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  #16  
Old 01-17-2006, 09:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomo4me
12 posts this thread?

Where is the outrage? Where are the droves of Winchester fanatics pulling at their hair?


Seems Winchester's last gasp will be the muted note of a popgun.

That's kind of surreal, but not difficult to believe.
There is no outrage, this is just plain sad. Winchester is an American Icon, like Ford, John Wayne and Baseball. Everything that made America what it is today is dissapearing.
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  #17  
Old 01-17-2006, 09:30 PM
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If you look at my assortment of guns, I can see why Winchester may be closing as I don't own a single Winchester rifle. May have to change that in the coming months though. Would like one of their trapper models.

The whole thing is sad. But it is not over until its over. Colt has closed it doors more than once and there have been buyers. It really depends on the price. We'll see.
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  #18  
Old 01-17-2006, 10:06 PM
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No heritage, no tradition, no pride, NOT AMERICAN, NO SALE! Brian.
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  #19  
Old 01-17-2006, 11:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bolsen2
No heritage, no tradition, no pride, NOT AMERICAN, NO SALE! Brian.
Is there a difference then between buying a pre-64 model 70 and buying a CZ rifle?
Either way you aren't supporting the American workforce.

Nomo
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  #20  
Old 01-18-2006, 06:20 AM
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This is sad but I don't feel personaly affected. As Nomo points out, and I feel correctly, I am the problem. I haven't bought a new Winchester since 2002. I don't feel new products are worth the price. Weather it be automotive, domestic living or recreational, the older items are the value for the dollar.
As ASA points out, might we ask Winchester,"Why are you closing?" I always give my buisiness to American products first when the quality is there. But you have to EARN my dollar. Brad
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  #21  
Old 01-18-2006, 06:21 AM
rcpilotjae
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Well....It was on the national news this morning making it official. Winchester is defunct. All production will stop and the plant will close shortly. It is indeed sad, not only for the heritage of the weapons made by Winchester but how about all the folks that will be losing their jobs?
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  #22  
Old 01-18-2006, 07:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcpilotjae
Well....It was on the national news this morning making it official. Winchester is defunct. All production will stop and the plant will close shortly. It is indeed sad, not only for the heritage of the weapons made by Winchester but how about all the folks that will be losing their jobs?
You see, this is what you get when you have elected officials that suport "Free Trade" like N.A.F.T.A , C.A.F.T.A., and G.A.T.T.

DAVID
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  #23  
Old 01-18-2006, 07:56 AM
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I can now see that Winchester's are going to go up in price.

Get one while you can!
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  #24  
Old 01-18-2006, 08:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRS
You see, this is what you get when you have elected officials that suport "Free Trade" like N.A.F.T.A , C.A.F.T.A., and G.A.T.T.

DAVID
Not to take too contentious a tone, but what does Nafta have to do with the fact that most shooters these days don't want to buy a new winchester??

Ruger is doing fine, as are Savage, Benelli, Beretta, TC etc etc.

Whatever was Winchester's undoing, they did it to themselves.

Remington is next up, IMO.

Nomo

Last edited by nomo4me; 01-18-2006 at 08:54 AM.
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  #25  
Old 01-18-2006, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomo4me
Not to take too contentious a tone, but what does Nafta have to do with the fact that most shooters these days don't want to buy a new winchester??

Ruger is doing fine, as are Savage, Benelli, Beretta, TC etc etc.

Whatever was Winchester's undoing, they did it to themselves.

Remington is next up, IMO.

Nomo
Any Company can ship its manufacturing overseas or to Mexico due to cheap labor costs. The other gun companies are not doing very well also, and you are most likely right about Remington, but that will be several years down the road unless something is done to reverse this trend. As far as what Winchester has done; in my opinion Winchester made their biggest mistake back in 1957 when they stop making some very popular firearms. Then next BIG mistake was when they redesigned their Excellent "Pre" 1964 Model 70's.
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  #26  
Old 01-18-2006, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRS
You see, this is what you get when you have elected officials that suport "Free Trade" like N.A.F.T.A , C.A.F.T.A., and G.A.T.T.DAVID
There is so much wrong with that statement....I hardly know where to start. Like most companies that have gone under, Winchester's demise is a combination of Lawyers, Unions, and not being competitive for the shooters dollars.

Last edited by Rembrandt; 01-18-2006 at 10:18 AM.
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  #27  
Old 01-18-2006, 10:33 AM
nomo4me
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rembrandt
Like most companies that have gone under, Winchester's demise is a combination of Lawyers, Unions, and not being competitive for the shooters dollars.
No, the fact was Winchester busied themselves making a bunch of stuff people don't want.
Need proof? Go here http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/cdnn/CDNN2005-5.pdf
CDNN is a overstock clearinghouse for quality goods that aren't moving. In that catalog you will find 26 Winchester rifles. You will find 2 CZ rifles. You will find 1 Ruger rifle.
26 rifles that Winchester had to bear the R&D costs for. 26 Rifles that sucked the profit margins out of that part of their product line they were making money on.

Winchester did themselves in by not knowing how to manufacture for the American market. Why couldn't they do it when so many others can? I dunno. Maybe they never got over the stigma of the 1964 trip to the toilet.

Nomo
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  #28  
Old 01-18-2006, 10:44 AM
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I just saw a thing on MSNBC. The local officials are trying to find someone to buy the company. I'm sure they will offer tax incentives and all those other things that can be offered to companies to do business. I suspect that it is too early to think we will never see another new Winchester. I have never been a big fan of their current crop of firearms. They started going down hill since 1894 to my way of thinking.

I own one Winchester, a Mod 1200 20 Ga that was left to me by my father and was later fitter to me by a gunsmith/competitor/magician. NOTHING fits like a gun personally fitted to you by someone that REALLY knows their stuff. I will keep it forever.
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  #29  
Old 01-18-2006, 10:46 AM
rcpilotjae
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Gotta' agree with the main consensus that Winchester didn't market what folks wanted. That (IMO) was their down fall. You've got to give the people what they want at a reasonable price and you'll end up making a few bucks.

It's a shame to see them go as they have a ton of history, but this didn't carry them into and through modern times which falls back to they didn't keep up with what folks wanted.

And we're all probably right in saying other manufactures are on there way out. Same thing, they're not producing the firearms folks want. No, we're not out shooting our laser guns (yet), but IMO these manufactures had better get with it and follow modern trends or they're going to find themselves losing.
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  #30  
Old 01-18-2006, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomo4me
No, the fact was Winchester busied themselves making a bunch of stuff people don't want.Nomo
We're on the same page Nomo, that's what I meant by "not being competitive for the shooters dollars". Their market research should have shown where the demand was. Interesting that Smith & Wesson now has a 1911 pistol and is introducing a line of AR rifles this year. Wasn't that long ago everyone was ready send S&W to the bottom of the ocean.

The "Winchester" trade name has too much history, tradition, and value to let it fade away...I'm sure it will be restructured for today's shooting market....hopefully for the better.
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