Advice needed. I hope I didn't ruin a new barrell. - RimfireCentral.com Forums

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  #1  
Old 03-29-2006, 11:38 PM
BobforBass

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Advice needed. I hope I didn't ruin a new barrell.



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Greetings gentlemen. I know there are a lot of gun owners that are much more knowledgable about my problem than I am. I need your opinions and suggestions.

I purchased a NIB T/C barrell in .17HMR several months ago. All excited about my new toy I mounted it on the frame but had no time to shoot because of work and weather. When I finally found some time to shoot a couple months later I was in a bit of a hurry. I took the gun to the farm and set my target at 50 yards and after bore sighting the Burris 2x7 scope I shot my first round. My target was mounted on a large heavy cardboard box. When I went to see if I was on the paper all I saw was a small long hole in the lower left corner of the paper. I looked for an exit hole but found none. Confused, I assumed the hole in the paper was there before I shot. So I went back, raised the scope and fired again. This time, upon inspection, I saw another small long hole higher up on the paper and this time there was an exit hole. I didn't understand what was happening. (now, after reading on this site, I know the bullet was keyholing) So I went back and fired another round. This time there was a small round hole where I was aiming. I ended up shooting about 20 rounds and then had to go inside. It was cold and very windy. Still confused about the first two shots I did a more detailed inspection of the target and box. I looked at the first hole and saw the bullet lodged between the two flaps of cardboard that makes up the end flap. I was shooting hollow points (I think they were CCI). The bullet tip was VERY slightly deformed and the whole length of the bullet was slightly flattend.

After going through what I did prior to taking the gun out I realized I had NEVER cleaned the barrell before firing.

What I need from you guys is your opinion as to weather or not I damaged the barrell and any suggestions on ways to determine if I did or not. I did take the gun out last weekend for the first time since the above incident. I did clean before shooting and shot about 15 round at 50 yards. My groups were around an inch but I had a terrible rest to shoot from and the wind was blowing pretty hard so I know I have a huge window for improvement from those two areas alone. I know I can shoot better than that when I get a good stead bench to shoot from and a calm day.

All opinions are welcome.

I am also posting this message on the T/C to get their advice as well.

In advance, thank you.

Bobforbas
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Old 03-30-2006, 09:18 AM
Old Hickory

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I think there is a good chance you may have damaged your bore. I would suggest, since you have cleaned it, continue to shoot it and see how it does. I would give the rifle and bore a good visual inspection before I did more shooting, though. Your damage may be minimal and not have much damage to your groups. Check your barrel crown for damage, too.
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Old 03-30-2006, 09:18 AM
Gut bomb

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Sorry bob but it's hard to believe .
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Old 03-30-2006, 09:24 AM
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cz452shooter

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Its hard to say if you damaged it or not. Try giving it another GOOD cleaning and try shooting it again with out any wind and from a good rest and see what your groups are like. The wind really affects the little 17 grain bullet, even at 50 yards.

Also, if you have a higher maginfication scope (such as a 6-24) try that.

Good luck
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Old 03-30-2006, 10:01 AM
bunny blaster

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I wouldn't worry too much!
Took mine straight out the shop and straight into the field and chucked aload through it, no problems.
Fired hundreds through it now and it still shoots amazing groups at 50m & 100 yards. Each to their own,but I cleaned mine after about 300 shots (felt I had to courtesy of all the cleaning hype that gets posted) and the accuracy went off for about 20 shots before she settled back down, right back into the grove.
Now I dont clean it until it's had about 500 through it, sick of watching tiny 50m groups move to 1" after using a bore snake
Not putting down others advice, but deffinatly don't pannic that you've ruined your new bit of kit.
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Old 03-30-2006, 10:02 AM
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Arrow

In my zeal, I often shoot new guns before cleaning the bore, and that has never happened to me. In fact, I too have the .17 T/C barrel, and probably shot it without first cleaning the bore. While a dirty bore may affect accuracy, it shouldn't cause keyholing. The only time I've experienced keyholing was with a Ruger New Model Bearcat, and the cause was a defective barrel, which Ruger gratuitiously replaced. My advice is to shoot again, and if it continues to keyhole, call T/C. Their customer service is good in my experience.
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Old 03-30-2006, 10:14 AM
BobforBass

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Thanks guys. I just realized I left out that the T/C barrell was for the original Contender pistol.

When you say to give the bore a good visual inspection what am I supposed to be looking for specifically? Also, for the crown?

