Anschutz 1727/1427/54 Sporter Hybrid: Resourcefulness or Sacrilege? - RimfireCentral.com Forums

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  #1  
Old 07-17-2017, 11:04 AM
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TEDDY BEAR RAT
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Question Anschutz 1727/1427/54 Sporter Hybrid: Resourcefulness or Sacrilege?



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Like many of you, I am always perusing EBay and other online auction houses for hard-to-find rifle-related items, and I recently stumbled onto an ad from our own Anschutz expert, Andyd, for a very nice 1727 stock sans hardware. Like all the 1727 stocks, this one was obviously hand selected for figure and showed beautiful mineral streaking and fiddleback throughout. The price seemed reasonable, but I don't own a 1727 and probably never will. Nonetheless, that European styling and beautiful figure really got the creative juices flowing, and I started to ask myself, "Surely I can find some way to buy and use that stock, right?!" I did a good bit of research, looking at images and also asking Andy a number of dimension-related questions, and finally concluded that I could probably make it work on my 1427 that I rebarreled and to which I added a 5071 trigger. Here are some older pics of it with the original trigger. It's a Lilja Brno #1 contour barrel chambered using a Lilja 1.5 Degree Match reamer. It's also unique in that it features the "Match" action but is a repeater, much like a 54:18 MSR:







So, jumping to the chase, I had determined that the receiver diameter for the 1727 and for the other "54" actions, including the 1427 Biathlon rifles, were the same. I also felt pretty certain that the spacing and location of the action screw holes were also the same for the 1727 and the Match 54 actions.

What I knew would not match would be, 1) the barrel channel, since the 1727 barrel was considerably larger than the Lilja sporter barrel, and the 1727 uses a washer-style recoil lug, and the stock is inletted accordingly, 2) the area where the bolt would pivot down into the stock, since the 1727 is a straight-pull design, and 3) the rear receiver tang area, since the older 54 Match receivers were machined to be narrower there, and the 1727s were not. I was also pretty sure there would be bottom metal issues, but I was prepared to make a trigger guard from scratch, if needed.

All of the above turned out to be accurate, but a few more areas will also require attention. Namely, the 5071 trigger extends a bit further back than the 5018-like trigger found on the 1727s. This was a surprise but not a big problem, as relieving that area in the stock poses no problem at all. Another surprise was the bolt release will require slight relieving, another minor point. Fortunately, the safety recess on the left of the stock mates perfectly with the safety on the 5071 trigger. Ya gotta love Anschutz for keep things common, right? Oh, and the flag safety on the bolt of the 1427 will require a bit of stock relieving as well.

So, on the barrel channel, I plan to turn down a piece of dark walnut to closely match the channel of the stock, to include a shoulder to fill the recoil lug gap. That walnut turning will be glued into the barrel channel, machined flat to match the top of the stock, and then inletted to match the barrel contour like any other barrel channel. I am certain I can do this well enough no one would be able to tell what was done without removing it from the stock.

Also, machining flat the area under which the bolt handle reciprocates and adding a black ebony piece to allow cutting of a nice notch for the standard bolt handle should be fairly easy to accomplish. I decided trying to match the wood grain and color would look like poo, so I think I'll take the jet-black ebony approach. Same with the rear tang: a small ebony insert on the stock around the tang will give the stock a more finished look.

Where I need some help is the bottom metal. I am hopeful that the mortise for the bottom metal on the 1727 is the same as that used on the 1700 series sporters, and that the same bottom metal can be used, even if the holes are not all there. I was hoping someone who owns both could take some measurements or post some pics of both so I can compare. I understand the trigger opening may also need some adjustment. I'd rather use or modify original Anschutz bottom metal but am prepared to make my own, if needed.

I would post some pics of the barreled action in the stock, which actually looks very nice, but with the current PhotoBucket outrage, I'm not sure what to do.

