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  #16  
Old 11-22-2018, 08:23 AM
kseatm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommyt654 View Post
Kenny,I think you might have missed my point in that it is possible to win without a custom built specific rifle.Regarding anyone getting butt-hurt I highly doubt anyone has ever.In fact like yourself most I know have said the exact same things they said to you to myself.

...but then then went looking to see what ammo I was using

In 1 particular case shown in the link below Grant Toman took 1st place with an Anshutz he had and I took 4th with my Suhl,both factory guns at the time.Was it repeatable,possibly,But we were there and it did happen.I agree whole heartedly a custom rifle will be far more accurate and give better scores overall in the long run.

https://www.americanrimfire.com/inde...h_results/3123


But in the end it really is about the ammo and barrel you have and how they interact together along with a combination of skills learned thru shooting your choice of rifle or at least that is what I have found.

Main thing is to have fun with it always.If it begins to become less fun and more of a money factor regarding the ammo search and right combination of rifle builder and barrel you aren't really using a skill set you are merely tossing money at a rabbit hole hoping you get the right combination to win.It can become rather expensive to do that

It is a major factor in why so many quit after a few seasons.They get frustrated they cannot win or compete because of the cost. I don't care either way as I shoot only against myself trying different combinations to see what works best in every match.Sometimes I do well others not so much.The skill level is there,but the money part isn't so I get what I paid for in the end.

It is and has been a money game for quite a while now.The big winners I would venture to say put $10K in ammo a yr on the low end and probably $4-6k in their rifles,another $1-2k in a rest and whatevers.In the end they only shoot about 4-600 points higher than a good shooting factory rifle is capable of doing consistently.

Is that worth the money,apparently to many it is,but at what time does it really become just money and less skill? JMHO
Tommy,
I think neither of us are explaining our ideas very well. I'm closer to your position than you think.

Bottom line, to me is that a person should just come to a match and shoot what they can comfortably afford to shoot. As long as their expectations match their equipment's potential, then they won't get discouraged and quit. That's really what it comes down to. Not many people come to these matches anymore. And I hate to see new people come to a match, get bummed about how they do, and you never see them again.

All the angst, all the stuff you read really is just noise to me personally. Have no qualms at all about who shoots and what they shoot. If it grows the sport, am all for it.

There's some good people in this. Wish more would come out and participate.

Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family. If you see Don Blue or Mike S down at Slick's next weekend don't pick at them. They're very serious

Kenny
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  #17  
Old 11-22-2018, 08:37 AM
tommyt654

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Will do Kenny,Wish you were comin,We'll meet someday I think,till then have a safe weekend and Happy Thanksgiving to you and yours
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  #18  
Old 11-22-2018, 08:43 AM
kseatm
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Originally Posted by tommyt654 View Post
Will do Kenny,Wish you were comin,We'll meet someday I think,till then have a safe weekend and Happy Thanksgiving to you and yours
If things fall right, will be down there at the end of the year. George Atkins and I are trying to make it work. Really want to see Bill's new place. Good luck at the Nationals.

Oh, only call Mike S "Hollywood". He won't answer to anything else anymore. As for Don, he's got a bunch of names. The Oracle, The Burning Bush, Osage Express, Blue Cube, BC lite, and now his latest...Buster Blue. I just call him Buster.

Kenny
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  #19  
Old 11-22-2018, 08:45 AM
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pump .22s
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommyt654 View Post
Kenny,I think you might have missed my point in that it is possible to win without a custom built specific rifle.Regarding anyone getting butt-hurt I highly doubt anyone has ever.In fact like yourself most I know have said the exact same things they said to you to myself.

...but then then went looking to see what ammo I was using

In 1 particular case shown in the link below Grant Toman took 1st place with an Anshutz he had and I took 4th with my Suhl,both factory guns at the time.Was it repeatable,possibly,But we were there and it did happen.I agree whole heartedly a custom rifle will be far more accurate and give better scores overall in the long run.

https://www.americanrimfire.com/inde...h_results/3123


But in the end it really is about the ammo and barrel you have and how they interact together along with a combination of skills learned thru shooting your choice of rifle or at least that is what I have found.

Main thing is to have fun with it always.If it begins to become less fun and more of a money factor regarding the ammo search and right combination of rifle builder and barrel you aren't really using a skill set you are merely tossing money at a rabbit hole hoping you get the right combination to win.It can become rather expensive to do that

It is a major factor in why so many quit after a few seasons.They get frustrated they cannot win or compete because of the cost. I don't care either way as I shoot only against myself trying different combinations to see what works best in every match.Sometimes I do well others not so much.The skill level is there,but the money part isn't so I get what I paid for in the end.