The gun only keyholed for the first two shots. Every other shot has been as expected. I have no worrries that the gun will keyhole again. I have been told by a local gun shop owner that the barrells are coated in something called Cosmoline (sp?) as a rust preventative while in storage before being shipped. He said it is a heavy type grease. I assumed this must have gummed up in the barrell during the first two shots. Any info on this?

Again, thanks for the info.

Bob
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Old 03-30-2006, 10:40 AM
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Cardboard stoped your slug?????????? If so it wasnt the firearm , but I would say it was an Ammo problem..

2x4s dont stop 17hmr's

Last edited by Wheelock; 03-30-2006 at 11:04 AM.
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Old 03-30-2006, 11:54 AM
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Yeah that

Quote:
Originally Posted by ARobbins
Cardboard stoped your slug?????????? If so it wasnt the firearm , but I would say it was an Ammo problem..

2x4s dont stop 17hmr's
Keyholing is something I will see when the twist rate is way off for an ammo, like shooting a 60gr Aguila in a standard 1:16 22lr barrel.
In your instance, if the bullet were going super slow compared to normal travel, it might keyhole like that.
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Old 03-30-2006, 05:59 PM
Gut bomb

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I don't mean to call BS on this but the key holeing is hard enough to believe and then when you said you found the bullet intact and stuck in the cardboard box you were shooting at I started thinking that the only explanation was that you were shooting .17 hmr thru a .22 mag.barrel. That wouldn't be the case would it ?
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Old 03-30-2006, 06:10 PM
USA Varminter

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If the bore was packed w/ grease for shipping etc. It could cause keyholing perhaps, Give it a good cleaning, and treat it right.

I doubt you damaged. Imagine how many people never have cleaned a gun when the bought it, the companies know this, they're not shipping it w/ sand in there.
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Old 03-30-2006, 06:41 PM
BobforBass

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gut bomb
I don't mean to call BS on this but the key holeing is hard enough to believe and then when you said you found the bullet intact and stuck in the cardboard box you were shooting at I started thinking that the only explanation was that you were shooting .17 hmr thru a .22 mag.barrel. That wouldn't be the case would it ?
Like I said in the original post, the keyholing only happened on the first two shots ever fired through the barrell. Every shot since has been w/in an inch of my aim even using a poor bench and in windy conditions.

It is a .17HMR NOT a .22 mag.

You can call BS if you wish because how often do you find one of these fragile bullets completly intact. I was and still am amazed and shocked that it is in as pristine shape as it is and that I FOUND it at all. I still have the bullet and will attempt to post a pic of it. I have never tried to post pics so I'm sure I will be asking for help.

Bob
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Old 03-30-2006, 06:51 PM
BobforBass

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USA,

The barrell was not packed w/ grease because I bore sighted the scope to get on paper. As for the grease comment I made in the previous post, it was told to me by a local gun shop owner that had shot professionally for the military for over 30 years and trains several of the local police officers. I would beleive darn near anything he tells me concerning anything related to guns.

I'm beginning to think I haven't hurt the gun much if at all after reading some of the replies........which I do appreciate receiving.

Bob
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Old 03-30-2006, 09:06 PM
Gut bomb

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Sorry if I ofended you bob. I think the most likley reason for the key hole and wild spread with the first few shots is a small metal burr left when the muzzle crown was cut at the factory. After firing a shot or two the bullet cleaned the burr out. Now finding the bullet stuck in the box is a real puzzle. Cosmoline is a heavy grease like stuff that the military used to pack guns in for storage. I don't think too many modern gun co. use it any more. TC uses a light oil to pack new barrels. Shooting it before cleaning is not likley to cause any problems. Were not talking about a bench rest rifle.
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Old 03-30-2006, 10:23 PM
BobforBass

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Gut Bomb,

Your comments were not taken in a negative manner. I think I would call BS if someone told me they shot a cardboard box target at 50 yards w/ a .17hmr and found it between the flaps on the bottom of the box without actually witnessing it myself. I never mentioned in the post, but I do have one of my older brothers as a witness.

I would still like to know what exactly I would need to look for to see if there might be any damage. The bullet had to be going extreamly slow to be stopped by the first layer of cardboard. And to go that slow down the barrell, there had to be a heck of a lot more pressure built up inside than with the typical HMR.

An earlier reply suggested I give the bore a good inspection for any damage along with the crown. I just don't know what signs I'm supposed to look for. I'm sure if there was a huge crack I would be smart enough to know something was wrong but little signs would be another story.

Thanks for your reply.

Bob
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