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  #16  
Old 07-04-2019, 10:24 AM
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I update my manuals when I find one on clearance. I picked up a Speer reloading manual for $14 this year new in plastic. The data doesn't change that much unless you are trying out a new powder as others have indicated. I am shooting antiquated cartridges like the .38 special and .30-06.
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  #17  
Old 07-04-2019, 01:54 PM
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I buy new manuals when they are on sale.

Got back into handloading about a year ago, buying all new stuff. With all the info online we hardly need paper manuals anymore but I do like to use the books and read all the extra general loading information included.

Got the Nosler manual with my kit. Added the Hornady and Lee manuals when I found each on sale for less than $20. Recently bought the Hodgedon annual magazine issue.
I think that I have enough manuals right now. Don't see a need for any more.

I verify loads with the online manuals from the particular bullet and powder manufacturers I'm using. And I don't push the limits anyway.
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  #18  
Old 07-08-2019, 05:42 PM
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Old manuals don't keep up with powder changes so I contact the powder mfg when buying powder or changing bullets. Example: Accurate Arms changed to Accurate Powder and the powder containers looked almost identical...so identical it was real easy to miss the small change on the container. Charge rates were reduced almost 50% for .357. The only up to date info was the Accurate Powder printing included with each powder container. That taught me a lesson to always check with the mfg for the latest loading.
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  #19  
Old 07-10-2019, 09:57 AM
plumas
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The published FPS is sometimes off by a significant amount comparing similar loads in various manuals.

I know many of you folks are much more analytical than myself...is there an awareness showing one manual as being more consistently accurate in their velocity estimations?

Hoping I can learn from the mass experience of this forum...and that will be my next manual purchase!
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  #20  
Old 07-17-2019, 10:21 PM
Plinkhead
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plumas View Post
The published FPS is sometimes off by a significant amount comparing similar loads in various manuals.

I know many of you folks are much more analytical than myself...is there an awareness showing one manual as being more consistently accurate in their velocity estimations?

Hoping I can learn from the mass experience of this forum...and that will be my next manual purchase!
Manuals use different guns for loading data so I don't think there is a way to measure which is more accurate in fps. Any of the popular manuals will give you ok data. Buy the manual with the specific bullet, caliber and powder you use. That will narrow your search down.
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  #21  
Old 07-17-2019, 10:58 PM
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I try to collect some old and some new to have multiple sources and some older ones have scarce cartridges and odd calibers but I also bought the newest Hornady for the 7x64 info. Also new bullet releases need new manuals due to differences in construction.
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  #22  
Old 07-18-2019, 12:35 AM
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What's interesting is comparing 1990 burn rate charts to now. Having shot both powders, I can't believe WW231 should be close to AA5.
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  #23  
Old 07-18-2019, 04:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dstoenner View Post
Hodgdon says that you can down load H4895 to 60% of the listed max load for a given cartridge/bullet and be safe. I use that on all my calibers except 223 which recoil is not an issue.

I only have Hornady and Berger manuals and both are the latest. I get the Hodgdon magazine style every other year or so.

David
Good info, thanks.
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  #24  
Old 07-18-2019, 04:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sav99fan View Post
I try to collect some old and some new to have multiple sources and some older ones have scarce cartridges and odd calibers but I also bought the newest Hornady for the 7x64 info. Also new bullet releases need new manuals due to differences in construction.
I just got a Brno 600 in 7x64. The conventional wisdom is to use 280Rem data. Or so, I thought. Well, maybe time for another book, just because

Are American's buying new rifles in 7x64?

How times have changed - This country went from hating everything metric to calling the 270 a 6.8mm.

Last edited by fourbore; 07-18-2019 at 04:53 AM.
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  #25  
Old 07-18-2019, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by 38super View Post
What's interesting is comparing 1990 burn rate charts to now. Having shot both powders, I can't believe WW231 should be close to AA5.
I'm reading WW231 is faster than AA2 so being close to AA5 seems to be a stretch. I shoot AA2 & AA5 but never tried WW231.
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  #26  
Old 07-18-2019, 02:42 PM
plumas
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The Norma website lists 7x64 reload data.

https://www.norma-ammunition.com/us/...ing-Data/7x64/
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  #27  
Old 07-18-2019, 03:22 PM
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I collect freebies when I find them, the Hodgdon magazine every two or three years and the Lymans whenever there is something new for the calibers I load for. And of course I consult the powder company websites.
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  #28  
Old 07-18-2019, 06:11 PM
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Very interesting information, gentlemen. Wanted to add that, yes, while powder manufacturing does change/evolve with time, and today's IMR, Winchester, VV, Hodgdon may have a different formulation/burn rate than it did 10 or more years ago, it is still normally within a narrowly defined tolerance. And as noted, bullet bearing surface/shape differs among different manufacturers, even of the same weight. But what skews velocity variations even more, is that there is no industry standard testing methodology. Some manufacturers use a universal pressure testing receiver and 24" test barrels, while some use an off the shelf production rifle with as short as a 16" barrel, in the case of a .556 NATO chambered, AR style carbine. And not all test loads are tested to their officially rated SAMMI pressures; some are tested lower, some even higher. Agree you can't meaningfully compare different loads to each other, without publishing the CUP pressures along with the loads. The main reason I handload, is to have more consistent, shot to shot (and therefore more accurate) cartridges, than any factory can produce, specifically tailored/fitted to my individual rifles. With only a couple of exceptions; maximum pressure/velocity charges rarely give me the most accurate results in the calibers I reload for.

Last edited by Steve Newman; 07-18-2019 at 06:14 PM.
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  #29  
Old 07-18-2019, 08:26 PM
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I consider powder to be the critical factor and the means of determining pressure have improved over the years. I find it easiest to just check on-line for the latest load data. The problem with this is that some nice powders that I still have in stock have fallen off the back of the wagon for unexplained reasons. Bottom line is that I'm an on-line guy that keeps old books and catalogs.


I have one v old Sierra book that I keep for the cartridge dimensions. I don't think those have changed.
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  #30  
Old 07-18-2019, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fourbore View Post
I just got a Brno 600 in 7x64. The conventional wisdom is to use 280Rem data. Or so, I thought. Well, maybe time for another book, just because

Are American's buying new rifles in 7x64?

How times have changed - This country went from hating everything metric to calling the 270 a 6.8mm.


No I don't think they are it's a mid nineties European mountain rifle a friend bought off the line at Illion. But 280 is higher pressure with slightly more case space. But not by much. If you compare you will see the 280 is a straighter case wall 7x64 has a lot of taper. And like you I was just going to go the reduced 280 loads but Hornady's tenth edition I think surprised me with it.
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