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  #61  
Old 09-12-2010, 09:26 PM
Spike52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aom22 View Post
Mechanically and functionally the 336C and 336W are identical.
The 336W is the plain jane economical version of the 336 series.
As such the 336W is a working rifle.

While the 336C is fully-dressed in traditional walnut.
And, to my eye, has more pride of ownership appeal.

However, if one were to pick-up either rifle, then, the other
in quick order with closed eyes.
I don't think you (or I) could distinguish a 336C from a 336W
without very careful examination of the some stock features.

The 336C has a fluted walnut stock, pistol grip cap
and contoured rubber butt plate with a black spacer.
I believe the bluing is deeper and more polished.

While the 336W has a walnut finished hardwood stock that is not fluted.
The pistol grip does not have a cap and has a plainer butt plate without a spacer.
The bluing may not be quite as bright.
Surprisingly, the trigger is gold plated.


On a 336W ... I'd go with a Weaver.
A 336C ... mount a Burris to save a little money without sacrificing quality.
If my budget was not strained, I'd go the Leupold route.
Well... The C is but a scant $70 more in MSRP (60 bucks dealer?). Although the W does boast a "deeply blued finish", same as the C. I see what you mean by the "fluted" stock with the side-by-side comparison.
I suppose I could bypass my favorite Starbucks for a month... Like Dad always said, "Son, if something's worth doing, it's worth doing right".

Quote:
Have you seen a the 336 Deluxe?
The Deluxe beckons for a VX-7 1.5-6x24mm
W

C

Deluxe (drool...)


Oh... Oh my...
It certainly does cry out for the Leupold, doesn't it? Practically demands it...
Any figures on the MSRP? (I will guess, beyond my budget, as may be the Leupold glass. But such an outfit sure would be the Crown Jewel.)

This whole prospect is becoming expensiver and expensiver! LOL...

-------------------------------

'Nuther concern

Twofew and Southern spoke to this somewhat in their earlier -ahem- exchange, with regard to different metal recievers loosening up...
(Incedentally, hope you guys made up over an executive beer summit.)

I stopped by the prospective dealer for this planned buy and asked to handle a 336 (I'm only just technically aware of the lever action style, having never owned one and fired one but a few times).
They didn't have a Marlin in, but let me handle a used Winchester. This is good, since the action was well broken in.

The rifle was in good shape, and the action was smooth, but loose to the point of sloppy by my reckoning. Trigger play and side-to-side motion of the lever was substantial. There was a button under the reciever, requiring the lever to be pressed up firmly to the stock to release the hammer?

1. Is this buttom meant to be a "lever safety" of sorts? (I'm put in mind of a 1911 grip safety.)

2. Is the loosening effect simply characteristic of the action style? (The dealer assured me this is so and the same with the Marlins. I don't question his honesty, but he's eager to sell product. I'd as soon ask here and not put him in conflict of interest.)




-S

Last edited by Spike52; 09-12-2010 at 10:08 PM.
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  #62  
Old 09-13-2010, 05:58 AM
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Bargin Guns ... Good Tools

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spike52 View Post
Well... The C is but a scant $70 more in MSRP (60 bucks dealer?).
Although the W does boast a "deeply blued finish", same as the C.
I see what you mean by the "fluted" stock with the side-by-side comparison.
Wait for the hunting season sales to see what real price of a 336 is.
But, for the sake of argument a seventy dollar price difference is not much.
And, well worth the money if you love guns for the art they represent.
Unless of course you are on a very strict budget.

