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  #1  
Old 07-25-2018, 07:07 AM
Triggershoe
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ISSC SPA Rifles



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Can anyone "school" me on the ISSC SPA rifles? Interested in any comments, good/bad, on this toggle-based action. How are the triggers? Also, does anyone know if the receiver/action is identical (I realize the barrel and mag ARE different, of course) on the .17 HMR and .22 LR versions? Really would appreciate comments from folks that actually own/use these rifles rather than anecdotal info.
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Old 08-05-2018, 02:04 PM
45-otto
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I'll try to answer your questions in order, 1. The toggle action is somewhat stiffer than my Biathlon Basic, that is it requires more effort to initiate the opening stroke and it appears to cock on closing, and more effort to close the action at the end of the cycling stroke, I have no experience with the Anschutz Fortner action rifle for comparison 2. The trigger is very light but there is some initial travel before it breaks - has not proven to be a detriment for me if I practice good trigger control, 3. The receiver/action is most likely the same for the 17 HMR as the toggle action opening stroke is much further back than necessary for .22 LR - additionally the .22 LR magazine is much longer front to back than is necessary for .22 LR. The magazine positions the .22 LR rounds toward the front of the mag with a nearly 3/8" molded in spacer in the rear of the mag.

Some general comments: The receiver is an anodized aluminum extrusion that is grooved on it's top side for typical tip off scope rings with a rear block of what appears to be machined steel that provides the rear pivot point for the bolt toggle link. The barrel is mounted to a square steel block which is in turn affixed to the front of the receiver. The barreled action is held in the stock by means of a single Allen head screw ahead of the trigger guard/mag housing. The barrel is free floated it's entire length. The stock on mine is a very light shade of walnut with what appears to be machine checkering with Schnabel fore end and has a flat finish of some sort on it. Mine has what appears to be water spots in whatever stain was used before the surface finish was applied so looks a little freckled. I plan to strip the stock, properly stain and oil finish it if I ever get around to it (too many rim-fires, too many projects). Let me know if you have anymore questions.

Last edited by 45-otto; 08-05-2018 at 02:07 PM.
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  #3  
Old 08-05-2018, 04:24 PM
Triggershoe
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SPA Action

Quote:
Originally Posted by 45-otto View Post
I'll try to answer your questions in order, 1. The toggle action is somewhat stiffer than my Biathlon Basic, that is it requires more effort to initiate the opening stroke and it appears to cock on closing..... 2. The trigger is very light but there is some initial travel before it breaks - has not proven to be a detriment for me if I practice good trigger control, 3. The receiver/action is most likely the same for the 17 HMR as the toggle action opening stroke is much further back than necessary for .22 LR - additionally the .22 LR magazine is much longer front to back than is necessary for .22 LR. The magazine positions the .22 LR rounds toward the front of the mag with a nearly 3/8" molded in spacer in the rear of the mag.