Now, relieving the inletting for the larger 5071 trigger is easy peasy and won't impact this stock's usability for use on another 1727 rifle, but everything else I would need to do would be irreversible. So, part of me says, "Someone is going to need another stock for his shiny 1727, likely costing $700 - $800 from Anschutz, and here I am butchering this one." On the other hand, most of me says, "Just a blank with this figure would cost more than I paid for this finished stock, and I'm certain I can make this not only work, but also look very good." There's the dilemma.

I know many would say, "TBR, just make another stock from scratch and save that replacement stock for someone who needs it!" But, remember, "just" making a stock from scratch would take more time than I have, and the projects are really piling up on me. Anyone who has made a stock from a blank will know exactly what I'm talking about. I am highly inclined to get the Anschutz finished and available for squirrel sniping a soon as possible.

I look forward to you responses.

TBR
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Old 07-17-2017, 06:01 PM
Alter Rostig

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Bottom metal

From the 1700 series likely will not fit, though I can't say for sure. Bottom metal from a 1422 will not work. You can get 1727 bottom metal from ANA.
Looking forward to seeing and reading about your progress.
Jack
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Old 07-17-2017, 09:14 PM
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TBR, your projects -- and the end results -- are always fascinating and impressive. Not unlike ek-marlin and his stocks. The talent and skills hereabouts continue to amaze. Will be watching this one!

Doug
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Old 07-17-2017, 09:40 PM
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TBR

Because this thread is about an exceptional stock being reworked, wouldn't it make it more interesting to have a photo of the stock.
I did see your PhotoBucket issue, but you can post a photo on here in many different ways.

However, my much bigger question is why do you want a 1727F stock?

I have both a 1727F and a 1727F-22 and I love them both, but the stocks for me are best suited to field use.

So what's the attraction.

I will of course watch your progression and workmanship with great interest, and admiration.
(Crap, I'm happy when I remove a action screw without dingy the screw, or the stock.)

So I'm just curious.

Smooth

Last edited by Smoothtrigger; 07-17-2017 at 09:54 PM.
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Old 07-17-2017, 11:15 PM
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I guess I'm the one that doesn't understand, or my explanation was lacking. I didn't want a 1727 stock. I simply couldn't resist buying a beautiful Anschutz stock that was available for a good price and that also happened to be for a 1727 and decided to make it work for another project rifle I have.
I also thought I explained the lack of photos. In the end, despite all the rage, though, I see no difference in my PB account, so here are some pics:










TBR

Last edited by TEDDY BEAR RAT; 06-14-2018 at 06:47 PM.
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Old 07-17-2017, 11:47 PM
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Kent,

just go ahead and do it! I am absolutely positive that you can make this work and that the results will be stunning. I had bought the stock actually for myself to get a 1727 but a couple of Korths go in the financial path.

I wanted to ask you, or Rick, since a few days if he sent you the trigger plates?

As to Photobucket, they killed my account and I am using Imgur and Google Photos now, Google requires to change the link to imbed it on websites but I have more trust in Google as a longer-term solution.

Here's the link to the conversion website: https://ctrlq.org/google/photos/?_ga...351.1500269585

Last edited by Andyd; 07-17-2017 at 11:50 PM.
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Old 07-18-2017, 02:44 AM
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TBR,

The housings of 5071 and 5018 triggers should be exactly the same size externally. The issue may be trigger location on the receiver and sear position.
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Old 07-18-2017, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TEDDY BEAR RAT View Post
.....Where I need some help is the bottom metal. I am hopeful that the mortise for the bottom metal on the 1727 is the same as that used on the 1700 series sporters, and that the same bottom metal can be used, even if the holes are not all there. I was hoping someone who owns both could take some measurements or post some pics of both so I can compare. I understand the trigger opening may also need some adjustment. I'd rather use or modify original Anschutz bottom metal but am prepared to make my own, if needed.
Do you have access to a 1710/1712 who's bottom metal you can overlay the bottom of your stock, in the event a comparison of the two receivers doesn't happen?
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Old 07-18-2017, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tim slater View Post
TBR,

The housings of 5071 and 5018 triggers should be exactly the same size externally. The issue may be trigger location on the receiver and sear position.
Yes, this is my understanding, as well. There was about 3/16" difference in positions, with the 5071 mounted on the 1427 receiver being further aft by that amount, and so you may be right about it being the position on the receiver and not the trigger housing itself. On the other hand, I believe the triggers in the 1727s are not true 5018s, although the geometry may be essentially the same, so the housings may differ. I know there is a different numerical designation for the 1727 trigger. The thing is the trigger safety position looks bang on in the stock .

