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  #61  
Old 08-20-2019, 05:25 PM
Caley
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Not sure why some are still trying to steer me towards competition match rifles. Regardless of whether they are cheaper second hand rifles, they are still way over my budget. And I tend to not want to buy other peoples troubles. I've had too many purchases (not weapons) that were second hand, and they ended up costing more to fix than they were originally worth. Kind of like going out and picking up what is left of a 1940's classic car, then spending a ton of money to restore it.

Yes, I am hoping this CZ rifle choice can be got for close to my budget.

The reason for the CZ is that their rifles get consistent top reviews. I'm not sure how CZ barrels compare to Walther barrels, but hopefully they are nearly as good for being accurate. From the airgun crowd talk, Walther is tops when it comes to accuracy.

Anyway, thanks for all the suggestions, Sorry many of those suggestions are just not possible with my budget. I figure this pretty much ends my search unless I happen across someone selling an owned, but new Anshultz in my price range. Yeah, never going to happen.
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  #62  
Old 08-20-2019, 06:01 PM
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First, thank you for your Service. I see I'm a bit late to the party, it appears you've made a decision on your gun choice. Some have made very good recommendations, some not so based on your requirements.

The older heavier target guns are much more forgiving to newer shooters and can also shoot right up there with much higher priced guns. I run long-range rimfire matches here in Ohio and have seen nearly every combination of gun and scope being used.

Personally I recommend finding a decent H&R model 12 single shot, with peeps is a bonus because they can group and shoot nearly as good as a scope in the right hands. Drilling/tapping for a scope base is easy and a 20x SWFA moa-quad fits right in your budget.

Once you start you'll expand your distances you shoot and that setup can be used in multiple disciplines except for the running/gunning NRL/PRS stuff. CZs are a very good gun, a lot of them are used at my matches but the heavier target guns are a bit easier to shoot well until you become more proficient with the very fine nuisances that come into play that the top shooters take for granted but you'll learn with experience.

Good luck with whatever you buy, but keep it fun and enjoyable.

Topstrap

Last edited by Topstrap44; 08-20-2019 at 06:11 PM.
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  #63  
Old 08-20-2019, 07:31 PM
zukiphile
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caley View Post
Not sure why some are still trying to steer me towards competition match rifles. Regardless of whether they are cheaper second hand rifles, they are still way over my budget. And I tend to not want to buy other peoples troubles. I've had too many purchases (not weapons) that were second hand, and they ended up costing more to fix than they were originally worth. Kind of like going out and picking up what is left of a 1940's classic car, then spending a ton of money to restore it.
I think everyone is trying to be helpful. If you've been shooting for a few decades, you want to pass along your experience to help other people avoid your own mistakes and you might think of your own past purchases as wasted money.

I don't think whatever you buy is wasted money unless you don't enjoy it. What you want could change, but for now what you want is what you want.

I've had the 10 pound rifle like Topstrap44 describes, and I could print offhand groups that were really good when I was 25. 30 years later, it's too heavy and It doesn't fit in my car well. Things change.

I understand what you wrote about not buying someone else's problems. I've never had that happen to me with a gun. On the contrary, I've picked up a rifle or two the prior owner of which didn't think much of the accuracy. I clean the carbon ring out and found them to be outstanding. But I get not wanting a hand-me-down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caley View Post
Yes, I am hoping this CZ rifle choice can be got for close to my budget.
Those aren't cheap, but they look like there is a lot of value there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caley View Post
The reason for the CZ is that their rifles get consistent top reviews. I'm not sure how CZ barrels compare to Walther barrels, but hopefully they are nearly as good for being accurate. From the airgun crowd talk, Walther is tops when it comes to accuracy.
I built a rifle with a Walther barrel. It's great. I love it. I can tell you what you need to build one, but the total will be about $800 before you get to an optic.

Walther and CZ both let bad barrels out to customers, but I believe those are exceptions. I've never gotten a lemon from either.

Let's be realistic. If you want a solid rifle for practice and maybe an Appleseed event, do you need the best, or just something that's better than you are? I shoot offhand matches and the worst barrel I've ever had is still better than I am offhand.
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  #64  
Old 08-20-2019, 07:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caley View Post
.

I'm pretty much set on getting a CZ 457 Varmint AT-ONE. It looks nice, and seems big enough to fit me, as well as having the two previously mentioned items. I('m hoping that either my local gun shop or the Marine Base Exchange special order department can get one for me.
Excellent choice. You will be very happy with the 457 and it will serve you well. If you catch the bug and need to upgrade, my guess is that you will keep this one and add to the herd! It has already been mentioned that CZs have good resale value if you fall out of love with it so you really have little to lose.

