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  #16  
Old 02-27-2010, 09:34 PM
savage92

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Okay the only thing i don't like is when people say it should be illegal.
1. It's a choice, if you don't want to smoke or you're worried about the dangers, don't try it or quit, simple.
2. Second hand smoke is no more harmful than chlorinated water by real studies and should not be considered a health risk.
3. The nazis were the first to create the idea of second hand smoke, hitler being strongly against smoking, so how much credibility can you give to his main beliefs.
4. If the tobacco companies are blamed for cancer, shouldn't Smirnoff be blamed for some guy out there with liver disease.
5. The World Health Organization (WHO) has over 70% of their funds come from big pharmacy, benefiting greatly from people thinking it's harder to quit than it really is and from their stop-smoking products. Also ever notice how they say smoking-related deaths, what this includes is anything that smokers show have an elevated risk of, no matter how small the risk is.
6. Ever hear the anti-smokers say that all of the longest living people on were smokers, surprised?

Check out these links if you don't believe me:

http://www.forces.org/evidence/hamil...her/oldest.htm

http://www.forces.org/evidence/files/premat.htm

http://www.cagecanada.ca/Tobacco_Control.php

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/e...ue-2/0180a.htm

http://www.smokescam.com/report.htm

http://www.forces.org/evidence/evid/life.htm

http://www.forces.org/evidence/evid/nazi.htm

http://www.forces.org/evidence/epafraud/etsfrau.htm
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  #17  
Old 02-27-2010, 09:38 PM
ballistx
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smoking effects

I smoked about 3 packs a day from 61 till 70. Started in the Navy. I quit about 1,000 times. I worked for Collins Radio at the time. I was having headaches that I would take 6 to 8 excederins at one time and still not effect it.

I finally found out the main reason I could not quit. I realized that if I quit I could NEVER have another cigarette. Finally I accepted that and went and bought a Sears Radial Arm Saw with my 1st year savings. I never had another cigarette. I still have that saw and it still works great.

My headaches stopped after awhile but I never really tied it to the cigarettes because I still had some. My wife still smoked.

In the 80's I had an engineering company in Idaho and we had a client that had gotten extreme exposure to urea-formeldahyde from the insulation put into their house. We were working in that area and did an huge amount of research into allergies, toxins, etc. We had 3' and 4' stacks of research papers.

During that time I would get a splitting headache just passing someone on the street that was smoking. Others I could be in a room for 30 minutes with smokers before getting a headache. It was due to the particular chemicals in that praticular brand of cigarettes.

Since then it has gotten somewhat better but I still get sinus swelling and head congestion from being around someone that is smoking or even has recently smoked. So, there is really no way anyone can smoke without seriously impacting someone else.

What we determined from the research is that every person begins life with a specific level of tolerance to every individual toxin. It depends on that individual just what that level is. During life we are exposed to a varying level of toxins. Every exposure reduces our tolerance to that toxin. Eventually we get to the level where we are impaired by that toxin. Some people are born below the level, such as peanut butter allergy.

Those born with the reactions may grow less intolerant but those who are exposed during life do not recover very much. So, as you are exosed to the toxins in cigarettes you gradually become more and more susceptable to adverse effects of the toxin. Just as I did.

Once you have gotten to the point where it is easily discernable it is too late. It will get worse but you will never get much better. If you are around kids they are affected vastly more than adults and will be adversly affected for life.

The idea that smoking cigarettes only affects those that actually smoke is not supported by any research or evidence. 100% of the evidence demonstrates that anyone who is contacted by that smoke WILL be adversly affected. Those that have allready been sensitized will be immediately impacted by having headaches, congestion and other impairments.

If you think the smoke isn't reaching them, a good comparative is to consider our little hunting buddy, the skunk. If a skunk sprays where you are smoking, anyplace that scent is detected is where you smoke will be detected also. Anyone that could smell the skunk spray will be negatively affected by your smoke.

Hope this might shed a little light on the subject.

Last edited by ballistx; 02-27-2010 at 09:41 PM.
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  #18  
Old 02-27-2010, 09:42 PM
Alienwordz
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Originally Posted by timberbeast63 View Post
Where it's legal, it's none of my business what others put into their body as long as I don't have to breathe it too.

