Izhmash would fix these little design problems people on RFC would
not be asking how to restock or where can I get an aftermarket stock.
Or ask how can I find a way to install a scope better.

I think Izhmash would fix these little problem to suite the US shooters
needs.
Add an full length scope rail & fix the comb on the stock for the
use of a scope.
I don't mind fixing these problems but allot of folks don't.

These are already very slick rifles.
There plenty accurate & shoot a wide selection of .22 ammo.
One very very nice trigger so the platform is there to have a slick
rifle even slicker for the US shooters.

Midwest Swiss

Last edited by midwest swiss; 01-18-2011 at 09:43 AM. Reason: Easier to Read & Restore Original Title
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-15-2007, 05:54 PM
midwest swiss's Avatar
midwest swiss
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Sep 2005
Location: 
minnesota
Posts: 
5,209
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Here are a few more pictures I found on my hardrive how
other folks have delt with mounting a scope on there BB.


WOW what a fine collection of Russian rifles.
If anybody object to me putting there pic. up let me no & I will take it down.
Lets air this out about how you have installed a scope on your BB.
Maybe you are happy the way it is from the factory.
I used two sets of weaver 4x4 scope mounts at 1st with my BB & it worked OK.
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/sto...204x4&s=#specs

Swiss

Last edited by midwest swiss; 10-07-2010 at 02:15 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-15-2007, 07:34 PM
ToxicSports

Join Date: 
May 2003
Location: 
State of Confusion
Posts: 
2,552
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Send a message via AIM to ToxicSports
Swiss,

I agree 50%.

I think the main problem is you have the shorter stock which probably means you need to mount the scope farther forward for a good sight picture and eye relief.

Remember my comparison?


My scope isn't awkward at all and very sturdy.

If you compare my scope location with yours you will see what I mean.....yours is noticeably more forward.

TS

Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old 12-15-2007, 09:16 PM
midwest swiss's Avatar
midwest swiss
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Sep 2005
Location: 
minnesota
Posts: 
5,209
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Thanks for the input TS. Yes the LOP would make a difference
they work with each other to make the total package work together.
I also realize that all of us come in different shapes & sizes.
I am 5'8" with short arms so my sable stock fits me good.
I was thinking maybe the Russian scopes have a shorter eye relief.

Here is a thread that ....GunTech...took his BB gopher hunting & installed
extra weaver mount to his BB. I thought was pretty clever.
https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums...d.php?t=184034
I know others have installed thicker recoil pads to there BB also
to extend there LOP

Maybe.......libertyman77....will respond to why he wants to do
something to change his BB's factory scope rail.

I am sure there are BB users that have no problems with the
short factory rail.
But it is a subject that has come up since I have been on RFC.

Swiss

Last edited by midwest swiss; 12-15-2007 at 11:20 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-16-2007, 12:18 AM
jammer

Join Date: 
Nov 2004
Location: 
Around Joplin MO
Posts: 
111
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Maybe I'm the wrong person to respond here, but I'll toss in my thoughts.

I had the Mueller APV mounted on mine and made it work in a way that I was pretty durn happy with. However, I still could have used more relief with that scope position. I can also see where a higher cheek weld would be handy. Also, I had my scope slammed forward in the rings and would have liked for it to go forward just a bit more.

I too think it would be very interesting to have a rail to take off your hunting scope and then toss on an even higher power scope for someone really trying to shoot fly hairs. Speaking of which, what rings are you running with that?

Btw, my stock is a darker one like TS shows in the picture above. I probably ought to grab a tape and measure it to see what the LOP is on it. But I'd have to put her all back together. I disassembled to start looking at the inner workings and take lots of measurements.

One of the things with that setup is that I'd be more comfortable yanking the scope off and then putting it back if I knew I had a little more wiggle room. as it is, I've NEVER popped the pin off and cleaned the gun as I didn't want to move the scope since it was a pain to get just right in the first place. That reminds me, this is a great time to actually doing some cleaning while I have the scope off.

I'm actually looking at the specs on the picatinny's and thinking of having a buddy see about milling a couple for me. (Need to look at the specs and see if it specifies the metal grade) But then I suppose I should tap a hole in the receiver to the front of the chamber and I just hate having to do that.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-16-2007, 12:22 AM
jammer

Join Date: 
Nov 2004
Location: 
Around Joplin MO
Posts: 
111
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Maybe I'm the wrong person to respond here, but I'll toss in my thoughts.

I had the Mueller APV mounted on mine and made it work in a way that I was pretty durn happy with. However, I still could have used more relief with that scope position. I can also see where a higher cheek weld would be handy. Also, I had my scope slammed forward in the rings and would have liked for it to go forward just a bit more.

I too think it would be very interesting to have a rail to take off your hunting scope and then toss on an even higher power scope for someone really trying to shoot fly hairs. Speaking of which, what rings are you running with that?

Btw, my stock is a darker one like TS shows in the picture above. I probably ought to grab a tape and measure it to see what the LOP is on it. But I'd have to put her all back together. I disassembled to start looking at the inner workings and take lots of measurements.