If I were you, I'd keep an eye out for estate sales, moving sales
and yard sales as well.
Guns are often being sold in these venues.
But, not out-in-the-open ... you need to ask the sellers.
Moreover, the sellers often do not know the worth of the firearms they possess.
A rare opportunity for an honest man to be be fair on his own terms.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Spike52 View Post
This whole prospect is becoming expensiver and expensiver! LOL...
A good gun is like a good tool.
A good tool is a joy forever ... at least everytime you use it.
A cheap tool will always remind you of the mistake you made for not buying better.
And, you will eventully pay even more to replace the bargain implement.
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you must know what-to-do, and ... then ... do-your-best.
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  #63  
Old 09-13-2010, 05:57 PM
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Winchester '94 vs Marlin 336

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spike52 View Post
They didn't have a Marlin in, but let me handle a used Winchester.
This is good, since the action was well broken in.

The rifle was in good shape, and the action was smooth,
but loose to the point of sloppy by my reckoning.
Trigger play and side-to-side motion of the lever was substantial....
The Winchester 94 action locking mechanism is entirely different from the Marlin 336.
In comparison to the 336, the Winchester fells loose and less precise.
This a consequence of a design engineered to function even in the most adverse of conditions.

Compared: Marlin Model 336 and Winchester Model 94 By Chuck Hawks
Quote:
The Marlin action feels tighter than the Winchester action, there is less lever slop,
and the floorplate does not drop away from the receiver when the centrally
mounted lever is operated, as does the Model 94.

All of this adds up to an impression of solidity and quality that inspires confidence.
As a friend of mine, who owns and shoots Model 94's, admitted:
"The Marlin action feels more substantial."
Winchester Pre '64 Model 94 Classic Gun Review By Chuck Hawks
Quote:
Unfortunately, by the early 1960s the production costs of the traditional Model 94
with all of its forged steel parts had risen dramatically.

Winchester executives realized that soon the Model 94 would have
to be priced beyond the reach of the average hunter.

This is exactly the fate that befell the classic Mannlicher-Schoenauer carbine,
and eventually spelled its doom.

To save the Model 94 and restore a reasonable profit margin,
Winchester redesigned the action for cheaper manufacture,
substituting stamped sheet metal and roll pins for parts
previously machined from forged steel.

The steel buttplate became plastic and a less durable metal finish
was substituted for the traditional bluing.
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you must know what-to-do, and ... then ... do-your-best.
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  #64  
Old 09-13-2010, 06:07 PM
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Winchester '94 Crossbolt Safety

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spike52 View Post
They didn't have a Marlin in, but let me handle a used Winchester.
There was a button under the reciever, requiring the lever
to be pressed up firmly to the stock to release the hammer?
1. Is this buttom meant to be a "lever safety" of sorts? (I'm put in mind of a 1911 grip safety.)
The addition of safety mechanisms has flawed these original lever action rifles.

Compared: Marlin Model 336 and Winchester Model 94 By Chuck Hawks
Quote:
In 1992 an unsightly crossbolt safety that blocks the hammer
was introduced to please the corporate lawyers.

Unfortunately, unlike Marlin's subtle crossbolt safety,
the Winchester version was obvious and marred the clean look of the receiver.

In 2003 Winchester dealt with the problem by moving the safety to the top tang,
where it is less intrusive.
The Winchester Model 94 By Chuck Hawks
Quote:
In 1992 an unsightly and completely superfluous crossbolt safety
that blocks the hammer was introduced for lawyers
and other people too ignorant to use the hammer's safety notch,
which by 1992 had been the standard safety procedure with lever action rifles
for well over 100 years.

To this day post 1964 Model 94's without the crossbolt safety are worth about 20% more
on the used market than those with the ugly and unnecessary addition.

In 2003 Winchester dealt with this problem by moving the safety
to the top tang, where is is less intrusive.
__________________
W. Edwards Deming ... Quality: It is not enough to do-your-best;
you must know what-to-do, and ... then ... do-your-best.
Ever-Onward ... Through the Fog ---- Fort Stockton TX 79735
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  #65  
Old 09-13-2010, 11:37 PM
Spike52
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Thank you for the links, AOM. I always enjoy Chuck Hawk's reviews.

"the Model 94 had some drawbacks. Paramount among these was its top ejection, which made low and overbore scope mounting impossible."