Some general comments: The receiver is an anodized aluminum extrusion that is grooved on it's top side for typical tip off scope rings with a rear block of what appears to be machined steel that provides the rear pivot point for the bolt toggle link. The barrel is mounted to a square steel block which is in turn affixed to the front of the receiver. Let me know if you have anymore questions.
45otto----thanks for those comments. I had an idea about converting a 17hmr model to .22lr. Mainly, because there seems to be a hoard of .17hmr models available and none of the 22lr's, and also simply because I like the toggle action generally. I realize that to do this, at a minimum, I would need to replace the barrel and obtain some .22lr mags. You mentioned the barrel is mounted to a square steel block which is in turn affixed to the front of the receiver. Can you elaborate a bit more on this, and do you think it is feasible to do a barrel swap? I realize it probably is NOT cost effective to do this, but I have not seen any .22lr specimens for sale.
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  #4  
Old 08-05-2018, 06:46 PM
45-otto
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The steel block the barrel is inserted into is then inserted into the front of the aluminum receiver extrusion. It's been a year or two since I've had mine out of the wood and can't remember if the steel "barrel extension" (steel block) is pinned into the receiver or set screwed in some fashion. Likewise I'm not sure how the barrel is affixed to the barrel extension, threaded or pinned. I'll dig mine out of the safe tomorrow and remove the barreled action from the wood and see if I can be more specific.
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Old 08-06-2018, 12:08 PM
45-otto
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O.K. I took mine out of the wood (good thing as my memory ain't that great) and need to make a correction or two to my comments. The barreled action is held in the stock by the previously mentioned stock screw ahead of the trigger guard and the rear trigger guard screw as well. The barrel extension is affixed into the receiver by means of an Allen head screw in what appears to be a hardened bushing on either side of the receiver as well as a "pinch" screw so that the receiver grips the barrel extension once head space is set before the Allen head screws are tightened. The Allen head screw bushings sit in shallow recesses that are slightly oval shaped to allow fore and aft movement of the barrel extension to adjust head space. I didn't remove the barrel/extension from the receiver because I don't have .22 LR go/no go headspace gauges to reset headspace after reinstallation of the barrel so am unable to tell you if the barrel is threaded into or pressed into the barrel extension or set screwed or cross pinned. If you PM me with a place to send photos I will send you annotated pix of my barreled action showing what the receiver front and rear areas look like, also a pic of the top of the .22 LR magazine. My guess is that re-barreling wouldn't be an insurmountable project. I would also mention that the cartridge feed ramp is a separate piece mounted to the barrel extension not machined into the barrel so machining the rear face of a replacement barrel would be a simple matter of making sure the rear face is machined flush with the barrel extension rear surface.
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  #6  
Old 08-07-2018, 06:51 AM
Triggershoe
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[QUOTE=45-otto;11119619] If you PM me with a place to send photos I will send you annotated pix of my barreled action showing what the receiver front and rear areas look like, also a pic of the top of the .22 LR magazine.

45otto---thanks, and check your PM's
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  #7  
Old 08-08-2018, 03:25 PM
jagerman

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triggershoe View Post
45otto----thanks for those comments. I had an idea about converting a 17hmr model to .22lr. Mainly, because there seems to be a hoard of .17hmr models available and none of the 22lr's, and also simply because I like the toggle action generally. I realize that to do this, at a minimum, I would need to replace the barrel and obtain some .22lr mags. You mentioned the barrel is mounted to a square steel block which is in turn affixed to the front of the receiver. Can you elaborate a bit more on this, and do you think it is feasible to do a barrel swap? I realize it probably is NOT cost effective to do this, but I have not seen any .22lr specimens for sale.
May I ask why not just buy a volquartsen summit,or a biathlon basic,or a steyr,or anschutz even zastva made a cheap toggle or just buy one I'm sure there are some out there or is there some reason you want to cobble together one?
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Old 08-09-2018, 09:16 AM
Triggershoe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jagerman View Post
May I ask why not just buy a volquartsen summit,or a biathlon basic,or a steyr,or anschutz even zastva made a cheap toggle or just buy one I'm sure there are some out there or is there some reason you want to cobble together one?
jagerman--- All very good points/questions. I guess my answer is that I just think the toggle-actioned guns are interesting, and more or less uncommon. I have two Izhmash 7-2's that I shoot on a regular basis, and they are accurate and fun rifles to shoot. I have a LOT of fun shooting CMP style Rimfire Sporter matches with these, and also other general target shooting duties like "Woods Walks" (silhouette type shoots). Many times during competitions mine will be the ONLY toggle actioned rifle. I kind of like that. The Anschutz biathlon action is VERY interesting to me, but I doubt I would spend that kind of coin on ANY .22 rimfire, as nice as the Anschutz is. To each his own.... However, I do like to tinker, though, and a rebarrel job on the ISSC is probably not beyond my capabilities (have lathe and tooling). Right now, I'm just trying to gather information is all. Regarding the ISSC rifles, I have seen NO new specimens offered other than those chambered for the .17HMR. I did see a USED one (,17HMR) on the RFC trading post. I think that is what initially got my attention regarding the ISSC rifles. One of these can be had for $300 NIB currently. OK, you DID ask me, so I hope some of this makes sense to you. Maybe not...
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  #9  
Old 08-09-2018, 10:22 PM
armed hiker
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Just happened to catch a moment and popped back on the forum I am too busy at work to spend much time here now but I can throw in what I know.

