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Old 06-30-2008, 04:52 PM
Trent
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Superstock Off-hand Challenge



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Ladies and Gentlemen:

When I think of “sporters” I immediately think of hunting rifles. Growing up in Oregon I would spend a large part of my youth rummaging around various forests in search of “targets”. I can’t remember ever shooting at an actual target on paper. It was always soda and beer cans when sighting in. While I was hunting I would say that about 90% of my shots were offhand.
Today things are different and I spend the majority of my time shooting off of a bench and shooting rest. Paper and ¼” groups are my quest now-a-days.

Well... I want to relive the glory days! I did some searching through the SS/A forum to see if anyone had started a similar game over there but I came up empty handed. So... I’m starting my own “Off-hand Challenge” game from scratch.

This is a fun challenge with very little restriction. No restriction in ammo choices at all. I did some testing yesterday in order to set up some parameters for group averages and below is what I came up with. Enjoy!

25 Yard Off-hand Challenge:

Rules:
- All shots are to be taken unsupported in the upright (standing) position.
- All shots are to be taken at 25 yards. *** Edit - A 50 yard target has been added and separate rules apply. Please see the second thread post for supplied target and rules. ***
- 4 groups are to be shot with 5 rounds each on the same paper.
- No additional measuring shots need to be shot. Just measure any 4 individual bullet holes and clearly mark their dimensions. I am assuming that no one will be bugholing this challenge and there will be plenty of individual holes to gather data from. However, if you somehow manage to shoot so well as to not have any measuring shots, by all means please shoot 4 measuring shots. (Make sense?)
- Any Super Stock Bolt compliant rifles allowed, please designate “Sporter” or “Varmint” in your submission.
- Slings are allowed. It will be interesting to see the added benefit and advice on technique.

(Exception – If you are disabled in any way that prevents you from shooting in the standing position then by all means do what you need to in order to participate. This includes leaning against the bench for support. For anyone that is wheelchair bound please participate by shooting “off-hand” from a seated position. I don’t want anyone to be excluded from this challenge and the spirit of it is to get off the bench/bags.)

Scoring your targets:
Using standard calipers and standard measurements...include the size of each measuring shot, and the total average used for subtraction. Include the outside to outside measurement of all 4 groups with the “subtractor”, and the total center to center measurement. Then add all 4 groups, divide by 4, and include your group average. (Plagiarized from Tony Mig)

Average your four group sizes. If they average 2.0" or less welcome to the SuperStock Off-hand Club! Four individual categories of 2", 1.75", 1.5" and 1.25" have been established. The goal here is to shrink your groups and move yourself into the next bracket down, and hopefully into the sub 1.25" range. Self improvement baby!

Multiple rifles are encouraged!

Additional “Long John Silver” recognition will go to those that can hold their point of aim inside of the 2” outer ring for 3 out of the 4 groups and keep their average at 1.25" or less. All 5 rounds have to at least break the line. (have to use the supplied target for this) (Ladies will be categorized as "Cutlass Liz")

Further “Bluebeard” recognition will go to those that can hold their point of aim inside of the 1.25” inner circle for 3 out of 4 groups. Same rules apply as above. (Ladies will be categorized as "Gunpowder Gertie")

Downloadable target found here. Be sure to set "Print Scaling" to NONE, or your bullseyes will be smaller than 2". 25 Yard Off-hand Target

Let the fun begin!!!! YAR!

2.0” Winners List:
Trent - Mossberg 142a 1.849"
Trent - Mossberg 146b 1.938"
Tony Mig - CZ 452 Special Trainer / Williams peep sight 1.933"
crpadiem - BRNO #1 - 1.918"
EchoBravo - CZ 452 American - 1.915"
Number19 - CZ 452 Lux - 1.798" Peep Sights
Swarm - CZ 452 LUX - 1.918" (peep sights!)


