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  #16  
Old 06-02-2020, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thesandman View Post
If someone had same make, model, tuner they would have a good point to start. Could save alot of blind shots in dark having a known tune number and weights(extensions) used. So a short stiff barrel takes less weight than a longer more flexible barrel.
Sandy, It is not that simple. to extract the most out of a rifle using a tuner, you have to have everything working together. it is not just sticking the tuner on the barrel and you start adjusting. you have to know how the rifle likes to be shot. such as how much front bag tension, how fast a recoil, does it like to be held or free recoil. get this right first, then shoot it naked and see how well it shoots.

with the information on how it shoots, it will greatly reduce the frustration.
for example, if it groups with just vertical stringing then this will tell you it can be adjusted out with the tuner, however if it shotgun patterns then you have other problems which the tuner will not help with. and need to be corrected first.

The better a rifle can shoot without a tuner, the easier it will be finding a tuner setting. it is when it doesn't shoot good that the frustration can occur. remember the tuner is for the ammo and not for correcting the rifle's problems.

Lee
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  #17  
Old 06-02-2020, 10:41 AM
W8LON

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BSA’s can be tuned with the forearm. My Mark II doesn’t seem to care with either factory forearm or the stock set I made. Could it be improved, perhaps?
My Mark V on the other hand improved immensely with forearm tuning. The three screws through the rigid I-Beam aluminum forearm insert was showing signs of extreme change through temperature variation, expansion contraction. Through the suggestion of another forum member familiar with this issue I tried shimming just rear portion and using just rear screw. Essentially free floating all but four inches of forearm .080. By moving my plastic shim stock I could note movement of shot placement on paper. I was effecting the harmonics of barrel. After settling on a spacing that worked I bedded that area.

This could be done on a Mark II as well. Play with shims fore and aft of attachment screw then mill a slot and bed an aluminum bar that spacing.
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  #18  
Old 06-02-2020, 04:08 PM
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Thanks W8LON, I had the usual vertical with the mkII forearm configuration. It had a pressure point at front of wood. I freefloated wood from mount screw fwd and eliminated the vertical spread. I left Gun setting on bipod for 24hrs and the barrel clearance didn't change. Gun shot good as it was if you could keep up with the rise and fall. I think you could have adjusted elevation with screw torque. I recrowned it today. Barrel and chamber look good. Seems Eley would shoot better in it than what I've tried so far. It's not shooting up to factory spec,s right now. Soon as I find a good lot# tuner is going on.
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  #19  
Old 06-05-2020, 08:24 PM
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thesandman, the purdy system is like a broken clock, right time twice a day. listen to what lee says about 3 rounds then out 5 clicks. one problem not using a bench set-up is how competent is the shooter maintaining the exact pressure on the butt stock. more pressure causes greater muzzle flip, less pressure less muzzle flip. so the ability of you to control trigger and how you as a shooter let the rifle start recoil is critical. so if your in tune at a setting, come back to that setting applying different pressure to the stock and trigger tune will change every time. seems to me it ain't the gun,it's the shooter... marty
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  #20  
Old 06-06-2020, 08:52 AM
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Sam Snead once said about the grip on a golf club. "grip the club as if you were holding a baby bird in your hand ." same holds true for target shooting, more so with a tuner. let the rifle do it's thing.... marty
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  #21  
Old 06-06-2020, 09:57 AM
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I agree with that on most target rifles , earnest. George Mitchell built himself a .69 caliber slug gun that weighed in at just under 100 lbs. You squeezed the trigger and just held on and rode it out. His glasses and hat came off every shot. I doubt if anyone ever took up his offer to go for a ride with that rifle!

Last edited by W8LON; 06-06-2020 at 10:12 AM.
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  #22  
Old 06-06-2020, 10:21 AM
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any time something touches the barrel it robs the entire system of energy, same holds true with pressure applied to the fore end stop. marty
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  #23  
Old 07-02-2020, 10:25 AM
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I shoot at a bench rest, using a Seb front rest and several different rear bags depending on the shape of the stock of the rifle, being shot. I have rifle tuners on several of my rifles, but in truth, they only really work because I load my own ammo and am anal as to weight all components used in the process. Change powder, bullet or primer weight and you must retune the barrel. Even the most expensive rimfire ammo can't provide this king of manufacturing precision.

Admittedly I am new to rimfire shooting. Having not had an opportunity to test this theory, I may be wrong. Only stating what seems obvious to me. It won't hurt my feelings to be corrected.
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  #24  
Old 07-02-2020, 07:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Njjr View Post
I shoot at a bench rest, using a Seb front rest and several different rear bags depending on the shape of the stock of the rifle, being shot. I have rifle tuners on several of my rifles, but in truth, they only really work because I load my own ammo and am anal as to weight all components used in the process. Change powder, bullet or primer weight and you must retune the barrel. Even the most expensive rimfire ammo can't provide this king of manufacturing precision.

Admittedly I am new to rimfire shooting. Having not had an opportunity to test this theory, I may be wrong. Only stating what seems obvious to me. It won't hurt my feelings to be corrected.
If you understand that tuning, is barrel timing then you will quickly understand the theory doesn't work.
read post 16, it is not just one singular action at work it is a total package/system working together.

Lee
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  #25  
Old 07-06-2020, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thesandman View Post
If someone had same make, model, tuner they would have a good point to start. Could save alot of blind shots in dark having a known tune number and weights(extensions) used. So a short stiff barrel takes less weight than a longer more flexible barrel.
thesandman, don't exclude forced deformation in your thinking of what a barrel does or not.... marty
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  #26  
Old 07-06-2020, 09:30 PM
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so I've said, printed, preached this a hunnert time. {Douglas Rome hunnert} the only way to tune properly is 2 speed tuning. purdy and all others are like a broken clock,right some of the time. action, barrel,tuner are all made from different metals and each react from differently applied stresses. my good friends tell me it's called ANISOTROPIC. tuning with 2 speeds is accomplished by a fast and a slow round looking like this 8 on your keyboard that the difference between the slow and fast can be explained by ballistic measurements. I don't know how understanding this is so hard? marty
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  #27  
Old 07-06-2020, 09:50 PM
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So is my Unertl Ultra Varmint mounted on my barrel considered a tuner? I would think so. If a fella was to set his spring tension with a trigger pull scale and play plus or minus with grouping , it may show an effect.
I know many shooters eliminated spring tension for return to battery and manually pushed scope back. I’ve had them without springs and even the imperceptible amount moved will bite you after a few rounds.
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