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  #1  
Old 12-01-2007, 05:41 PM
coloradogeezer

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Cost/Benefit Analysis of HMR vs Hm2



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Well, what do you think?

Please don't flame me on this one, because I'm just asking for you honest appraisal of the cost/benefit increase of the HMR over the Hm2, so if you have now, or have previously owned BOTH of these calibers, please post your observations and conclusions of this question.

And that question is................Does the increased COST of the HMR "justify" itself in a significant enough increase in practical use, over what can be done with the Hm2 or not?

Let me also say the following: I have plenty of respect for the 17 HMR and have owned one previously, but not currently. I've also owned the Hm2 and am now toying with the idea of buying yet another, but in an "upgraded" brand and model.

My own opinion is as follows: I think if I were going to use a rimfire for strictly "pest control" or varmint hunting at all possible ranges and NOT use it for edible small game, I would probably go with the HMR over the Hm2, but ONLY IF, I seriously felt that the VAST majority of my shots would be taken at MORE than 100 yards distance, and I do mean the VAST majority of shots would be taken at those longer ranges.

The Hm2 is easier on small game animals, in that it does not destroy as much meat as the HMR will do at any given range. So, IMHO, the Hm2 is actually better for people who want to "eat what they shoot" than the HMR is.

The HMR is indeed faster, and even flatter shooting than the Hm2 at any given range, but with that said, the Hm2 is no "slouch" either. Sighting in the little Hm2 at 1" high at 50 yards, puts it "dead on" at about 100 yards, which means that for all "practical purposes" even the little Hm2 is, much like the HMR, a round that allows you to pretty much just aim "dead on" any small target, all the way out to 100 yards without ANY worry of hold-over or hold-under, ie, they are both like "lazers" in their flat trajectory out to 100 yards. After 100 yards, it's a different story, and the HMR really begins to shine, and indeed, truly overtake the Hm2 in both killing power and it's ability to hold a flat trajectory.

But here's the "rub" IMHO. Unless you really are in fact taking almost all your shots BEYOND 100 yards, when hunting or target shooting with your 17 caliber rimfire, I can't see much "practical" advantage of the HMR over the Hm2 considering the HUGE price differences for the rounds.

Consider the following: I can find premium grade Hm2's for about $50 per brick of 500 almost any day of the week. In fact, I can even have them delivered to my door for sometimes just a tad less than that. Most HMR is going to run you about $110 per brick. That's $60 a brick MORE for the HMR, over the cost of Hm2, and since the little Hm2 is still so flat shooting and so effective on small, thin skinned game out to 100 yards, why would you want to be paying another $60 a brick for the HMR, when the Hm2 is way more than just seriously adequate out to the 100 yard mark?

If you use shoot a brick of HMR per month at $110 and I shoot a brick of Hm2 per month at $50, You are paying $60 per month MORE than myself, and in just ONE YEAR, you have now spent $720 MORE than I did in order to gain the slight advantages of the HMR over the Hm2, so again, unless you need to shoot A LOT of shots beyond 100 yards, I just don't see the benefit of choosing HMR over Hm2.

If it's true that the HMR offers advantages over more powerful rounds like 222 Remington etc, as far as allowing the hunter to "see where the shots hit" while looking throught the scope, due to the almost "non-existent" recoil of the HMR round, then the Hm2 offers the same types of advantages for the same reasons, if not even more so, due to even less velocity and less recoil than the HMR.

The Hm2 is even "quieter" than the HMR, so again, if shooting in area's where louder muzzle blast might not be welcomed much by non-shooters, then again, the Hm2 has a slight advantage over the HMR in the "noise department."

Again, by now you're all thinking that I hate the HMR and love the Hm2 only, but that is not the case. My biggest point here, however, is that I do find it somewhat amazing that the HMR is SO popular, and the Hm2 gets very little "props" for what it too, can actually accomplish extremely well, and at a COST that is MUCH, MUCH LESS than HMR, so unless the shooter/hunter is indeed shooting almost all shots beyond that 100 yard mark, it just seems hard to justify the added cost of HMR over Hm2.

Thank God, we don't have to choose between one or the other, but I will admit that since almost ALL of my rimfire shooting is, in reality, done at ranges of 100 yards and LESS, the Hm2 has very serious practical advantages over the HMR. If it were the other way around, on a "consistent" basis, I would strongly prefer the HMR, and without question.

Now, you guys that have had in the past, or now currently have both HMR and Hm2 chambered rifles, what are your thoughts on the subject?
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  #2  
Old 12-01-2007, 05:55 PM
tonyjj

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Look at ADMIN 3's trajectory chart at top of forum, the .17HM2 up to 125 YDS with 17 grain bullet is up to par with the .17HMR, even out to 150 YDS it's pretty close. The cost of .17HM2 ammo is closing on what you pay for .22 ammo and the .17HMR is a lot more expensive.
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  #3  
Old 12-01-2007, 06:05 PM
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The real problem with the .17HM2 is the few examples that gun makers provide (blue with plastic stock in most cases).
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Old 12-01-2007, 08:30 PM
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I bought one of the first .17 HMR's; blue bull bbl. Savage with synthetic stock. The thing was a tack driver at 50 yds., and under, but the wind really bothered it at 100 yds. Didn't like the quality of the synthetic stock, or the quality of the trigger group. Sold it a couple of years ago and have never regretted it.

Bought a new Marlin 917m2 a couple of months ago for $149 and a whole lot of the cheap ammo online and couldn't be happier. When I see that HMR ammo for $11-$13 a box, I just smile and walk off. When I need to reach out and touch something, with confidence, I just use the .223; and the ammo isn't much higher than the HMR.


jr
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Old 12-01-2007, 08:44 PM
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I own both, The HMR is a Ruger 77/17 boat paddle I bought just for varmint shooting, mainly jack rabbits. Its not the best looking rifle but it does what I want it to do.