1.75” Winners List:
Mr. Ouija - Biathlon Basic 1.663"
Number19 - CZ 452 Ultra Lux / Williams peep sight 1.539"
TrimGuy - CZ 454 Varmint - 1.625"
Swarm - Soviet Baikal Toz-17-01 - 1.570"
Poison Ivy - CZ Style - 1.656"
Houndog1 - Anschutz 1712 - 1.584"


1.5” Winners List:
Trent - Mossberg 144LSB 1.263"
Trent - Savage MKII BV 1.443"
Sophia - CZ-452 Trainer 1.397"
AzizaVFR - Winchester 52 1.274"
FiremanFrank - Marlin/Glenfield 20 - 1.473"
Houndog 1 - Walther KKJ - 1.475"
Model60Shooter - Savage MKII F - 1.451"
fr3db3ar - CZ 452 Special - 1.422"
Number19 - CZ 452 Ultra Lux / Williams peep sight "Peggy Sue" 1.292"
Cowboy4 - Remington 40x - 1.298"
bluemoongreg - CZ 452 Ultra Lux - 1.452" (aperture sights)
bluemoongreg - CZ 455 American - 1.372"


1.25” Winners List:
Forrest r - Savage/Anschutz Mark 10b 1.126" (Open sights!)
Forrest r - Remington 540 - 1.190" (Open sights!)
AzizaVFR - Savage MKII BTVS 1.170"
AzizaVFR - Volstok CM-2 1.218"
Trent - Mossberg 44US - 1.094" (Factory Peep Sights)
Forrest r - Mauser 320 "something or other" - 1.173" (Open sights)
Forrest r - Anschutz 1416 - 1.072"
Forrest r - Remington 513-s - 1.190"
willQuest - CZ 452 American - 1.048"
Rex M - Anschutz 54 Sporter - 1.050"
Yoffione - Browning T-bolt - 1.118"
TrimGuy - CZ 452 Varmint - 1.225"
TrimGuy - CZ 452 Varmint - 1.010"
cowboy4 - Remington 581 - 1.055"
bluemoongreg - CZ 452 Ultra Lux - 1.203" (aperture sights)
bluemoongreg - CZ 455 American - 1.065"


Sub 1.000” Winners List:
Forrest r - CZ Lux "Twiggy" - .901"
Forrest r - Remington 540X - .645" <----------------- Smallest Group So Far
Rex M - Anschutz 1710 FWT - 0.719"
Rex M - Winchester 75 with Peep sights - .871"
cowboy4 - Anschutz 1712 - 0.872"
Trent - Weatherby XXii (bolt) - .952"
cowboy4 - Remington 40-X/Hart barrel - 0.901"
Yoffione - CZ 452 American - 0.978"
cowboy4 - Anschutz 1712 - 0.862"
Rex M - Winchester 72 (peeps!) - 0.938"
Rex M - Anschutz 64MS - 0.875"
Rex M - Anschutz 64MSR - 0.773"
Forrest r - Remington 541S - 0.764"


Long John Silver Qualifiers: (All 5 shots inside of 2" bull and 1.250" or less)
AzizaVFR - Savage MKII BTVS
Forrest r - CZ Lux
Forrest r - Savage/Anschutz MK 10b (Open sights!)
Forrest r - Remington 540
Trent - Mossberg 44US (peep sights)
Forrest r - Mauser 320 "something or other"
Forrest r - Remington 513-s
willQuest - CZ 452 American
Rex M - Anschutz 54 Sporter
TrimGuy - CZ 452 Varmint
cowboy4 - Remington 581
cowboy4 - Anschutz 1712
Trent - Weatherby XXii (bolt)
cowboy4 - Remington 40-X/Hart barrel
Yoffione - CZ 452 American
cowboy4 - Anschutz 1712
cowboy4 - Anschutz 1712
Rex M - Winchester 62 (peeps!)