On the bottom metal, if I had a 1710/1712 trigger guard in hand, I would compare them. That's why I was asking for pics from someone owning both. I guess the point is moot, if I can get bottom metal for a 1727 from ANA. I'll make that call today. Given the possible more forward positioning of the 1727 trigger, however, I may be back to making my own bottom metal. I'll just have to see about the trigger position in relation to the bottom metal.

Andy, I didn't see a trigger plate in the box, and, frankly, I forgot to look. I'll check on it tonight.

Also, I failed to mention that the extended magazine housing and release on the 1427 Biathlon rifle will be replaced, lest anyone think I would try to retain those. I also took those pics last night, without installing the front sight hood, in case someone was wondering about the odd front sight ramp.

TBR

Last edited by TEDDY BEAR RAT; 07-18-2017 at 10:25 AM.
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Old 07-18-2017, 10:53 AM
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Line was busy at ANA, but I found this picture comparing the actions. Looks like Tim was correct about the trigger just being positioned more forward on the receiver, although it looks to be only about 1/8". That does not bode well for 1727 bottom metal working out on this rifle, but a 1/8" relief might be doable.



TBR

Last edited by TEDDY BEAR RAT; 07-26-2018 at 03:58 PM.
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Old 07-18-2017, 11:11 AM
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Now, I'm not so sure. It's hard to make precise measurements on my computer screen, but they may be dimensionally dead on . The good news is I made contact with ANA, and a trigger guard, trigger plate, and screw are headed my way. It was much cheaper than expected, so I hope they are the right parts . I ordered some other parts from ANA awhile back that were not correct. We shall see.

TBR
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Old 07-18-2017, 11:44 AM
Alter Rostig

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I ordered my parts some time ago and they were

All perfect. Did you order or do you have the regular magazine well? My older model 1827 would not drop into the 1727 stock with the ten round mag well. Trigger placement was fine with my rifle. I still haven't fixed the spot to the rear of the bolt. I was thinking rosewood but might get a piece of it and of ebony to see which looks best with my stock.
Jack
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Old 07-18-2017, 11:48 AM
Alter Rostig

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Also

Screws for current 1727 s are 5 mm, whereas my rifle required 6 mm. Had to order some from J& P.
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Old 07-18-2017, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alter Rostig View Post
Screws for current 1727 s are 5 mm, whereas my rifle required 6 mm. Had to order some from J& P.
Ditto. I had already ordered and have in hand the larger 6mm screws from J&P. If you look at the foregoing picture, it appears the 1727 screws have a larger shank but are turned down on the threaded portion. Dunno. The problem was/is the height, however, since I didn't have a stock at the time. I had J&P thread them much further down the shank, in case I need to shorten them, but now I'm worried I had them made too short overall, judging from how they fit in the stock without bottom metal. We'll see. I also noticed ANA has 6mm action screws available for the "Match" action for $35/set, although the picture appears to indicate non-threaded shanks .

Just contacted ANA again to confirm the order was for bottom metal for a 1727F and, sure enough, it was for the .17 HMR version, not the .22 LR version I had stipulated. Glad I called back. I'm still just a bit concerned the bottom metal is for the 64-actioned sporters, though. I also noticed the mortise in the 1727 stock is awfully shallow, shallower, it seems, than the 1700-series sporter bottom metal, but that may be my imagination.

TBR
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Old 07-18-2017, 04:29 PM
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Another TBR project! Cool.......

If anyone can make this work, I'm confident you can do it. Looking forward to the finished results.

Thanks for allowing the rest of us to enjoy this build....even if it is vicariously.
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