My Mach2 is a 10/22 conversion. Hogue OM stock and EABCO Barrel. Its main function is shooting ground squirrels from a good rest. I also use it for Nutria killing where most shots are taken from the truck. (Private property and private roads) Its a little too heavy to be packing around and making off hand shots.

So both rifles serve different purposes. The HM2 gets a lot more rounds put through it. I figure over the course of a year I will spend about the same amount on ammo for both rifles.
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  #6  
Old 12-01-2007, 08:51 PM
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I have 2 17HM2s, 1 17HMr and a 17 Rem. I like the HM2 alot. I shoot the 17 Rem more than the 17HMR. If I didn't reload the 17 Rem I would probably use the HMR more. The M2 just rocks, I can't say enough good about it.
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Old 12-01-2007, 09:11 PM
coloradogeezer

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FWIW, an update on the Ammo cost difference, at least at Gander Mountain in Colorado.

I just got back from Gander 10 minutes ago. CCI and Hornady 17 HMR is now $19.99 per 50 rds for the regular, old stuff. Same $19.99 for CCI 22 WMR with 40 grain JHP. 17 Hm2 is now $9.99 and CCI 22 short in the 100 packs, is now $9.99 as well. That is PURE INSANITY. Sportsmans Warehouse had the CCI and Hornady 17 HMR for about $12.99 and $13.99 just about 3 days ago, and I doubt it's gone up. I think their Hm2 was about $6.99 and CCI 22 Short was about $6.95 per 100.

I am so flipped out about this Gander Mountain insanity, that I'm going over to the Open Rimfire Forum right now to post on this craziness and let others be aware of their apparent desire to purposefully drive themselves into bankruptcy. They have seen there last dollar from me, forever.
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  #8  
Old 12-01-2007, 09:19 PM
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Enjoyable reading. I agree with much of the opening thread. I own three 17M2 rifles, and only one 17HMR, so obviously I very much support the M2. However, it's been my experience that if shooting varmints, the HMR will consistently provide one shot kills more often than the M2. I know that the velocity difference is 400fps more or less, but the destructive results on varmints of the HMR seems to be much more than that.
Again, I'm a real fan of the M2, but in the favor of merciful one shot kills on varmints, I think the HMR wins hands down at any distance over the M2.

Again, interesting reading. Keep it coming.
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  #9  
Old 12-02-2007, 09:27 AM
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I have both,use the Hm2 for squirrels and the HMR for Ground hogs.

Plenty of ammo for both.

Works for me.
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Old 12-02-2007, 09:51 AM
mossback
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I would hate to be limited to one or the other. I know I shoot my M2 a lot more than my HMR, for one reason I spend most of my time outdoors in heavily wooded areas and 100 yd. shot is about the max. you can expect. I also do a lot of squirrel hunting and the M2 is perfect while the HMR is just too destructive. Ammo cost is another reason the M2 gets shot more.

I think each has it's place, but it would be easier to replace the HMR with a .22 Hornet or a .17 cal. centerfire and if you handload ammo cost would probably be cheaper. I do handload, but I'm lazy, so I'll probably keep both, my M2 for hunting and plinking, and my HMR when I need a little more range or for larger varmints.
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Old 12-02-2007, 01:07 PM
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I'll tell you from my experience of owning both in a few configs.....Bottomline is that if the chips are down and you have to do a job say varmint elimination...the HMR is Tops...other than that with Hm2 Ammo So cheap (for now), you have to just get one because it does almost everything else pretty decent. Best investment I've ever spent was to get the VQ Superlite in Hm2.
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Old 12-02-2007, 02:08 PM
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well i have 2 hmr's and 1 hm2. i would sooner part with the hm2. it is under power and not as accurate as my hmr's. as for tearing small game up, use a .22lr. the extra speed and the flat shooting of the hmr can't be beat. i buy my ammo in multipul bricks. and i get a discount the more i buy. i have .22wmr's, a .223, a .22-250, and soon a .204. i have not been impressed with the hm2 in anyway at all. the hm2 will stay here in the collection so i can have the set of .17's. but it just won't get used. on the other hand the hmr's get used daily. i have one that i turned into a match rifle. it simply shoots. i have my old one to shoot birds out to 235 yards and groundhogs with out to 150 yards then i step up to centerfires for longer shots. and if you have nothing to complain about but the price of the bullets you don't need to be shooting anything. you simply can't afford it!!!!!!!
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Old 12-02-2007, 02:39 PM
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Got 'em both

I have HM2 and HMR in semi-auto and bolt guns because......................I can and I want to. Please don't try to confuse me with cost analysis. If that really was of importance, I sure wouldn't have all these 10/22s.

DRob
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Old 12-02-2007, 02:57 PM
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and something else i was just wondering. how do you put a price tag on fun??? be it with a hm2 ,hmr or the .50 bmg, i simply enjoy shooting and if the cost was a problem i'd stop. we all work hard and deserve to have something we can afford to enjoy. cost should not play a roll in having to choose a caliber. perfomance should be the desiding factor.
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Old 12-02-2007, 03:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by derekcasey View Post
and something else i was just wondering. how do you put a price tag on fun??? be it with a hm2 ,hmr or the .50 bmg, i simply enjoy shooting and if the cost was a problem I'd stop. we all work hard and deserve to have something we can afford to enjoy. cost should not play a roll in having to choose a caliber. performance should be the deciding factor.
thats what people with money say
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