Bluebeard Qualifiers: (All 5 shots inside of 1.25" center bull)
Forrest r - CZ LUX "Twiggy"
Forrest r - Remington 540X
Rex M - Anschutz 1710 FWT
cowboy4 - Anschutz 1712
Rex M - Anschutz 64MS
Rex M - Anschutz 64MS
Forrest r - Remington 541S

Last edited by Trent; 09-28-2013 at 05:14 PM.
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  #2  
Old 06-30-2008, 04:52 PM
Trent
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50 Yard Off-hand Challenge:

Rules:
- All shots are to be taken unsupported in the upright (standing) position.
- All shots are to be taken at 50 yards.
- 2 groups are to be shot with 10 rounds at each bull on the same paper.
- No additional measuring shots need to be shot. Just measure any 4 individual bullet holes and clearly mark their dimensions. I am assuming that no one will be bugholing this challenge either and there will be plenty of individual holes to gather data from. However, if you somehow manage to shoot so well as to not have any measuring shots, by all means please shoot 4 measuring shots. (Make sense?)
- Any Super Stock Bolt compliant rifles allowed, please designate “Sporter” or “Varmint” in your submission.
- Slings are allowed.

(Exception – If you are disabled in any way that prevents you from shooting in the standing position then by all means do what you need to in order to participate. This includes leaning against the bench for support. For anyone that is wheelchair bound please participate by shooting “off-hand” from a seated position. I don’t want anyone to be excluded from this challenge and the spirit of it is to get off the bench/bags.)

Scoring your targets:
Using standard calipers and standard measurements...include the size of each measuring shot, and the total average used for subtraction. Include the outside to outside measurement of both groups with the “subtractor”, and the total center to center measurement. Then add the two groups together and divide by 2, and include your group average.

Average your two group sizes. If they average 4.500" or less welcome to the SuperStock 50 Yard Off-hand Club! Four individual categories of 4.5", 3.5", 3.0" and 2.0" have been established. The goal here is to shrink your groups and move yourself into the next bracket down, and hopefully into the sub 2.0" range. Self improvement baby!

Multiple rifles are encouraged!

“Bluebeard” recognition will go to those that can hold their point of impact inside of the 1.772" (45mm) inner circle for all shots.

Downloadable target found here. Be sure to set "Print Scaling" to NONE, or your outer bulls-eye will be smaller than 4.528" (11.5mm). 50 Yard Off-hand Target

Good luck ya'll!!


4.5" Winners List:
Number19 - CZ "Peggy Sue" - 3.903" (aperture sights)
Swarm - CZ 452 Lux - 4.000" (peep sights!)


3.5" Winners List:
TrimGuy - CZ 452 Varmint - 3.399"
TrimGuy - CZ 452 Varmint - 3.246"


3.0" Winners List:
cowboy4 -CZ (Lilja Barrel) - 2.931"
Rex M - Anschutz 1710 FWT - 2.050"
cowboy4 - Anschutz 1712 - 2.015"
Trent - Anschutz 54ms - 2.253"


2.0" Winners List:
cowboy4 - Anschutz 1712 - 1.867"


Bluebeard Qualifiers:
(All 10 shots inside of 1.772" white center bull on both targets)

Last edited by Trent; 03-02-2012 at 12:32 AM.
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  #3  
Old 06-30-2008, 05:49 PM
speed647
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This should be interesting. Good idea Trent.


Is there any way we can get rid of that 5th (center) bull to save on printer ink?
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  #4  
Old 06-30-2008, 06:27 PM
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Well done Trent, looks like you spelled everything out clearly so there shouldn't be any grey areas to contend with.....

I'll down load the official targets for this game, and I might even try it with the CZ and it's new peep sight......(if I qualify with iron sights do I get a special eye patch award).....
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Old 06-30-2008, 06:40 PM
Trent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Mig View Post
Well done Trent, looks like you spelled everything out clearly so there shouldn't be any grey areas to contend with.....

I'll down load the official targets for this game, and I might even try it with the CZ and it's new peep sight......(if I qualify with iron sights do I get a special eye patch award).....
A special thanks goes out to Good Fellah Tony here. He gave me a lot of assistance in the planning of this new game. Thank you sir!

If you shoot it with Irons I will definitely give you a one-eye award!


