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  #76  
Old 01-19-2016, 06:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1srelluc View Post

Pretty ingenious how the mag tube doubles as a stock bolt isn't it?
Yep, these Winchester engineers (T C Johnson designed the '03/63) were on the ball, always looking for not only what worked but what could be produced and marketed at best profit. It didn't always work out. We will never ever know about all of the great guns through the years that, for reasons of costs or machining difficulty or pure reluctance on the part of the Top Brass, never came to market. If you study your Winchester history, you'll find out that the company had just recently lost the services of John Moses Browning (over a semiauto shotgun design which they refused to pay a royalty per gun for), and would have probably spent a fortune getting the 03 to market, if only to prove they could design great guns without him. Shotguns, uh, not so much. The 03 and later 63 were expensive to produce, and their quality reflects the investment made initially by the company to maintain their leadership position in the industry.
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Last edited by 22AGS; 01-23-2016 at 06:09 AM.
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  #77  
Old 01-22-2016, 10:39 PM
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I got my recoil and plunger springs in today and installed them.

There was not much difference in the recoil spring that I could tell but I really noticed the improved performance of the loading plunger after I installed the new plunger spring.

It's a rather thin spring and I guess it was just a bit tired after 69 years.
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  #78  
Old 01-23-2016, 06:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1srelluc View Post
I got my recoil and plunger springs in today and installed them.

There was not much difference in the recoil spring that I could tell but I really noticed the improved performance of the loading plunger after I installed the new plunger spring.

It's a rather thin spring and I guess it was just a bit tired after 69 years.
You kidding? I'm only 61 and am already tired!
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  #79  
Old 01-23-2016, 07:33 AM
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LOL...I'm right there with you on that! At least you won't have to move 3' of snow like I will later today.

BTW....I made me a spanner and removed the butt-stock and as suspected there was some cleaning to do. No worries as it was a easy job and everything went back together fine.

I did remove the scope/mount and put four 8-40 plug screws in the holes.
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  #80  
Old 01-23-2016, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 22AGS View Post
Yep, these Winchester engineers (T C Johnson designed the '03/63) were on the ball, always looking for not only what worked but what could be produced and marketed at best profit. It didn't always work out. We will never ever know about all of the great guns through the years that, for reasons of costs or machining difficulty or pure reluctance on the part of the Top Brass, never came to market. If you study your Winchester history, you'll find out that the company had just recently lost the services of John Moses Browning (over a semiauto shotgun design which they refused to pay a royalty per gun for), and would have probably spent a fortune getting the 03 to market, if only to prove they could design great guns without him. Shotguns, uh, not so much. The 03 and later 63 were expensive to produce, and their quality reflects the investment made initially by the company to maintain their leadership position in the industry.

I've wondered for a long time how the lever action Model 1890 would have worked out....
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  #81  
Old 01-23-2016, 08:33 AM
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Now that John Browning was brought up you keyed me ON.

John designed all the following iconic guns, and more not mentioned, for Winchester:
1885 single shot, 1886 lever, 1892 lever, 1895 lever, 1894 (Model 94) lever, 1890/03 pump. The auto shotgun rejected by Winchester was later made in Europe by FN and then in America by Remington. All these guns worked as designed and sold very well indeed.

Here is how he did it. He designed the gun in his head not on paper. When he was satisfied that he had a complete gun in his head, his brother made the prototypes under John's directions. He would then present the prototypes to Winchester for which they got him the patents and paid him a single fee. Winchester bought the rights to the guns. When he wanted royalties for the auto shotgun, Winchester balked and John walked away. Winchester engineers with John's help reversed engineered the purchased prototypes and made minor changes to make them into manufacturable products. While the Winchester engineers were good engineers John Browning was a gun genius. He had no engineering training and in fact he had just an equivalent high school education given in a one room school house in Utah. His education stopped when the teacher had run out of knowledge to impart. He continued designing guns until his death while designing the High Power pistol. He had also worked with Colt on machine guns and of course the iconic 1911 pistol.

My point is John Browning genius of gun design should not be diminished to any degree. I do not think there has been and may never be another like him for gun design. Johnson may have been a good gun engineer but he most certainly is not in the same league as John Browning for innovative gun designs.

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  #82  
Old 01-23-2016, 09:00 AM
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No argument LD on the genius of Moses, and thank you for not giving him the credit, as is commonly done, for the gun this thread was started for. You got me for a minute when you said '03' pump, meaning the O6.
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  #83  
Old 01-23-2016, 09:21 AM
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I knew the pump started as the 1890 and I have one of those (an excellent accurate shooter that is not a collectable as it has a shortened Winchester installed replaced 18 inch barrel that makes it more handy than the long original barrel, was re-blued some time many decades ago, and was new in 1926). But I could not remember the subsequent models and was too lazy to get the books out. When I Googled 1890 I got 1890/03. I am not sure that is right...I'd have to go to my Winchester books to determine that.

I can not afford to buy a real Model 63 so I have the Taurus stainless steel clone bought for its looks in a moment of lust. It is not ideal and it took a little home gunsmithing to get it to be reliable. It is not all that accurate either. It is typical Taurus, spit and polish look good at a distance but lacking in reliable operation and accuracy. I'd replace the Taurus with a real Model 63 given the chance if the price was at all reasonable and the gun not beat up. As a side note, I had a Rossi 22 pump clone and while it was operationally good, it was horrible for accuracy. I also have had a couple other Taurus guns and they always seem to have a problem or two. I have lots of guns but the Taurus/Rossi guns are just not up to par with the others. Taurus/Rossi are not in my future buy list.

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  #84  
Old 02-09-2016, 09:43 AM
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Steel versus Plastic Forearm Cap discussion

Guys have a difficult time, understandably, accepting that the last of the model 63's had plastic as one of the components. Here's a discussion.


https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums...d.php?t=618569
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  #85  
Old 09-23-2016, 08:34 AM
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Excellent write up on the 63

https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums...d.php?t=579338
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