I don't smoke because I don't want to and I believe it increases the risk of various diseases. Note - increasing risk is not the same as causality! That's my opinion and I only share it here because I was asked. I don't offer that opinion to anyone unless asked, and I've never had a smoker ask me.
I am of the same opinion as timberbeast63...I never have smoked. Sad thing is that it is one of the most addictive substances, it is legal and there is a multi-billion industry surrounding smoking/tobacco. When I worked at the VA Substance Abuse Treatment Program I had former heroin addicts tell me it is harder to get off of cigarettes than heroin. Some ex-smokers have told me that even 30 years after quitting they still crave a cigarette from time to time. It should be phased out as a product but I understand it is probably going to be about one of the last products still produced in and consumed in the U.S. with the U.S. exporting about 25% of what is manufactured here so that makes it a very viable product.
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  #19  
Old 02-27-2010, 09:46 PM
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Tobacco is a vile weed
T'was the devil that sowed the seed
It empties your pockets and burns your clothes.
It makes a chimney out of your nose.

I smoked too many years, but have been off the stuff since September, "87.
My wife for eight months more than that.

Things taste better and the house no longer has the "smoke haze', nor do the cars.,

I can't recommend smoking, but if you have to, please do it outside.

Yes, I still do miss my pipe on ocassion.

all the best to all
blueridgeranger
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  #20  
Old 02-27-2010, 09:47 PM
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It's what I hate the most. Not only the noxious smoke but the attitude of (most) smokers...that is, that they should be able to smoke anywhere at anytime and their "right to smoke" should not be infringed upon. Thankfully, there has been a smoking ban put into effect in most of the larger cities nearby. I'll drive 40-50 miles to eat where there is no smoking allowed in the restaraunt. Isn't smoking an outdoor activity? What's the deal with smokers throwing their butts out everywhere? Anywhere you go, and I mean anywhere, there lays the mess discarded by the addicts. Pull up to a stop light and glance out. Hundreds of cigarette butts.....hundreds. What's the deal with the "door hovering"? Smokers are attracted by opening doors. They get as close as they can to wherever you have to walk in and out. The stench is nauseating.
Like I said, I hate it. Father, dead, cancer. Brother, dead, cancer. Mother, dead, emphysema/pneumonia. Aunt, emphesema, hopelessly addicted.
I could go on and on....but I'll spare you the venom.
Well i do believe it is a right to smoke, why is it any less a right to smoke than to own a gun? And why should some pub owner or anyone else be forced not to allow people to smoke in THEIR building because the government wants to stick their nose in it and say it doesn't smell nice, costing them money. If anti-smokers want to ban indoor smoking, they should pay the end result in the company's losses in taxes, sounds fair to me. No company should ever go out of business because anti-smokers don't like the smell, if they don't like smoking go find a place where the owner decides himself he doesn't want smoking inside. Everyone always says the government should mind their own business but somehow forget these thoughts when the subject of smoking comes up.
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  #21  
Old 02-27-2010, 09:51 PM
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Smoke em if ya got em...we need the tax revenue in order to speed up the undoing of the American Way (tm) by the Chicagoans in D.C.

Some of the greatest people I've ever known have been smokers.
Did it kill some of them, yes, more than likely.

Tobacco use is one of the freedoms that humans can choose.
Many people actually enjoy its pleasures.
Users are now considered lower than pond scum and have been demonized.

Those willing to give up freedom for a measure of security deserve neither freedom or security or some such...

I am a former butthead.
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  #22  
Old 02-27-2010, 09:52 PM
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It Sucks!!!
I hate bing around it and I especially hate the old days when rude smokers would smoke in restaurants, ruining the good meal you just paid for.
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  #23  
Old 02-27-2010, 09:58 PM
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Everyone in society that pays taxes or buys health insureance pays the price, all the treatments for cancer, emphasema, brocites,ect, not to mention all of the automotive accidents, industrial accidents from smoking, how many children have died in the womb from smoking mothers?
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  #24  
Old 02-27-2010, 10:10 PM
Alienwordz
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Originally Posted by M2HB View Post
It Sucks!!!
I hate bing around it and I especially hate the old days when rude smokers would smoke in restaurants, ruining the good meal you just paid for.
Some of us are old enough to remember employees smoking in offices, mechanics smoking out in the shop while working on our car, and when I was in college I worked nights as a janitor and had to clean the ashtrays in the banks I cleaned and even the doctors offices.

