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  #46  
Old 11-18-2012, 02:02 AM
fivetwo

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unusual barrels



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does anyone know the relationship between barrelmaker arthur hubalek and the winchester 52?
also, i have seen a 52 barrel with a third sight base mounted just behind the front sight. is this a factory option, or an owner's innovation?
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  #47  
Old 11-18-2012, 08:37 AM
Seewin
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Hubalek was a custom barrelmaker from New York, who like HM Pope, Eric Johnson etc rebarreled target rifles back in the '30's & 40's. He was a jeweler by trade, but learned the barrelmaking process from Pope and went on to make what many consider some of the finest custom barrels of the time. Pope was not very happy about this because he felt that Hubalek had used many of Pope's processes in his manufacturing. There was never a relationship between Hubalek and Winchester that I am aware of. I do believe that Hubalek probably purchased some 52's from Winchester for rebarreling with his own barrels. I base this on the fact that Hubablek advertised a "Special Winchester Model 52" with one of his "special" barrels in his sales brochure.
The "second" target block that you are asking about was not a Winchester option or special order... just something done by the owner.
Steve
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  #48  
Old 11-18-2012, 10:47 AM
fivetwo

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hubalek barrel

thanks steve, i appreciate that valuable information. i looked high and low triying to find such details. as a collector does a hubalek barrel have any higher value than a standard winchester barrel?
thanks again, and, if you could, can you tell me where you got the information on hubalek.
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  #49  
Old 11-18-2012, 12:55 PM
Seewin
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I doubt the Hubalek barreled 52 would bring as much as an original in comparable condition, unless you are a Hubalek or custom barreled rifle collector.
My knowledge of Hubalek dates back to my childhood days in the early 60's. My dad collected vintage single shot rifles and we both shot them in competition. Back then the Pope barreled rifles were the holy grail. However, the Schoyen's, Petersons, Zischangs, Hubaleks all shot very well. For some reason, the Pope's got all the hype. My dad still owns some old Ballard Peterson barreled rifles that he swears will outshoot any Pope. I think it is just like today. All the custom barreled rifle makers made a good barrel. For some reason some just shot better than others.
In today's time, I would say Gary Quinlan in PA is without a doubt the expert on anything Hubalek.
Steve
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  #50  
Old 11-18-2012, 03:00 PM
fivetwo

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hubalek barrel & quinlan

thank you for the information. is mr. quinlan a member of rimfire central?
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  #51  
Old 11-18-2012, 03:03 PM
fivetwo

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hubalek barrels

i forgot to ask in my last communication, if you knew why the other barrels were so highly regarded (by some )over a regular rifle barrel such as a factory winchester 52.
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  #52  
Old 11-18-2012, 06:05 PM
JohnOhio
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52

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Originally Posted by fivetwo View Post
i forgot to ask in my last communication, if you knew why the other barrels were so highly regarded (by some )over a regular rifle barrel such as a factory winchester 52.
Its no different than today where the best shooters very seldom use factory barreled guns! The custom barrels are usually built with closer tolerances and care for the best accuracy! In my experience collecting 52's-I have seen more barreled with Eric Johnson barrels than any other! His barrels won at camp perry and were used by several shooters! Like Steve was saying- I don't think they would bring more than a mint 52 in unaltered condition! I know I wouldn't pay more unless it was owned by a famous shooter and documented! Another barrel that is sometimes seen is a Womack! Even though the barrels are stamped with his name-I think that Douglas made them to his specifications!
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  #53  
Old 11-18-2012, 10:28 PM
Seewin
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I personally feel both Winchester and Remington made world class target barrels. Much time went into the machining, rilfling, inspection and fitting of the barrels used on both the 52 and model 70 target rifle. I have read that Winchester held their bore tolerance on the 52 barrel to .0003"...that is 3 ten thousandths of an inch? A very impressive number for a machined component even by today's standards!
I happen to own one of a pair of Eric Johnson barreled 52C's that were barreled for and invoiced to Olin(Winchester) in the mid 50's. These were used for accuracy comparison tests at Winchester. A friend of mine who was employed at Winchester in the early to mid 50's worked in ballistics and actually shot the very rifle I own. In discussing the accuracy of the Johnson barreled rifles compared to the factory rifles, he stated there was very little if any difference. He further mentioned that the ultimate accuracy of either rifle was dependent on the lot of ammunition they used in testing. The factory rifle was actually more accurate that the Johnson with certain lots, while the reverse was true with other lots.
I do think that the custom smiths offered one thing that Winchester could not, and that was individual attention to the chambering and fitting of each barrel. Each was a perfect as was possible at that time.
Steve
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  #54  
Old 11-19-2012, 11:07 AM
JohnOhio
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model 52

I agree- Nothing wrong with tolerances of the 52 barrels! Winchester went to great lengths to perfect four guns: The model 52-70 rifles and model 12 and 21 shotguns! They tested these guns more than any other and used only the best materials and technology for each! As far as the 52 goes the big problem was not the barrels but the warped actions from the casehardening! Most of the actions have crooked action faces from the heat treatment! Like you were saying that the custom gun makers took better care in lining up the barrels to the action as Winchester couldn't take the time on each individual gun! As far as the Eric Johnson barrels go-they must have been fairly accurate! According to Al Freeland and information in the NRA museum(up until 1970?) Eric Johnson barrels won more at Camp Perry than any other custom barrels! They will be found on several other makers guns as well -most notably the Remington model 37's!
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  #55  
Old 12-08-2012, 07:14 AM
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EJ Barrel

I have a 1950's cloned Model 52 action with a 52-B trigger with an Eric Johnson 5Star Eight barrel that was shortened by 6"...???

I also shoot a ULA20-Broughton 5C, Jewell and an Anschutz Model 54 Match all 3 guns in Custom BR stocks...

On a good day and with Eley Tenex I can outshoot my ULA and Anschutz with the EJ rifle, I consider my ULA Custom and the EJ near equal, slight edge to the ULA.



Green is the EJ, Black is the ULA



Last edited by Bolero; 12-08-2012 at 07:17 AM.
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  #56  
Old 01-09-2013, 01:09 PM
saxmaneagle
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Thumbs down Womack 400 Bull

I am anxiously awaiting deliver of this. Anyone familiar with Womack ??
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  #57  
Old 01-09-2013, 01:10 PM
saxmaneagle
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...womack bull

http://www.gunsamerica.com/997212349...rtl_Scope.htm#
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  #58  
Old 01-09-2013, 04:18 PM
JohnOhio
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Womack was a gunsmith who put together a few winners at Camp Perry! I think that most of the barrels that he used were Douglas and they were built to his specifications! He would stamp them Womack on the barrel! You will find several different actions that he used!
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  #59  
Old 01-09-2013, 04:25 PM
Seewin
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Walter Womack was from Shreveport, LA. He has only been gone about 20 years or so. I believe John is right in that he fitted Douglas premium barrels and then stamped his name on them. He was probably more note for his sights. He made a dual range front sight that could be rotated for 50 and 100 yards. They looked a lot like the Freeland front tube sights.
Steve
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  #60  
Old 01-09-2013, 05:37 PM
JohnOhio
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I also have one of his dual front sights on my Morgan!
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