Quote:
Originally Posted by speed647 View Post
This should be interesting. Good idea Trent.


Is there any way we can get rid of that 5th (center) bull to save on printer ink?
Thanks Speed! I'm going to see if I can whip up a better target. That center bull is wasteful.
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Old 06-30-2008, 06:48 PM
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I figured as tight as my groups are going to be, I might need that center bull for measuring shots.....

Besides...."Mister head shot on the hostage taker"....you might need that center bull for the same reason......

Trent...
Always happy to lend a hand, but this idea was your's and your's alone......
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Old 06-30-2008, 07:53 PM
varmintshooter
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Trent,good Idea,I am printing out targets right now,I probably can't even hit them,lol,but I am gonna give it a try!

Neil
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Old 06-30-2008, 08:17 PM
Trent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by varmintshooter View Post
Trent,good Idea,I am printing out targets right now,I probably can't even hit them,lol,but I am gonna give it a try!

Neil
It's a lot of fun trying. I hope the 1.250" isn't too tough. I tested with three different rifles and each of them were right around 1.400". My Mossberg 144LSB weighs close to 10-11 pounds and after shooting 5 test groups I realized that I need to get to the gym!

Then I went to the other extreme and shot my little guy Mossberg 142a. That thing is so light that I had a real hard time controlling it.

I sure had a lot of fun though! I think with a little practice I can get in under the 1.250" and maybe even get into the LGS (Long John Silver) qualifier.

"Bluebeard"... that is going to be a short list. Are there any Silhouette shooters in our ranks?
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Old 06-30-2008, 08:20 PM
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altho' i cant participate in this game,

cuz of my "handied" lefty, will be following along as shooters post pics of
groups. should be inneresting,

Trent, i believe this is the 1st kind of this game, and am curious as to who
will be participating, as there are those that firmly believe in their own
minds eye that off-hand shooting is the ONLY way to go to test ones skills,
never mind the bench and bags thingee.

Rico....








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Old 06-30-2008, 08:22 PM
Trent
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Here were my "baselines" for the three rifles I tested with.

Mossberg 144LSB (Federal 711b)
AVG = 1.345

Mossberg 142a (Remington Subsonic)
AVG = 1.387

Savage MKII BV (Remington Subsonic)
AVG = 1.459
(That 2" group really killed my average)

Average of all three rifles = 1.397


One of the things I am looking forward to seeing here is what rifles shine... true sporters, or the heavier varmint class.
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Old 06-30-2008, 08:31 PM
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Woohoo! Looks like a great game, Trent.
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  #12  
Old 06-30-2008, 10:02 PM
Trent
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Thanks Sophia!

The sad part is that I don't think I am going to have a chance to give it another try for a couple weeks. I told the wife I would limit my shooting to twice a month. (I think I may need to sneak in a trip to the public range after work during the week though!)
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:12 PM
Trent
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My attempt at creating an offhand 4 bull target

Ok all. I think I got it worked out. The outer bull mic'd out at 1.960 (We'll round up to 2"), and the inner white mic'd out at .972 (we'll round up to 1"). I don't have Corel and Microsoft word isn't exactly precise.

Here is a link to the new "official" offhand target. I'll go back and change it in my first post as well.
http://www.keepandshare.com/doc/view.php?id=663820&da=y
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Old 06-30-2008, 10:20 PM
speed647
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trent View Post
A special thanks goes out to Good Fellah Tony here. He gave me a lot of assistance in the planning of this new game. Thank you sir!
Same here when I was starting the 13mm pistola game. Tony's advice was right on the money.
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  #15  
Old 06-30-2008, 10:33 PM
speed647
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Trent, just a suggestion.... IME bullet holes/groups in dark black areas on a target are more difficult to measure than usual, as the 'smudge' ring tends to get lost in the dark background. Don't know what program you're using for the targets, but I've found that a medium shade of gray shows the holes better, is just as visible to the shooter thru a scope and saves even more of that printer ink I seem to be so obsessed about...
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