When you mentioned restaurants, I remember watching smokers put their cigarettes out in the plates or the the food they did not eat and then smearing the black ash all in the food and around the plate....remember even seeing the old "short order cooks" cooking with a cigarette hanging out of their mouth with an ash about an inch long ready to fall off it.
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  #25  
Old 02-27-2010, 10:15 PM
Granite3
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Originally Posted by M2HB View Post
It Sucks!!!
I hate bing around it and I especially hate the old days when rude smokers would smoke in restaurants, ruining the good meal you just paid for.
+1 on that,

BUT, what you do in the privacy of your own house, land, etc, is none of my business or concern till it impacts me. Smoke it, snort it, inject it, kiss it....

That said, I don't want to pay for your poor choice of unhealthy habits. My share of the bill for treating the COPD, emphasemia, heart issues, lung cancer, etc, caused by your bad habit.
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  #26  
Old 02-27-2010, 10:21 PM
savage92

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Originally Posted by Granite3 View Post
+1 on that,

BUT, what you do in the privacy of your own house, land, etc, is none of my business or concern till it impacts me. Smoke it, snort it, inject it, kiss it....

That said, I don't want to pay for your poor choice of unhealthy habits. My share of the bill for treating the COPD, emphasemia, heart issues, lung cancer, etc, caused by your bad habit.
The high taxes on cigarettes more than covers those problems so that is a non-issue.
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  #27  
Old 02-27-2010, 10:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Granite3 View Post
+1 on that,

BUT, what you do in the privacy of your own house, land, etc, is none of my business or concern till it impacts me. Smoke it, snort it, inject it, kiss it....

That said, I don't want to pay for your poor choice of unhealthy habits. My share of the bill for treating the COPD, emphasemia, heart issues, lung cancer, etc, caused by your bad habit.
Smoking impacts all of us in any society financially, socially,and healthwise. so if you smoke it is my business, if you do drugs its my business, if you over eat and are obese its my business beacause its costing me and everyone else more in insureance premiums and damaging our country.
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  #28  
Old 02-27-2010, 10:27 PM
savage92

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Originally Posted by hesco View Post
Everyone in society that pays taxes or buys health insureance pays the price, all the treatments for cancer, emphasema, brocites,ect, not to mention all of the automotive accidents, industrial accidents from smoking, how many children have died in the womb from smoking mothers?
The automotive accidents, industrial accidents and defected babies from smoking are not cause by smoking though, that should be considered abuse such as drinking while driving, drinking while pregnant, etc. Or even some idiot that accidently kills himself or others with a gun, all liberal ideas. If you used those reasons tobacco, alcohol and guns would be banned.
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  #29  
Old 02-27-2010, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Alienwordz View Post

When you mentioned restaurants, I remember watching smokers put their cigarettes out in the plates or the the food they did not eat and then smearing the black ash all in the food and around the plate....remember even seeing the old "short order cooks" cooking with a cigarette hanging out of their mouth with an ash about an inch long ready to fall off it.
I hear dat!!
Wife and I ate for the first time in years in a state that allowed smoking in restaurants, this week past and was an awful reminder of "the good ole days".
Our hometown now allows no smoking in ANY buildings (bars etc.) the public has access to, and most private business's also. They've also just passed a littering infraction for flicking the butts on public property including streets.
Good riddance!
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  #30  
Old 02-27-2010, 10:29 PM
savage92

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Originally Posted by hesco View Post
Smoking impacts all of us in any society financially, socially,and healthwise. so if you smoke it is my business, if you do drugs its my business, if you over eat and are obese its my business beacause its costing me and everyone else more in insureance premiums and damaging our country.
I almost agree with you, therefore shouldn't the government tax the obese on their food the same way they do tobacco? Tobacco is alone in that the smokers actually do pay for their health risks.
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