It is and has been a money game for quite a while now.The big winners I would venture to say put $10K in ammo a yr on the low end and probably $4-6k in their rifles,another $1-2k in a rest and whatevers.In the end they only shoot about 4-600 points higher than a good shooting factory rifle is capable of doing consistently.

Is that worth the money,apparently to many it is,but at what time does it really become just money and less skill? JMHO

I think you summed up some of my feelings about it, particularly with your comments about the money game. If you pursue ultimate accuracy as your ultimate goal, you better have pretty deep pockets....which I do not have. So, rather than chase that rabbit, I choose to chase what for me are more realistic goals......wringing the last ounce of accuracy out of factory rifles....and I am having a large time doing it. I see nothing wrong with that. Does it make me a second class shooter?......in some folks eyes perhaps, but not in my eyes. Life is too short to get wound up over such stuff. Do what you enjoy and what makes you happy.
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  #20  
Old 11-22-2018, 10:28 AM
tommyt654

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"Buster Blue. I just call him Buster'

Wonder where that came from")
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  #21  
Old 11-22-2018, 10:30 AM
tommyt654

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"Do what you enjoy and what makes you happy."

Exactly my sentiments as well,Happy Turkey Day to all
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  #22  
Old 11-22-2018, 12:55 PM
Ray1946
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Thanks to all for your comments, quite unique conversation! Great Turkey Day to all!...........
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  #23  
Old 11-22-2018, 04:17 PM
kseatm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommyt654 View Post
"Buster Blue. I just call him Buster'

Wonder where that came from")
Is that the one he did for you? I know he did a barrel and possibly a stock for your Suhl.

Actually the reason I call him Buster is at the last Indoor Nationals myself and Chuck Morrell were watching him through spotting scopes. Don was on fire the first two targets and was just wiping out x after x. Looked over at Chuck and said "Don's really busting those x's". So, I called him X Buster when he came back from the bench. From that, it morphed into Buster Blue.

One thing about these matches...you go, you shoot and you live with the results. I'm not a fan of indoor shooting. Too many odd things happen with no explanation. Don was a perfect example at the Nationals. First target, just blew it away. Same for the second. Third target, I'm thinking he shot 13 bulls for score before even hitting an x. Things just were wacko for him on that target. Same ammo, same gun, same conditions. Missed two shots on that last target and pretty much knocked him out of the race for the top.

Same thing Sunday in Meters. First two targets, he couldn't miss. Last target had one of those "why did that happen?" moments.

He still finished 9th, which in that crowd is something to be proud of. But honestly, the way he and that gun were shooting at first, thought for sure he was going to win the whole thing. But I guess quite a few others probably had the same thing happen to them. Just the joys of indoor shooting...

You've never personally met Don have you? He's one of the good guys in this. So is Hollywood. Am lucky I get to shoot with them all the time. Have Hollywood tell the cleaning rod story. You'll laugh your butt off. But any of his stories are funny.

Kenny
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  #24  
Old 11-22-2018, 05:47 PM
tommyt654

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"Is that the one he did for you? I know he did a barrel and possibly a stock for your Suhl"

Yup,thats the one I named it for Don and my best dog Buster who had recently passed on the bridge to doggone heaven.It was a great rifle to shoot ,but I never could get it to do as much as I thought it was capable of doing so I let it go elsehwere to let somebody else try their luck with her.Its a great rifle as was my dog

Brad has her now and I'm sure he'll make a go with her better than I could

I'm lookin forward to finally meeting some of the gang.I have met Tractor George and he's a fine fellow,sure the others are as well,We'll see them this upcoming weekend,sad you can't come but as we both said "It's gunna happen sooner er later"
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  #25  
Old 12-05-2018, 08:44 PM
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Yep. Me and Tommy shot a couple factory gun cards at Slick’s. I ain’t gonna lie. I believe it is more fun than the unlimited. I don’t know , something about how smooth and heavy my Anschutz match 54 is on the rest. And it will flat out shoot. One guy beat me. But I think that is the only guns he shot and probably had some select ammo. I was just shooting some ammo I had for another gun. I can’t remember how many shooters we had , but seems we had several.

