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  #16  
Old 02-23-2019, 10:20 AM
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Replaced the slide stop/ejector and upon completion, there was significantly less side to side slop and the ejector is able to get a good purchase on the cartridge for ejection.

Was at the range for a bullseye match and after I shot my match with my other pistol, was able to get a lane and give the 41 a bit of a run down to confirm function. Ran about 60 rounds through with only one jam which was the classic fired case caught above the next round. It was the second or third round fired and was followed by another sixty or so rounds without a malfunction.

Appears to be fixed but need more range time to confirm.

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Crankster
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  #17  
Old 02-26-2019, 04:12 PM
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Crankster, that is great news! Before this issue, what has been your experience with it re: any type of feeding issues? The only experience I have with a 41 is with my two, both purchased used, and both of which have been extremely reliable. I don't remember the last FTF.
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  #18  
Old 03-10-2019, 10:51 AM
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Oh oh..........more problems......

Went back to the range again, this time it would not cycle even one round properly. Pistol jammed every time, either the classic model 41 jam with the fired empty preventing the bolt sliding into battery or with the fired case still in the chamber, the bolt did not slide back far enough to eject the old, pick up the new.

I have a wolfe spring kit for the 41 and have the lightest spring installed. Was thinking about snipping off a couple of coils but was really scratching my head trying to figure out what was causing this pistol to malfunction.

Asked my buddy what his thoughts were. He took a look at me shooting the pistol and remarked that it appeared that the slide was "very slow".


Inspected the operation of the slide... no apparent issues.

Manually cocked the hammer......no real issues..


really wondering what the heck and in a fit of frustration liberally applied gun oil to the slide and aslo to the hammer pin.

immediately saw a improvement in function so I field stripped the pistol and oiled the hammer pivot pin as best I could.


Shot another 60 rounds with absolutely zero malfunctions.


Ok, got back home and have completely disassembled the pistol. Did not appear to have much dirt and grime but who knows.

Right now, I think that the ejector was worn out and needed to be replaced. Also, since I recently purchased the pistol from the estate of a retired bullseye shooter, it probably was in storage for a couple years before I was able to obtain it. If the former owner lubed it up like a 1911 needs to be lubed, it might have had a lot of old oil jamming it up but I really did not see that when I disassembled it.

Well, it is back to the range and I will let you guys know if a complete disassembly has it running good.

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Cranky
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  #19  
Old 03-10-2019, 04:06 PM
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Hard to believe the ejector would be worn out. That almost never happens in a 41. If you mean the extractor that is more likely to be at fault. Have you inserted a live round into the bolt face to see how well the extractor grabs and works? I'd do that first before assuming it was bad. A visual inspection should reveal if the extractor is somehow damaged or worn. A new one may require some fitting to function properly.

Sounds like you are on the right track. Good luck. bob
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  #20  
Old 03-10-2019, 04:24 PM
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crankythunder:

I refer you to my post (#4 ) of this thread. This is the test for a correctly tuned and fitted extractor in any 22LR blowback operated gun.

LDBennett
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  #21  
Old 03-10-2019, 05:19 PM
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I think you found your own cure. You said it ran 60 rounds after oiling it up. I know some of these old 41s run better a little wetter.
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  #22  
Old 03-16-2019, 09:13 AM
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CRANKY,

Have you been able to shoot 41 anymore?
And did oiling it up good fix your issues?
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  #23  
Old 03-16-2019, 10:27 AM
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Cranky, I'm late to the party here, I too have a ('85) 41 jam o matic. Bought used and just like yours, jammed every round. No matter what ammo was used. So called Smith, sent it in, 6 months later, get it back, same thing. On the recpt, it said under solution: fixed. Wow, thanks for the detailed explanation on what was wrong. No cost this time. So on range day, exact same thing. Sent it back. 7 months later, and $150 out of pocket (apparently life time warranty is only good for so many years), the 1/2 cock notch was broke. Got it back, and ran 60 rds of CCI SV through it, no jams, but still hesitant to use it in my bowling pin and 22 rimfire matches.

Hope you got yours fixed.
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  #24  
Old 03-19-2019, 07:09 PM
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Update

Ok, I have it fixed with about a thousand rounds through it and no jams so I am pretty confidant.

First off, even though I replaced the extractor I do not think that the extractor was the cause of the malfunctions. Was ready to do the detailed tuning of the extractor but it passed LDBennets test with flying colors, especially with both the old extractor and the new tandemcross extractor.

I am 100 percent sure that the slide stop/ejector was worn out. there was too much slop that is completely absent with the new slide stop/ejector installed. Furthermore, a co shooter started having similar problems with his 41 and I did LDBennets test and the extractor was ok but it had a lot of slop in the slide stop/ejector. put my ejector in his firearm and it worked like a champ so he has a new slide stop/ejector on order.

