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Are any .22 ammo companies improving ammo?

10K views 58 replies 32 participants last post by  Discontinued 
#1 ·
It will probably take time, but with all of the interest in long range and elr shooting, companies will hopefully start upgrading ammo. Better designed bullets would be a good place to start.


Anyone have any current information on this?
 
#36 ·
Even the now called "Aguila Primed" no longer verbally tied to the Eley name on the packaging but still the same looking clumpy primer as it had been during the use of "Eley Primed" on Aguila packaging (for increasing their sales) days.
So nice of Eley to allow Aguila (Industrias Tecnos) to do that. :rolleyes:
After all Aguila (Industrias Tecnos) had been packaging purple colored box Eley Sport, certainly Eley could also allow the use of their Trademark "Eley Prime". ;)

I'd say some force is at work ether air movement (ie) (that is to say) release of a vacuum too suddenly.

Or centrifugal force/gravity come into play when the bullets are seated or tipped upside down for lubing?

But either of those two manufacturing steps would mean that the primer was still wet? Making me wonder what that would do for discharge? Without hearing of multiple failures to fire here on RFC I'd think that it could possibly be the vacuum problem? Unless? Here's another thought. The propellant is also stuck onto the primer is it not? Would then the powder draw out sufficient moisture from the primer for ignition? If so it could be as you say "never setting" or wet while being processed into a cartridge. :eek:

As I mentioned Aguila Colibre/Super Colibre have perfect compressed priming. None of that globular clumpy crap.

So either Aguila (Industrias Tecnos) knows how to prime the Eley method way with their Colibre/Super Colibre and not their other cartridges or they are not priming their Colibre/Super Colibre someone else is!
 
#37 ·
Here is a thought about why manufacturers "don't improve their ammo". I live in a town of 15000 and a county of 45,000. There is virtually no .22LR competition in this town. I have to drive 50 miles to Cortez, CO or Farmington NM to compete.

In my town there was two of us that shot in competition, Between here and Cortez and Farmington I know every one who competed and the total number was about 35 people out of probably 75,000. When I lived in Pennsylvania, I competed in position shooting between three counties and 8 clubs. Maybe 200,000 people and maybe 50 shooters.

I am the range chairman for the local Bayfield Lions public range. I see probably 50 to 100 people shooting .22s a year and most can't hit a bull in the butt at 50 yards. Since my shooting partner no longer shoots, I am the only one that is a serious .22 shooter.

My point is American made ammo is more than capable of hitting the bull's butt and at the rate they churn it out, there isn't a lot of time or inclination to "improve" their ammo. The market for bucket of bullets is huge and most of those people are happy if the ammo goes bang.

This forum has 157,000 members and I doubt that half are active. Most of those are happy with 1 inch at 50 yards and even those don't represent the the majority of .22 shooters in the US who never heard of Rimfire Central. That isn't to say that there aren't some very skilled people on the forum but even those should admit that the current crop of RWS, Eley and Lapua is more than accurate enough for most of the targets that we shoot at. As a benchrest shooter, I to wish that I didn't have to spend $60.00 to $100.00 just to lot test so I could spend $1500 on a case of ammo. I'll bet the big three also wished they could improve consistency so all there product went out the door as the top end and they didn't have to downgrade to the next level. When I was a semiconductor engineer we had a full department of engineers plus technicians in the shop who's job it was to reduce costs and improve yield and I'm sure ammo makers do the same. Here endth the sermon.
 
#38 ·
The market for high end rimfire ammo is small, at least here in the USA. Not recalling exact dates but sometime back in the 1990's Federal made a competitive top quality round, and the US olympic shooters won some medals with it. The price was too much for the usual American market and it was discontinued. If you want superb ammo you'll have to get it from certain specialty manufacturers, and there are none in the USA currently. Eley, Lapua and RWS are pretty much it worldwide unless there has been anything around I'm not aware of.
 
#39 ·
Another factor to consider while the European makers tend to have extensive world wide distribution , for the most part the domestic makers pretty much limit distribution to the states and Canada.
In many places in the world 22 competition shooting is very popular and often the only shooting sport around.
This is why I think the Europeans have a wide variety of higher quality accuracy oriented ammo.
In preparing for shooting an accuracy oriented rifle game for the first time since college ( was on a college small bore team about 32 years ago now) NRL 22, I took my rifle a humble savage mark II to the range with every box of ammo I could find under $10. ( perhaps as I gain skill I can see a reason to go to more expensive stuff but not yet) this included multiple European makers and the CCI standard as a baseline. The Savage shot average groups with only one type ( sk riflematch) better than CCI and the difference was not enough to justify the 3x cost difference.
I shoot steel challenge and bullseye pistol matches and run of the mill CCI is more than adequate there.
I also agree that the American market for precision 22 ammo is rather small compared to the plinking and small game hunters
 
