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  #31  
Old 09-04-2021, 10:23 AM
bobnoffs

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it would be interesting to prove or disprove the mirage theory with a gun vise. wonder what the gun and ammo mfgr. would have to say.
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  #32  
Old 09-04-2021, 10:58 AM
1813benny
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Mirage theory? Please elaborate.
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  #33  
Old 09-04-2021, 11:05 AM
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100 yard accuracy

1.5x1.5 is common with CCI SV. And thats out in the open across a field.

Mostly its vertical than horizontal. I have shot some MOA 1 groups but they were with good strings.
I dont usually shoot 5 like a center fire. Usually its 20 or more. That semi auto is just to easy to shoot. With a 25yd zero I drop out 6 from bullseye.


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Last edited by Kilerham; 09-15-2021 at 08:11 AM.
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  #34  
Old 09-04-2021, 05:00 PM
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Groups under 2" at 100 with CCI SV are good results.

With a good rifle and good conditions, ammo is always the key. The trouble is that it's often hard to find really consistently good-shooting ammo.

Even with what's usually thought of as "better" ammo, at 100 yards good results can be hard to come by, especially when shooting outdoors. Some lots produce consistent results with almost every round in a box, while others may give ten or twenty consecutive consistent rounds with enough outliers to spoil the results.

Below is an example of a consistent lot with a target showing ten shot groups shot in August this year. While it hasn't produced the best groups, the lot is generally more consistent than the lots that have had ten very good consecutive rounds. It is CX.



The outside-to-outside measurements average 0.904" (23.0mm).



_______________

The smallest ten shot groups I had last month were produced with M+. Unfortunately, this lot isn't as consistent as CX lot shown above. It often produces one nice ten shot group, but the others are less notable. In short, it hasn't been consistent for 30 shots.

The best ten shot groups below, one on each shown below, are .727" and .636" (18.5 and 16.2mm) measured outside-to-outside. They're nice when they appear, but too often the rest of the groups are indicative of the overall consistency -- and it's not good.

I'd rather have more of the CX lot than the M+ lot. A few nice groups don't cut it.



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  #35  
Old 09-13-2021, 12:55 PM
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100 yard accuracy


For reference aiming center heart with a 25yd zero. Center of heart to center of group is 6
This is windy across a NC down east field.


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Last edited by Kilerham; 09-15-2021 at 08:12 AM.
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  #36  
Old 09-13-2021, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Kilerham View Post

For reference aiming center heart with a 25yd zero. Center of heat to center of group is 6”
This is windy across a NC down east field.


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Thank you for.the post. Is this target with Irons pr scoped and what rifle?

Looking forward to your reply
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  #37  
Old 09-13-2021, 01:35 PM
Norwegianrimfire is online now

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5 shots and not counting the "lucky" now and then groups. 1" to 2" depending on the wind and the day of the shooter
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  #38  
Old 09-14-2021, 11:49 AM
StephenBachiler

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Originally Posted by MKnarr View Post
I have some info that may or may not be useful related to shoot 100 yard group matches. Remember these are high end rifles and high end ammo and many were using wind flags. Five shot winning groups would be around 3/8 and high end would be close to an inch.
I hold the record there with this group shot on demand, not cherry picked.

I also have targets like Penage.


These are also not cherry picked but were not shot with wind flags.
Keep in mind if the wind is a problem at 50 yards, it's a mama bear at 100. A one MPH 90 degree wind is worth about .3 of an inch with subsonic ammo and about .4 with High Velocity stuff. And velocity variations are the culprit for vertical dispersion.
Years ago we held a 100 yard group match on the forum, Shoot as many groups as you want and send the best to be measured. Even cherry picked groups would run from .3 to 1.25 with all kinds of ammo, rifles and scopes.
When you think about it, 100 yard prone matches are usually shot with metallic sights and the 10 ring is 2 inches. It amazing how many of those shooters can shoot 40 shots inside the ten ring.
Great stuff! This is the type of content that keeps me coming back for more I'm especially interested in your comments on the 100 yd iron site shooting
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  #39  
Old 09-14-2021, 05:21 PM
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Good rifles are not especially hard to find. Much more challenging to find is consistently shooting ammo that produces good results at 100 yards. Regardless of the name on the box, not all lots of any variety will be capable of producing consistent results.