But the worn out slide stop/ejector was not the whole problem. A full cleaning with a 100 percent tear down was required to get all the old lubrication fluids out that had jelled and clogged up the action. I am not going to sugar coat it, I followed the sticky and a number of you tube videos and it was not easy. There are just some manipulations and procedures that need to be taught hands on and is difficult to convey in a video or written instructions. Reassembly of a 41, especially with a cocking indicator takes good instructions along with a healthy dose of ingenuity.


So, while I am confidant that the extractor test as described by LDBennet is a valid test, you should also check the slide stop/ejector for slop which is easy to do as a required step in diagnosing model 41 issues.


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Crankster
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  #25  
Old 03-19-2019, 08:26 PM
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Crankster did you decide that really oiling up the slide also added to the reliability?
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  #26  
Old 03-19-2019, 08:38 PM
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Where are you finding the slide stop/ejectors? I have a older 41 that needs one.
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  #27  
Old 03-20-2019, 05:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crankythunder View Post
Ok, I have it fixed with about a thousand rounds through it and no jams so I am pretty confidant.

First off, even though I replaced the extractor I do not think that the extractor was the cause of the malfunctions. Was ready to do the detailed tuning of the extractor but it passed LDBennets test with flying colors, especially with both the old extractor and the new tandemcross extractor.

I am 100 percent sure that the slide stop/ejector was worn out. there was too much slop that is completely absent with the new slide stop/ejector installed. Furthermore, a co shooter started having similar problems with his 41 and I did LDBennets test and the extractor was ok but it had a lot of slop in the slide stop/ejector. put my ejector in his firearm and it worked like a champ so he has a new slide stop/ejector on order.

But the worn out slide stop/ejector was not the whole problem. A full cleaning with a 100 percent tear down was required to get all the old lubrication fluids out that had jelled and clogged up the action. I am not going to sugar coat it, I followed the sticky and a number of you tube videos and it was not easy. There are just some manipulations and procedures that need to be taught hands on and is difficult to convey in a video or written instructions. Reassembly of a 41, especially with a cocking indicator takes good instructions along with a healthy dose of ingenuity.


So, while I am confidant that the extractor test as described by LDBennet is a valid test, you should also check the slide stop/ejector for slop which is easy to do as a required step in diagnosing model 41 issues.


Regards,

Crankster
Good info, Thanks
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  #28  
Old 03-20-2019, 05:47 AM
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As for a complete takedown cleaning, that would be unnecessary if regular maintenance was more than a wipe down. I clean my guns after EVERY shooting session whether I shoot 10 rounds or 200 rounds. Keeping ahead of the dirt build up keeps the gun reliable. I have many guns and never had to do a complete teardown to get any of them clean. Thorough regular maintenance keeps them clean.

As for the slidestop/ejector wearing out, I'll try to remember that when others have reliability problems with these guns. Some of the used Model 41's have seen tons of ammunition and mechanical things do wear out.

LDBennett
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  #29  
Old 03-25-2019, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by LDBennett View Post
As for a complete takedown cleaning, that would be unnecessary if regular maintenance was more than a wipe down. I clean my guns after EVERY shooting session whether I shoot 10 rounds or 200 rounds. Keeping ahead of the dirt build up keeps the gun reliable. I have many guns and never had to do a complete teardown to get any of them clean. Thorough regular maintenance keeps them clean.

As for the slidestop/ejector wearing out, I'll try to remember that when others have reliability problems with these guns. Some of the used Model 41's have seen tons of ammunition and mechanical things do wear out.

LDBennett

HI LD:


Maybe I should say how this particular model 41 came into my possession.


I purchased it from a LGS which had it for sale for $600 bucks. Actually it was a cardboard box with a label of "Model 41" written in sharpie on ancient masking tape. Within the box I found a bunch of cotton towel wrapped parts including a model 41 receiver, a slide, a 5.5 inch barrel with a aimpoint 1000 installed.


There were a couple other model 41 parts in there as well, couple barrels, some magazines, four or five sets of grips, etc.



(I made out like a bandit, I know)



At no additional cost, the purchase also included a significant coating of dust and debris that indicated the box and parts have been in storage somewhere for quite some time. All metal parts were covered in a oiley waxey lubricant that was petroleum in nature but I have no idea what it was before it congealed. Cleaned up nice with a good blast of rubbing alcohol and gun scrubber. I share your feelings about a complete stripdown but this is the first case where a handgun required it that had come into my possession. I suppose if I fished a handgun out of the muck at the bottom of a river after it had been dropped there, it would need a complete tear apart but other then that, I had never even thought about it. Well, now I do.


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Crankster
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  #30  
Old 03-25-2019, 07:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shootin4Xs View Post
Where are you finding the slide stop/ejectors? I have a older 41 that needs one.
I got mine from Brownells. When I first looked they were out of stock and I checked on ebay and there was one that had a bidding war going on. Before the ebay one matured/expired, they were back in stock at brownells so I got one there while I could.

I would check brownells, numerich tandemcross, any of the other bullseye supply houses and then ebay and gunparts as well. Want to say I paid about fifty bucks for mine.

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Crankster
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