Last edited by Highdollar; 12-06-2018 at 08:23 PM.
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  #26  
Old 12-06-2018, 02:25 AM
kseatm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Highdollar View Post
Yep. Me and Tommy shot a couple factory gun cards at Slickís. I ainít gonna lie. I believe it is more fun than the unlimited. I donít know , something about how smooth and heavy my Anchutz match 54 is on the rest. And it will flat out shoot. One guy beat me. But I think that is the only guns he shot and probably had some select ammo. I was just shooting some ammo I had for another gun. I canít remember how many shooters we had , but seems we had several.
Hey, we met at the Triple Crown last year! You're a great shooter!

And you're right that it's a blast to shoot the old stuff. No matter the type of match it's just a fun thing to me personally. Sometimes more fun than my full on custom rifle. Suppose it's the idea that you're finishing ahead of people with much more money in their equipment. Or, you just enjoy shooting no matter what you use

Hope to run into you again down the road. Will be at the Triple Crown this spring.

Kenny
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  #27  
Old 12-06-2018, 10:31 AM
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Kenny didnt say it, I dont believe--just go to matches and try to beat yourself..

You can always better your own best score..
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  #28  
Old 12-06-2018, 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted by kseatm View Post
Hey, we met at the Triple Crown last year! You're a great shooter!

And you're right that it's a blast to shoot the old stuff. No matter the type of match it's just a fun thing to me personally. Sometimes more fun than my full on custom rifle. Suppose it's the idea that you're finishing ahead of people with much more money in their equipment. Or, you just enjoy shooting no matter what you use

Hope to run into you again down the road. Will be at the Triple Crown this spring.

Kenny
Yes we met. I will be seeing you guys hopefully at the triple crown. And at Slickís. I would like to get up to yalls club and shoot too one of these days. Most all of the old suhl bunch is shooting pretty seriously.
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  #29  
Old 12-07-2018, 05:01 AM
tommyt654

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Highdollar View Post
Yep. Me and Tommy shot a couple factory gun cards at Slickís. I ainít gonna lie. I believe it is more fun than the unlimited. I donít know , something about how smooth and heavy my Anschutz match 54 is on the rest. And it will flat out shoot. One guy beat me. But I think that is the only guns he shot and probably had some select ammo. I was just shooting some ammo I had for another gun. I canít remember how many shooters we had , but seems we had several.

That was fun,I wish Bill would let us shoot an Indoor Factory match.I got a 37 that shot a couple of 1950's off a bipod(1st time for me) a coupla months ago at the outdoor range on a breezy day with I'd like to try there

Your right about the Suhl gang tho

Top 10 ARA Indoor at Bill's place
2500X
2500X
2500X
Turbo
Suhl
10X
Suhl
Suhl
Suhl
10X

Mike Cameron shot his 1st ever 2500 (hard to believe) this past weekend there with "New Blue",maybe I shoulda kept "Blue Buster"
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  #30  
Old 02-03-2019, 04:59 AM
Abigkidagain
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Originally Posted by kseatm View Post
Tommy,
I think neither of us are explaining our ideas very well. I'm closer to your position than you think.

Bottom line, to me is that a person should just come to a match and shoot what they can comfortably afford to shoot. As long as their expectations match their equipment's potential, then they won't get discouraged and quit. That's really what it comes down to. Not many people come to these matches anymore. And I hate to see new people come to a match, get bummed about how they do, and you never see them again.

All the angst, all the stuff you read really is just noise to me personally. Have no qualms at all about who shoots and what they shoot. If it grows the sport, am all for it.

There's some good people in this. Wish more would come out and participate.

Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family. If you see Don Blue or Mike S down at Slick's next weekend don't pick at them. They're very serious

Kenny
Kenny,
The bolded and blue is me right now. I shot my first rimfire benchrest match today with pump 22 as the rangemaster. It was wonderful and all the people were generous with advice and equipment I did not have. However, I can not see not using my bipod and a shot bag in the rear but instead having to spend more money on front and back rests. heck, one guy I asked there today said he spent $1,000 just on his one-piece unit.

I would rather use my bipod and a shot bag, but being a noob, I need to read the rules to see if i can. I did read on this thread someone had. My ears perked up when i read that. I have all kinds of steel shot in my shed and the bags it came in. I think it would be relatively easy to custom make a shot bag for the rear rest with a 4x4.

I may not win, but I will feel a whole lot better and have more fun. But then again, I might score something respectable.

I would rather put my money into really nice ammo. I learned this makes a quantum difference.

Dave
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