Although, I think I will use the stock irons for as long as I can stand it, this was really the deciding factor to choose the 336 over the 94.

To read C.H. repeating it just solidifies my opinion.

As to hunting season -- I was under the impression it is upon us! Do you mean to say that I might wait for post season clearouts?

Even with the proportionately magnified dread of The First Ding, I believe I would appreciate the C model over the W... Though I expect I'd be pleased with either. At the risk of sounding like I'm talking myself into it, it is intended to be a working rifle and, practically speaking, black walnut is a tougher material than the generic "hardwood" (which I suspect is birch).

Thank you all for your enthusiastic responses. I'm enjoying the discussion and learning a great deal.

-S
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  #66  
Old 09-14-2010, 12:37 AM
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Winchester did away with straight top eject a number of years ago and the 94 has been scope friendly ever since.
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  #67  
Old 09-14-2010, 09:26 AM
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Iron Sights and Scope ... Use Both

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spike52 View Post
Although, I think I will use the stock irons for as long as I can stand it,
this was really the deciding factor to choose the 336 over the 94.
Scope or iron sights ... Iron sights and scope?

SCOUT SCOPE BASES
Quote:
... our exclusive Scout Scope Base fits the Marlin Centerfire Lever Rifles
and the Winchester 94.
It is designed to use standard Weaver style rings,
and is ideally suited for quick detachable Scout Scope systems.
The only base that allows use of the rear sight if detachable
or see through rings are used.
Manufactured at the correct height for proper sight picture.
__________________
W. Edwards Deming ... Quality: It is not enough to do-your-best;
you must know what-to-do, and ... then ... do-your-best.
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  #68  
Old 09-14-2010, 11:02 PM
Spike52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aom22 View Post
Scope or iron sights ... Iron sights and scope?

SCOUT SCOPE BASES
Ah-ha! Neat idea.

But let me explain, lest I be misunderstood.

The main function of using open sights would be to stall while I save for some premium optics (while championing, ostensibly, my love of the "purity" of irons yeah-yeah, that's the ticket).

No $34.94 Wallyworld Special for this. (Although, it can be said I'm guilty of looking through economy glass. )

I won't say, Leupold or nothing, but I would like to mount a scope worthy of this particular lump of metal and wood. I think I can make do. I'm not a horrible shot with a hump and a bump, and I am blessed with better vison than my dad had at my age.

Look-through rings have always ridden too high to my liking, but the idea of a quick-detach arrangement does have a certain appeal.

My concern is this:
Like a hip-shot style low E toggle on a bass guitar (for those who may be familiar) having difficulty keeping a solid tone, I wonder how solid a zero would be through connect-reconnect-connect-reconnect... Get it?

-S

Last edited by Spike52; 09-15-2010 at 11:06 PM.
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  #69  
Old 09-15-2010, 01:23 PM
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Re-Zero Quick Detach Scope

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spike52 View Post
... I wonder how solid a zero would be through connect-reconnect-connect-reconnect...
Most factory quick detach mounts/rings claim at least an MOA re-zero.
Some may guarantee a 1/2 MOA re-zero.

Only the manufacturer can tell you what they will claim or guarantee
as a re-zero tolerance.

For short-range hunting an MOA deviation is insignificant.
Even out to two hundred yards ... it shouldn't matter.

Some shooters prefer iron sights for very close-range
snap shooting in dense under brush.

Decades ago swing-over scope mounts were available
that allowed a rifleman to move the scope out of the field of view
and expose the iron sights.
The swing-over mount, hinge and rings kept the scope low
on the receiver and close to the rifle bore centerline.

After the shot was taken with the iron sights, the scope would be flipped
back into its original position - zero was maintained.
__________________
W. Edwards Deming ... Quality: It is not enough to do-your-best;
you must know what-to-do, and ... then ... do-your-best.
Ever-Onward ... Through the Fog ---- Fort Stockton TX 79735
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