Older T-Bolt Questions

[Clinton]

Howdy Gents,
I also have another question regarding the serial number on a Belgium made Grade 2 T-Bolt that I bought in Dec., 1985, serial #X710003?. What prompted me to have a closer look at mine was the mention of salt-wood T-Bolt stocks in another recent thread. In all these years I had never taken my metal out of the stock to check it out, so I did just that for a look/see. No salt corrosion, thankfully, due to it probably being of later 1971 production, I believe.

I really didn't know when my rifle was made, so I decided to look it up. That is when I noticed a difference in how the two web sites say the serial number is represented and how my serial number appears. On both web sites, given on this forum for Browning dates of manufacture look up, they indicate that the two digit year comes first, then the Model code (X for T-Bolt) and then (from Proofhouse.com) a 5 digit serial number:

68 to 1975 - The last two digits of the year was used,

Example: Serial number 69B12345:

69 = Year of manufacture (1969)
C = Model (should read B to fit the example)
12345 = Serial number

Browning's web site's verbal description says the same thing about the 2 digit date code, but after that the 4 digit type code mentioned doesn't make any sense and my serial number certainly doesn't start with 1000 if my 1 is part of the year, and if it did that would suggest that the serial number part was only 4 digits:

1969-75 In 1969 Browning started using two digits for the date of manufacture which was followed by a four digit code that identified the type of Auto-5:
X=T-Bolt 22
This was then followed by the serial number beginning with 1000.
Example: 69X1000 = A 1969 T-Bolt 22 rifle with a serial number of 1000.
X=T-Bolt 22

What I take away from this is that my T-Bolt rifle was less than the 40th one made in 1971, despite the X code coming before the date and serial number. Has anyone else noted this discrepancy before for T-Bolts, or any other Browning models? Are the two web sites wrong, if not a bit misleading in Browning's case, or for whatever reason do I have a most unusual serial number? Any clarity would be appreciated! Thank you in advance!

[Jeepergeo]

I soooo want a T Bolt.

Nice close ups.

[Camster]

Based on my long history of Brownings, I think the serial number should have been stamped starting with 71X. Being a first day of 1971 production, probably a factory boo-boo that was soon rectified.

btw, X was later used as a suffix, but meant something entirely different at that time.(1978-1980 "parts guns")

The Browning site does contain some wrong information. The four digit type code applies to later Japanese products.

[oldbird13]

As Camster has pointed out, there were mistakes made I doubt any manufacturer would list a serial number for an incorrectly stamped firearm. Most likely in 1971/later, the salt issue had long been identified and addressed. Anytime at on-site auction I see a t-Bolt, I ask to have the butt plate screws removed. Easy to do, if they won't I would pass. Was at a live auction several years ago and inquired. The onsite expert "gunsmith" didn't know what I was talking about. Agreed to look at the buttplate screws..could barely remove them and they were loaded with rust. No interest on my part..sad thing was after disclosure to them they did not disclose at the auction. Maybe their consignor would not have appreciated that. Lesson learned thanks to RFC.

[M2HB]

I have one of those older Belgium T-Bolt rifles that was made in the early 1970s. They don’t have salt wood and they are awesome rifles.

[Camster]

Originally Posted by M2HB

I have one of those older Belgium T-Bolt rifles that was made in the early 1970s. They don’t have salt wood and they are awesome rifles.

I think salt wood can be found on any 1966-1973 T-bolt. The only for sure no salt examples, would be a 1965 or 1978-80 parts gun.

[M2HB]

Mine is one of the X rifles. It may be from the later 1970s. It doesn’t have the walnut stock like the early ones had. It may be one of those parts cleanup guns.

[Camster]

Originally Posted by M2HB

Mine is one of the X rifles. It may be from the later 1970s. It doesn’t have the walnut stock like the early ones had. It may be one of those parts cleanup guns.

Yep, it is a later one.

[NIB]

I used to own a T2 from very late 60's to very early 70's. I never had any idea of salt wood until I started reading RFC. That wasn't my first 22 but it was my first "Finely crafted" 22.

I have a question....You guys certainly know much more about about Old Belgian Browning T Bolts than me. My question is about the wood. Was the wood on a T1 and T2 the same, Walnut? I believe the T2 had the nicer wood and was lacquer finished correct?

I ask because I see that somewhere along the line they? T1 perhaps? Came with wood other than Walnut?

[Camster]

Originally Posted by NIB

I used to own a T2 from very late 60's to very early 70's. I never had any idea of salt wood until I started reading RFC. That wasn't my first 22 but it was my first "Finely crafted" 22.

I have a question....You guys certainly know much more about about Old Belgian Browning T Bolts than me. My question is about the wood. Was the wood on a T1 and T2 the same, Walnut? I believe the T2 had the nicer wood and was lacquer finished correct?

I ask because I see that somewhere along the line they? T1 perhaps? Came with wood other than Walnut?

All regular production models 1965-1973) had walnut.

The later parts guns (1978-80) regardless of grade, usually had sycamore, though some of both grades can be found with walnut.

[Trailboss]

Originally Posted by Camster

I think salt wood can be found on any 1966-1973 T-bolt. The only for sure no salt examples, would be a 1965 or 1978-80 parts gun.

As well as many other Brownings made during this period. On a curious note, I have a 1966 T2 salt wood Browning. It has a butt plate that will never be taken off as well as a dime sized spot on the receiver that used to have rust. I break it down once a year and re-grease the under stock metal. In 20 years plus, no further rust. It's one of my favorite rifles and it beautiful to look at.

[NIB]

Originally Posted by Camster

All regular production models 1965-1973) had walnut.

The later parts guns (1978-80) regardless of grade, usually had sycamore, though some of both grades can be found with walnut.

Thank you Camster. The "parts" guns are something I have never heard of until now.

JM Browning was amazing. His guns not only (as far as I know) functioned perfectly and beyond that were good looking.

[M2HB]

Originally Posted by Trailboss

As well as many other Brownings made during this period. On a curious note, I have a 1966 T2 salt wood Browning. It has a butt plate that will never be taken off as well as a dime sized spot on the receiver that used to have rust. I break it down once a year and re-grease the under stock metal. In 20 years plus, no further rust. It's one of my favorite rifles and it beautiful to look at.

It is amazing how some stocks had very little salt and some were full of salt. I think it depended on where it was in the salt pile.

[Camster]

Originally Posted by M2HB

It is amazing how some stocks had very little salt and some were full of salt. I think it depended on where it was in the salt pile.

My understanding is that the blanks were stacked in salt mines. (to speed up the drying time). Some picked up more salt dust and crystals than others.

[Camster]

Originally Posted by NIB

Thank you Camster. The "parts" guns are something I have never heard of until now.

JM Browning was amazing. His guns not only (as far as I know) functioned perfectly and beyond that were good looking.

Most of the later parts guns can be instantly recognized as such, since they have a barrel mounted Williams sight, rather than the receiver peep sight.
A serial number starting with a 6,no product or date code within, with a X at the end, is the other indicator.