One of the things with that setup is that I'd be more comfortable yanking the scope off and then putting it back if I knew I had a little more wiggle room. as it is, I've NEVER popped the pin off and cleaned the gun as I didn't want to move the scope since it was a pain to get just right in the first place. That reminds me, this is a great time to actually doing some cleaning while I have the scope off.

I'm actually looking at the specs on the picatinny's and thinking of having a buddy see about milling a couple for me. (Need to look at the specs and see if it specifies the metal grade) But then I suppose I should tap a hole in the receiver to the front of the chamber and I just hate having to do that.

I have a couple questions. I can't see the picture of Guntech's mods in that link. Is that just me? Secondly, I was looking at a post that I was part of here https://rimfirecentral.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=204699 and was going to reply but it just "closed". Does it do that automatically after 30 days, or did it get shut down?

Have a great weekend!
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-16-2007, 12:54 AM
midwest swiss's Avatar
midwest swiss
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Sep 2005
Location: 
minnesota
Posts: 
5,209
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Thanks for your input Jammer.

I can't see GunTechs pictures either.
It means he removed them from his photo bucket.
Any good gunsmith or machinist can drill & tap the receiver.
The steel on the BB is very soft & easy to drill & tap.
It sounds like Jammer has a little BB project going on ???
Keep us up dated.

Midwest Swiss
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-16-2007, 01:15 AM
ToxicSports

Join Date: 
May 2003
Location: 
State of Confusion
Posts: 
2,552
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Send a message via AIM to ToxicSports
I'm using ARMS throw lever rings. They are guaranteed to return to zero but they also cost over $100 per set.

I've only taken them off of the BB a couple of time for major cleaning but after remounting the scope and testing on paper they were still at zero. Granted they were probably off by fractions but I couldn't tell.

As for a forward rail....why couldn't you just epoxy a front rail on?

If you have a long enough scope as Swiss does, and the BSA Platinum in the other photo, you could mount the scope to two of the rear locations for support and then have a third scope ring mounted to the scope and piece of rail to hold everything still as the epoxy cured. It would take some extra measuring to make sure everything was square before you applied the epoxy but I don't see why it wouldn't work.

Granted you would also have to do a bunch of dry runs as well to make sure you have enough downward pressure to keep everything level. Maybe tape, rubber bands, etc....You wouldn't want to have the front base put upward pressure on the scope.

Just a cheaper alternative to drilling and tapping.

TS

Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-16-2007, 05:08 PM
aom22's Avatar
aom22
US Air Force Disabled American Veteran Law Enforcement Officer NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Moderator
Join Date: 
Sep 2004
Location: 
Fort Stockton, TX
Posts: 
4,680
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Thread is OPEN ... Never should have been closed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jammer View Post
.... Secondly, I was looking at a post that I was part of here https://rimfirecentral.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=204699 and was going to reply but it just "closed".
The thread is OPEN ... Awwww, I accidently did not re-open the thread after I was working on it.
Simple mistake, not intentional.
__________________
W. Edwards Deming ... Quality: It is not enough to do-your-best;
you must know what-to-do, and ... then ... do-your-best.
Ever-Onward ... Through the Fog ---- Fort Stockton TX 79735
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-16-2007, 05:49 PM
jammer

Join Date: 
Nov 2004
Location: 
Around Joplin MO
Posts: 
111
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Aom, that makes sense. Thanks for letting me know.

Here's a question, does anyone even have a clue as to how many BB owners there are on this forum? It seems like a small number of owners and a much smaller number that is vocal about it.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-16-2007, 08:10 PM
aom22's Avatar
aom22
US Air Force Disabled American Veteran Law Enforcement Officer NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Moderator
Join Date: 
Sep 2004
Location: 
Fort Stockton, TX
Posts: 
4,680
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Bi-directional Offset Mount - 1.496 inches

Until the factory extents the rail ....
This might be a workable interim solution
for large diameter telescopic sight
that needs a more forward mounted position.


Picatinny/Weaver
1” Bi-directional Offset
Optimum Profile Mount
(RGWMOFS38-25H4)


Quote:
1” diameter, 62mm base length, fits scope with objective up to 56mm. 38mm bi-directional offset provides comfortable extended eye relief range for long rifles. Integral base provides added security and stability, reducing recoil and enhancing shooting accuracy and performance.
Saddle height 0.71”.
62mm=2.441 inches, 38mm=1.496 inches

Bi-directional Offset (forward or aft), whatever is needed to suit the mounting situation.
__________________
W. Edwards Deming ... Quality: It is not enough to do-your-best;
you must know what-to-do, and ... then ... do-your-best.
Ever-Onward ... Through the Fog ---- Fort Stockton TX 79735

Last edited by aom22; 12-16-2007 at 08:12 PM. Reason: Modify Text
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-16-2007, 08:55 PM
midwest swiss's Avatar
midwest swiss
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Sep 2005
Location: 
minnesota
Posts: 
5,209
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
aom 22....That looks like the best offset mount yet.
If you look at Nomo4me's pictures of his BB that was what everybody
was doing to mount your scope if you had eye relief problems.

