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Old 04-26-2017, 04:54 PM
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CZ527 American M1 .223



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I have a CZ527 American M1 (flush mag) in .223. It has a 1:9 twist. I'm hoping that someone here has "experimented" -- I also have a lot of 40 gr. bullets -- Nosler Ballistic Tip and Hornady V-Max. The 1:9 is supposed to be able to stabilize 45 to 68 gr. bullets. But given the superior ballistic coefficient of these bullets (compared to the typical 45 gr. soft point), what are the chances that this barrel will shoot these 40gr. bullets well?

Doug
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Old 04-26-2017, 05:19 PM
B23
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The 223 isn't really a hot rod cartridge so that 1-9tw barrel isn't going to over spin a 40gr bullet and cause you any problems.

Personally, I think a 1-9tw is about the perfect twist for a 223. I have a few 223's with 1-9tw barrels and they shot the 40's extremely well. My 223 Ackley Improved has a 1-9tw barrel and though I mostly only shoot the 53gr Vmax in it I've shot a few 40 grainers in it as well and they shot extremely well and it shoots about 100fps faster than a standard 223.
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Old 04-26-2017, 05:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbr65 View Post
I have a CZ527 American M1 (flush mag) in .223. It has a 1:9 twist. I'm hoping that someone here has "experimented" -- I also have a lot of 40 gr. bullets -- Nosler Ballistic Tip and Hornady V-Max. The 1:9 is supposed to be able to stabilize 45 to 68 gr. bullets. But given the superior ballistic coefficient of these bullets (compared to the typical 45 gr. soft point), what are the chances that this barrel will shoot these 40gr. bullets well?

Doug
I have this same rifle (tupperware stock version). Sorry, can't speak first hand to the 40-grainers, but it's OK with 50-grainers. I suspect if you load it down some it will be fine. My factory barrel doesn't shoot very well with any bullet weight. I'm going to rebarrel it with a Krieger & will stick with the 9 twist. I also picked up a very nice ClaroX walnut stock for half price at Boyd's clearance corner. DJ will bed & pillar it for me & install a RifleBasic trigger, as I'm not real fond of set triggers.
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Old 04-26-2017, 07:22 PM
B23
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Originally Posted by SWUtah View Post
I suspect if you load it down some it will be fine.
Curious, why do you believe you'd need to "load it down"??
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Old 04-26-2017, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by B23 View Post
Curious, why do you believe you'd need to "load it down"??
You might not need to do that at all, but the problem with fast twist barrels shooting light bullets at high velocities is that fast velocity = fast rotational speed of the bullet, and in some instances, the bullet can rotate faster than the bullet itself can handle and the bullet can actually disintegrate in flight. "Loading down", meaning lower powder charges, will lower the velocity and thus lower the rotational speed of the bullet. The only way to find out for sure is to load & fire some rounds.

Last edited by SWUtah; 04-26-2017 at 08:32 PM.
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Old 04-26-2017, 09:12 PM
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Doug: I have a Savage 12 with a 1:7 twist that shoots 40 grain Hornady V-max into good groups at 100 yards. I think you'll be fine with 1:9 (which to me is sort of a good all-around twist rate).
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Old 04-26-2017, 11:30 PM
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Originally Posted by SWUtah View Post
You might not need to do that at all, but the problem with fast twist barrels shooting light bullets at high velocities is that fast velocity = fast rotational speed of the bullet, and in some instances, the bullet can rotate faster than the bullet itself can handle and the bullet can actually disintegrate in flight. "Loading down", meaning lower powder charges, will lower the velocity and thus lower the rotational speed of the bullet. The only way to find out for sure is to load & fire some rounds.
In something like a 223 I doubt there is any bullet you could make come apart in just about any twist barrel. This is typically more of an issue with larger caliber bullets and no so much with smaller.
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Old 04-27-2017, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by B23 View Post
In something like a 223 I doubt there is any bullet you could make come apart in just about any twist barrel. This is typically more of an issue with larger caliber bullets and no so much with smaller.
You're probably right. The general rule I've always gone by is, for best accuracy, use the slowest twist that will stabilize the bullet.
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  #9  
Old 04-27-2017, 04:45 PM
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The cheap Fiocchi 40 grain V-MAx shoots really well in my M1 American (1 in 12") . It also shoots well in what I have (several bolts, ARs ,EBRs, .etc) up to 1 in 8 twist.

As far as loads I've made up, all of the 1 in 12 twists seem to prefer less than 55 grainers for utmost accuracy. 52 grain Bergers shoot REALLY well in them too. 62 grainers work well in my 1 in 9".

40 grainers in 1 in 9 ought to work as well as anything else...
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Old 04-27-2017, 07:53 PM
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I much appreciate the replies. It sounds like the 40 g. BTs and V-Max are likely to do fine in my CZ. There were a couple comments (here and in the CZ/Brno rimfire forum) that the 40 gr. wouldn't stabilize, so there may be some variation rifle-to-rifle. I guess I'll have to find out.

Doug
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Old 04-27-2017, 09:20 PM
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It's all about bullet construction and bore condition.

I've had fine accuracy and no issues with 40gr NBT's, V-maxs, Blitzkings, and Sierra HP's in 1 in 8" 223 barrels. I agree with B23 that any contemporary bullet shot from a 223 should hold up well and can be very accurate in a faster twist barrel.

However, I've seen a bullet like the 50gr Hornady SPSX (super explosive) vaporize on way to target when shot at higher velocity from a fast twist 22-250.
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