You don't need to go crazy with optics, either. I am the same age and I would opt for higher magnification and adjustable parallax if I had to choose. There are some very good scopes in your price range from the likes of Vortex, Nikon, and others. Even Athlon has a very passable 6-24x50 that's a virtual clone of a Vortex. I have both and, while the Vortex has better glass, the Athlon at $100 less was a pleasant surprise. Get the best you can find within your budget and you won't be disappointed.
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  #65  
Old 08-21-2019, 04:21 PM
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I know you've already pretty much made up your mind on the CZ 457, and I think that would be an excellent choice. The only problem you may have is you could possibly get one that doesn't shoot as well as you need it to. I would say you have a better chance of getting a good one than a bad one. But for that reason you may want to check out the KSA 722 Varmint. It's well within your price range and has a 1/2" @ 50 yds gaurantee. No one else offers that kind of accuracy gaurantee for that little $. I have been doing a lot of research on them because I am buying one and they seem to get excellent reviews. I'm not trying to change your mind, just giving you another option to look at that seems to check all your boxes and fit in your price range.
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  #66  
Old 08-21-2019, 05:30 PM
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A CMP 82G would get you much smaller that half dollar groups at 50 yards--maybe dime--nickle for sure. I get dime size at 50 yrds on A23/5 iron sights.

They could be hard to find. I have a couple for my grand kids but it dont look too promising as of last weeks visit.

Last edited by langenc; 08-23-2019 at 02:25 PM.
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  #67  
Old 08-21-2019, 07:21 PM
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WoW!

Caley,

I think that 457 Varmint AT-ONE looks like a fantastic rifle overall !!! The adjustable stock on the model you chose is a major plus and is well designed for bench shooting for not much more money over a standard walnut stock model. Laminate will have greater dimensional stability than walnut which means humidity will have less effect on day to day accuracy. I was reading about the changes from the 452/455 to the 457 and while I was a bit concerned about the change in safety location, it sounds like the overall design changes particularly in reducing bolt throw to 60 degrees and shortening the receiver are well planned. I was wanting a 455 tacticool in 22 LR myself but I can't wait to hear about your experience with your new 457. I'm sorry the California red tape is stopping you from ordering your new rifle today! Hopefully by Christmas

Have you decided on a scope and rings to get started? Also make sure to shop around for a few extra magazines and plan to buy a few bricks of ammo when you do the background check on the rifle. You will probably be rejected for purchase of ammo due to current ammo regulations until you actually buy a gun. You may be able to order the ammo to the store on the base you mentioned at the same time as the rifle. While CCI standard velocity is a favorite here and you certainly would be reasonably safe ordering a case, Aguila Standard Velocity does very well also and many members here have come to appreciate it as an economy target round. The problem with rimfire ammo is it varies so much from lot to lot and gun to gun that you never know which lot will give you the best accuracy in your gun until you test a box. That's the risk of buying 22LR in case lots for one gun.

Unfortunately we haven't been able to order ammo to our homes in California for a couple of years making it harder to get a variety of ammo to test in our rimfires. Talk to your local dealers about custom orders. SG ammo is a good vendor. They have reasonable prices. You will want to consider ordering by the brick of 500 or case which is usually 5000 cartridges. Note that a lot of the lower priced Fiocci 22 LR is simply rebranded Aguila. Also, high velocity ammo from anywhere can certainly be used in your rifle to get started. However, based on your desire to compete you may want to focus on better practice ammo. Any of the ammo below is going to out shoot your bulk pack Walmart ammo in all but the most extreme cases.

https://www.sgammo.com/product/22-lr...y-plastic-pack

https://www.sgammo.com/product/22-lr...llet-ammo-0035

https://www.sgammo.com/product/22-lr...t-ammo-armscor

https://www.sgammo.com/product/22-lr...d-velocity-108

https://www.sgammo.com/product/22-lr...ps-fiocchi-amm

https://www.sgammo.com/product/22-lr...e-geco-germany

https://www.sgammo.com/product/22-lr...ead-round-nose
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  #68  
Old 08-21-2019, 08:04 PM
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Go to classic firearms and look at their 22 bolt action rifles, you'll find one their and you ask back what people think, there is a cz457 trainer there for $387 and put a taco 6x24 on it and you should be just over $500, then buy middle of the road ammo and poof, your having fun, jmo
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  #69  
Old 08-21-2019, 08:21 PM
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OP If u want to shoot the 100 yard targets make sure u get a scope in the 48 to 50 power range so u have a small view angle. Most will give u a 2 foot + - view angle and then u can start to shoot at the bulls 1/4" in size and see then real well.
As for a gun I always purchase a scope first and then a rifle.
This is my favorite with a Sightron 10x50x60 MOA-H. I put it on a 1710D HB and they shoot well together.



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  #70  
Old 08-21-2019, 08:29 PM
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Thatís funny! With that policy, scope firs gun second, I would have thought read post first, respond second would be your policy. Apparently not! Heís a newbie, on a budget, not an addict hoping a few $1000 dollars will help him put 5 shots thru one hole!

But it is a really great rig! You donít deserve it
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  #71  
Old 08-21-2019, 08:30 PM
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Out of his price range, your over 3 grand there
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  #72  
Old 08-22-2019, 06:27 PM
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This U-Tiube video has ammo tested in a 457 with same style barrel.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q...B&&FORM=VRDGAR

This video might give you some help in picking out some ammo to order for the AT-One. rc
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  #73  
Old 08-22-2019, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M2HB View Post
It is hard to get a really good target rifle for $500.