But it still won't quite do it & it put the scope to hi in the air.
Then a member on here was a machinist on here offer to sell some
he made up for cost.
But were $80.00 to much for some.
But since I installed my full rail its the cats meow for me anyway.

Now I think the Russian's way of a proper cheek weld with the use
of a scope is different then here in the USA or the western world.
Look at there sniper rifles of WW- 2 there scopes were way in the air.

Jammer.... there use to be about a dozen or so member on here yacking
about there BB's in 05-06.
They all kind of melted away to other rifle
projects or what ever.

Me myself I am done working on my BB, I have it
all tricked out for my needs.
I have 3-.22 rifles I use and play with the
most they are , BB,CM-2, and a CZ-452 Varmint.

I have 7 or 8 .22 rifles
I play with from time to time.
But the 3 I listed I use the most now.

We need some new BB blood like you..... Jammer.

Swiss

Last edited by midwest swiss; 09-02-2009 at 10:15 AM. Reason: Easier to Read
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-16-2007, 09:50 PM
aom22's Avatar
aom22
US Air Force Disabled American Veteran Law Enforcement Officer NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Moderator
Join Date: 
Sep 2004
Location: 
Fort Stockton, TX
Posts: 
4,680
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Add-On Cheekpiece

Once a telescopic sight with a large objective is mounted
and eye relief is properly set.

The shooter needs to establish a proper cheekweld.
A cheekpiece most likely will be needed.

A practical solution maybe to epoxy a synthetic cheekpiece onto the stock.
Trim the cheekpiece to fit the rifle stock while maintaining proper telescopic sight alignment.
Then, epoxy the cheekpiece into place.
Paint the stock and cheekpiece to match.


Cherokee® Cheekpieces

Delta Star Cheekpiece


Delta Cheekpiece


M4 Snap-On Cheekpiece


CAR-15 Snap-On Cheekpiece


For Larger Images ...
__________________
W. Edwards Deming ... Quality: It is not enough to do-your-best;
you must know what-to-do, and ... then ... do-your-best.
Ever-Onward ... Through the Fog ---- Fort Stockton TX 79735
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-19-2007, 07:46 PM
aom22's Avatar
aom22
US Air Force Disabled American Veteran Law Enforcement Officer NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Moderator
Join Date: 
Sep 2004
Location: 
Fort Stockton, TX
Posts: 
4,680
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Extended Rail on Shorter Rail with Return to Zero Mount

Quote:
Originally Posted by jammer View Post
I too think it would be very interesting to have a rail to take off your hunting scope
and then toss on an even higher power scope for someone really trying to shoot fly hairs.

I'm actually looking at the specs on the picatinny's
and thinking of having a buddy see about milling a couple for me.
(Need to look at the specs and see if it specifies the metal grade)
But then I suppose I should tap a hole in the receiver to the front of the chamber
and I just hate having to do that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ToxicSports View Post
I'm using ARMS throw lever rings.
They are guaranteed to return to zero but they also cost over $100 per set.


I've only taken them off of the BB a couple of time for major cleaning
but after remounting the scope and testing on paper they were still at zero.
Granted they were probably off by fractions but I couldn't tell.


Just a cheaper alternative to drilling and tapping.

TS


Maybe, this is the solution.
An extended rail that mounts on a shorter rail (the weaver rail of the Biathlon Basic)
- using a return to zero mount.
And, without an excessive increase in height.

It is not cheap - Price:$169.00

Mounting Solutions Plus
THROW LEVER SCOPE MOUNT BASE +STRAIGHT RAIL
__________________
W. Edwards Deming ... Quality: It is not enough to do-your-best;
you must know what-to-do, and ... then ... do-your-best.
Ever-Onward ... Through the Fog ---- Fort Stockton TX 79735

Last edited by aom22; 12-20-2007 at 05:57 PM. Reason: Modify Text & Add Quotes
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-20-2007, 03:49 AM
toivo's Avatar
toivo is online now
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Jan 2005
Location: 
New York State
Posts: 
2,439
TPC Rating: 
100% (3)
I have a BB with a Mueller APV mounted on B-Square "Sport Utility" rings. At first it felt like I had to hold my head too far back in order to get my sight picture, but now I'm getting used to it. I actually think my stance might be better now with my head more upright--it's just not what I was used to before. I get a decent cheekweld, just a tad low: Sort of a "cheek and jaw" weld.

A while back I thought about trying offset rings, but my current set-up just barely makes weight for the Sporterifle matches I shoot--I'm pretty sure the offsets weigh more, and when I say "barely," I mean barely. The gun makes weight by half an ounce! So you can see why a longer rail would be out of the question for me. So for now I'm operating on the theory of "If it works, don't fix it."
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:31 PM.

Privacy Policy

DMCA Notice

Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©2000-2018 RimfireCentral.com
x