Below are all three of the targets I shot yesterday at 100 yards with a certain lot of CX. These three targets are cherry picked only insofar as they are all the targets shot yesterday with that CX lot. The targets have three ten-shot groups (one with five sighters), so two boxes of my dwindling supply. It has outperformed every other lot of CX and M+ (and one of X-Act) that I've tried over the last month-and-a-half.

I was using a different rifle than I used for the targets showed previously.

Note that the shooting was not for score, but rather for group size. All three targets had CTC group averages below .800", with one just under .700". They were the product of very consistent ammo.

None of the other targets I shot with other lots of Lapua were as consistent. Ammo is the most important element of good results. No rifle, regardless of make, will outshoot the ammo it's given. And it helps to have good conditions.


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  #40  
Old 09-14-2021, 07:20 PM
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I very rarely take pictures of targets. The only reason I have this one is because it was my first group out of a 10/22 VLEH (Target Tactical) after I got it back from CPC for a full tune-up. I do most of my shooting @100 yards. The upper left I was dialing in my scope. Ammo was just Norma Tac-22.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20180619_142828486_1631661620509.jpg (506.5 KB, 14 views)

Last edited by Nick7274; 09-14-2021 at 10:06 PM.
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  #41  
Old 09-15-2021, 08:10 AM
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100 yard accuracy

Quote:
Originally Posted by StephenBachiler View Post
Thank you for.the post. Is this target with Irons pr scoped and what rifle?

Looking forward to your reply


CCI SV
10x scoped
Nothing slow about getting shots down range.
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  #42  
Old 09-15-2021, 09:00 AM
jaia
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Mirage theory? Please elaborate.

Most only think of mirage as heat caused shimmer at extended distance.
Causes distortion or apparent image movement through y'er scope.
There are also those who feel the heat rising from the barrel
will cause a similar problem much closer to the optics.
I've seen battery operated fans on the bench
blowing air across the barrel to minimize the problem.
Also, heat shields mounted atop the barrel to push the shimmers
outside the line of view over the barrel.

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/tag/mirage-shield/


And just because I'm feeling loquacious this morning, enough of shooting groups.

That ain't accuracy in my book. Accuracy is hitting what you aim at.

Instead of groups which wander all over the target, try shooting a grid 50.

A grid 50 y'er thinking...what is he babbling about?
Grab a section of cardboard, a marker and a straight edge,
draw a grid, 10 lines vertical by 5 lines horizontal, then try to punch those intersections.
After you try it, get back to me about how consistent ya' are at 50 or 100 yards.


Last edited by jaia; 09-15-2021 at 09:11 AM.
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  #43  
Old 09-15-2021, 11:16 AM
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Mirage comes in two flavors. Slow and fast. Fast is the kind we can see and then there is slow.
Slow is when the heat of the day warms things up and actually moves the point of impact because the preceived image changes position. I'm can only describe it as that There was a a guy in precision shooting magazine when it was in print years ago that wrote on the subject. I forget his name. But I learned a lot from his articles.
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  #44  
Old 09-15-2021, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaia View Post
And just because I'm feeling loquacious this morning, enough of shooting groups. <img src="https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Wink" class="inlineimg" />

That ain't accuracy in my book. Accuracy is hitting what you aim at. <img src="https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/images/smilies/oldman.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Old Man" class="inlineimg" />

Instead of groups which wander all over the target, try shooting a grid 50
Not necessarily disagreeing with you but people have posted groups to show potential accuracy as long as I've been around here and I'm sure well before. At least they're multiple groups on the same target.

I don't usually take pictures of my targets because I just really don't feel the need to. If people believe what I say then great, if they don't.....well......that's just fine too.

Last edited by Nick7274; 09-15-2021 at 03:48 PM.
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  #45  
Old 09-15-2021, 12:50 PM
StephenBachiler

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick7274 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaia View Post
And just because I'm feeling loquacious this morning, enough of shooting groups. <img src="https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Wink" class="inlineimg" />

That ain't accuracy in my book. Accuracy is hitting what you aim at. <img src="https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/images/smilies/oldman.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Old Man" class="inlineimg" />

Instead of groups which wander all over the target, try shooting a grid 50
Not necessarily disagreeing with you but people have posted groups to show potential accuracy as long as I've been around here and I'm sure we'll before. At least they're multiple groups on the same target.

I don't usually take pictures of my targets because I just really don't feel the need to. If people believe what I say then great, if they don't.....well......that's just fine too.
When I first got in this game...I saved all my paper targets....which became a pain...then I took pictures of them....and that became a pain..now I just take picture of extrodinary targets...for me to use as guideposts in my advancement..
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