The CMP Kimber 82G comes to mind.

Decent target rifles arenít cheap.

A used Remington 40X would be our of your price range, but a good value.

There are different competitions with sporting rifles that may be more to you liking. Maybe even silhouette competition.
You can always get a good target rifle that isnt pretty. Go for a BSA International or an Anschutz 54.
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  #74  
Old 08-22-2019, 07:46 PM
Flyguy65
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Just Starting out

Couple of quick thoughts

Rifle - Go with something mid range. If you go cheap you will want to upgrade in the near future. In the Mid Range, I would definitely recommend a CZ or a Savage bolt options. I am a fan of the CZ 455 Varmint (which allows barrel swaps for other calibers) and the Savage Mark II TRR. Both of these rifles shoot half inch groups at 50 Yards and both can be had for about $450.

Scope - Again, go with something mid range for the same reasons. If you go cheap you will want to upgrade soon there after. I am a fan of first focal plane (FFP) mildot scopes with side parallax adjustment. Parallax adjustable aids in accuracy by limiting parallax (the drift of the reticle when your eye is not lined up directly through the center of the scope). FFP in practical terms means the reticle gets larger or smaller as you change the magnification. This means the subtensions (hashmarks on the Reticle) will always represent the same measurement at different magnifications.

For a rimfire, you dont need a lot of magnification but it is nice to have something more than a 9X scope for longer ranges 100-150 Yards. I prefer the Primary arms 4-14X44 FFP. It is right around $225 and has everything you need. There are other great scopes (Nikon EFR, Vortex, Leupold, etc) that are right around your price point. As you shoot more, you may want to get into NRL22 competitions and the parallax adjustment will become more important. Lastly, some scope manufacturers provide awesome lifetime warranties which will give you some piece of mind when you make that first scope purchase. Make sure you factor in the warranty before buying as it can be a real savings if anything happens to your scope.

Ammo - As you pointed out, each gun is ammo specific. One Brand/Model of rifle will like CCI and another rifle with the same Brand/Model will like Wolf or SK or some other. Subsonic ammo is all the rage right now for target shooters. I have one rifle (Savage Mark II BV) that definitely prefers subsonic while I have another Savage that prefers Wolf Match. You will need to experiment with different makes of ammo but in time you will find the ammo your rifle prefers.

Targets (MyTargets.com) offers a number of printable targets for free that are great for target shooting and or games and very cheap if you have a printer.

The above are my preferences and you will hear others chime in with the firearms, scopes and ammo they prefer. None are right or wrong, just preferences. The lesson I learned over the years which I tried to point out is dont go too cheap ($250) and dont go crazy ($1000) for a first rifle and the same applies to scopes.

Remember, buy once, cry once. Dont buy something you will want to or have to replace in a year.

Lastly Rimfire Central is Awesome so never be shy about asking questions. I got interested in Rimfire about 10 years ago and the people here are always willing to help. Welcome to RFC.
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  #75  
Old 08-22-2019, 07:53 PM
epoletna
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Target rifles

Well you can see from the large number of responses that you've asked a question we all want to give an opinion on. I think this is because many of us have been where you are now, and we're kind of thinking "I wish I had done this or that."

I startled shooting bench rest .22 rifle matches at 100 yards about 5 years ago. I bought a used Remington target rifle with an aftermarket barrel and stock, and I bought an expensive scope. I think I had about $2000 in it, but I was winning matches.

Then I discovered the Kimber Model 82 made for the government. They were sold in large numbers by the government for around $400, but prices have been going up on them ever since. I finally found one for $500 and I snapped its up. The trigger was not to my liking at all, so I spent $300 for an aftermarket trigger that is adjustable to mere ounces, and I put a 36 power scope on it ($325 used) and I once again started winning matches. I even won "high scorer of the year" in our club with that rifle.

But here's the part I don't see anyone talking about: I tried a lot of target ammo and finally settled on a brand that cost me fifteen cents a round. You will very likely have to go in that direction too.

Now, for the "if I had it to do over again" part: I would look for a Kimber 82G. You're probably looking at $600-700 now for them, and there's a chance you'll get a clunker. But you could get a really good one (I did). If you're going to shoot at 100 yards, as I did, look for a scope of at least 24 power, and if you can find one with a side focus, that's a good feature. I have a Nikko Stirling Targetmaster 4-16X - 44 on my squirrel rifle, and it's a cheap alternative that has served me very well. If you want to spend more, look for the Weaver T-36.

Get good sand bags or a bipod and a rear sand b bag.

And begin to test some different target ammo. At the very least, look for "standard velocity" ammo. Do not try to use high velocity ammo on a target -- it just doesn't have the consistency for what you're getting into.

Good luck with all this. And check back from time to time to let us know how the project is going!
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