I bought one of the ISSC 17hmr last fall/this winter and still have not shot it. From handling it I would pretty much echo everything 45-otto has said.

Compared to my BB the action is not nearly as smooth, I do not know if it will improve with use especially if I never go shooting

Overall I am very happy with the rifle for the price they are selling for, I too have found I like the toggle actions so would be happy adding as many as I can find/afford.

On that note you should know the Steyr rimfire scout IS the same rifle with a few changes. The stock being a obvious one some even are offered with threaded barrels IIRC.

I am most interested in what they changed with the safety, one thing I am not so sure of on the ISSC version is the safety is inside the trigger guard and to put the rifle on safe you pull the small nub of a safety towards the trigger.

Steyr or ISSC decided on the Steyr to change it a bit and though it looks kind of goofy should make it harder to slip while attempting to engage the safety.

Would I buy it again? At the price they were selling for you better believe it. Will I buy another version? I have a suspicion that the Steyer will sell as well as the rest of the toggle actions and there will be closeout sales on them someday and then I hope to add another .22lr but maybe a .22mag.

Good luck in your quest!
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Old 08-10-2018, 08:27 AM
Triggershoe
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[QUOTE=armed hiker;11123871]Just happened to catch a moment and popped back on the forum I am too busy at work to spend much time here now but I can throw in what I know.

I bought one of the ISSC 17hmr last fall/this winter and still have not shot it. From handling it I would pretty much echo everything 45-otto has said.

....you should know the Steyr rimfire scout IS the same rifle with a few changes. The stock being a obvious one some even are offered with threaded barrels IIRC.


Armed Hiker---appreciate that info. So, get out there and SHOOT that thing so that you can post how well you like or dislike it after you get a chance to actually use it. Also, thanks for the info on the Steyr. I was not aware of that, so I'll do some digging on that as well.
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Old 08-10-2018, 10:49 AM
45-otto
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Armed Hiker - Thanks for the info on the Steyr. It definitely is the same barreled action. Not sure about the safety, looks a little kludgy compared to the ISSC base rifle. I've not shot SPA alot but the safety hasn't been a problem so far. I guess if one is distracted or clumsy the trigger could inadvertently be pulled. If Steyr could have retained the "inline" nature of the ISSC original safety but somehow positioned the "switch" just forward of, or incorporated into the trigger guard ala BB 7-2 it would have been a win all around. According to the description on the Steyr U.S. website their version is supplied with a METAL magazine. I think I'll see if I can purchase just a magazine, see if it truly is compatible with the original SPA and report back. Other SPA owners may be in need of a spare and the Steyr mag could fill the bill. ISSC has not been too supportive recently. Again, thanks for the heads up.

Last edited by 45-otto; 08-10-2018 at 11:54 AM.
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  #12  
Old 09-02-2018, 01:01 AM
izhm
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Any update on the Steyr ?
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Old 09-02-2018, 10:38 AM
45-otto
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Sorry, been helping a friend move out of state. The Steyr .22 LR magazine supplied with their ISSC manufactured .22 LR Scout Rifle is exactly the same as that supplied with the original ISSC SPA .22 LR rifle. Steyr America charges $28.00 per magazine plus shipping. The new direct importer for ISSC does not have and will not stock the SPA magazines. My guess is that ISSC has discontinued the original rifle under their brand name in favor of the Steyr version. Hope this helps.
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  #14  
Old 09-02-2019, 09:23 PM
izhm
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What was the retail price for the Steyr Scout and did they offer it with a wooden stock ? Can you use .22 long rifle in the .22 WRM Scout the mags. are the same length front to back ?
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