#40 ·
Another factor to consider while the European makers tend to have extensive world wide distribution , for the most part the domestic makers pretty much limit distribution to the states and Canada.
I'd say that the European makers are big over here is because the USA is a huge lucrative market. "Limit Distribution"? If sales abroad called for it I'm sure they'd send all they could over there. I know for sure CCI SV goes over there as does Remington and Federal as those Foreign RFC members and others have reported purchasing these. I can't say I heard much about Winchester sales abroad, and I'm not sure why? Maybe just hadn't been reported. But Winchester has likely already closed Australian production so now you know where US production will be heading as no other production facility exists.
The company's general manager, Clive Pugh, said that ammunition assembly operations will cease at the facility in 2019, with production moving to Winchester sites in the US.
https://www.manmonthly.com.au/winchester+ceases+manufacturing+geelong
 
#42 ·
I've never tried it myself but there have been many here rave about it. Travel back in the pages and you may see some talking about it,...maybe do search :)




:heartpumpEmmanuel-

pipestone
 
#44 ·
I think the OP asks a very good question. As for USA ammo, it seems that our last hope lies with CCI. I do not have a lot of trouble with their stuff, and I hope they can keep the quality decent. But I don't expect them to be competition with Eley and Lapua match grade ammo, for reasons MKnarr mentioned previously. Aguila is not the 'best' ammo, but that is a company that may have improved over the past ten years, while US companies went the other way. Though my last brick of Aguila sv was not too good! RUAG/RWS is apparently manufacturing for a number of labels (Geco, Federal match, Norma, walther, maybe others) , so that outfit has a lot of potential influence in the future. I don't know if any of their brands are consistently better than others, or if its all the same stuff and accuracy depends mostly on lot numbers.
 
#45 ·
Many years ago, probably 2006/07 I tested one lot of RWS 50. As I recall it didn't shoot very well and the velocity on 15 rounds ran from 978 to 1051 FPS for a spread of 73 FPS. That's not a good omen. I wonder what the same stuff would be like today.

I know a few years ago Lapua started to make their ammo more consistent. I've tested 8 lots of Midas and Center X and the velocity spread on all 8 lots was between 27 and 32 FPS and the average velocity was around 1050 FPS. Different lots of Eley Match were a lot worse.
 
#46 ·
LAPUA QUALITY

Latest performance from Lapua ammo shot in a major match- ARA indoor Nationals
it set a new ARA record of 2416.67 agg.(indoor) same rifle-ammo shot 2-2500
Mike Sherrill was the shooter

Prior to this amazing performance of shooter, rifle and ammo. 8- 2500 were shot at a weekend match, of the 8 -2500 6 were shot using Lapua

I would say Lapua is making great ammo

Lee
 
#47 ·
Something is Improving!

During the 2019 American Rimfire Association Outdoor Season, a total of 29 perfect scores of 2500 were recorded and certified. This was accomplished by 18 different shooters.

This compares to only 17 perfect scores by just 11 different shooters in 2017.

In 2012, there were only 5 Certified Perfect ARA Scores.

https://www.americanrimfire.com/index.php/records/index/UNLIMITED_OUTDOOR

What do you think is getting better?

Shooters?

Rifles?

Ammo?

Here is the Equipment List from the recent ARA Indoor Nationals. Theoretically, Equipment and ammo are more relevant indoors, where other variables are minimized.

https://www.americanrimfire.com/index.php/results

If you didn't know already, ARA is introducing a new Factory Class for the 2020 Season. Here is a link to the rules and which rifles are allowed (so far).

https://www.americanrimfire.com/index.php/supplies
 
#48 ·
CCI Blazer used to be inconsistent a few years ago.

I have found Lot# L27X10 to be consistent, with most cartridges tipping the scales at 51.2grains and with the same rim size, spot on the nose for all fifty in each brick in that Lot#.

That never happened in the past. For the price, it is hard to beat. My scores speak for themselves. Consistent .22 LR ammo that suits a handgun or rifle is all we really need.
 
#49 · (Edited)
Well I personally think SK have made some kind of improvement in the last 12 months. I’ve started shooting the new Long Range Match and it’s definitely better. Originally I changed to Flatnose and it was awesome in my Anschutz 64MPR as well as others CZ’s but when the long range came out my groups out past 75m halved. Below is what I can do in normal conditions @90m for 32rds. The vertical spread is 1/2 of SK flatnose...... the 2nd picture ( different day)

This has also been the observation of at least 2 others in my club that have tried the SK Long Range in there rifles. Noticeable reduction in vertical stringing of there groups.
 

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#53 ·
I have to agree with Treefeller regarding the SK line. Once you get out around 100 yards and up, the Long Range seems to come into it's own and at least in my rifles, put up significantly better groups than about any others I have tried.

Jaia, have you you done any of your testing on it?

Also, how is it that the above mentioned SK Long Range is only mediocre at 50 yards but shines at longer distances? Educate me because logic says it would be tighter at 50 too, right?
 
#59 · (Edited)
A view from over the pond

In the UK we have a long tradition of small bore and miniature rifle clubs which by far exceeds practical shooting and gallery rifle. This was something you did at school or University and as such we have quite a diverse mix of shooters in the UK.

With that in mind for us Limeys, accuracy has always been a top priority hence we are the home of Eley ammunition. As a youth I would use nothing other than Eley Wasp airgun pellets they were visibly high quality, you could clearly see there were no imperfections in the manufacture of these pellets, they were simply miles ahead of the game in terms of consistency.Also it was encouraging to see an "inspected by" label on the inside of the tin to say that "Paul" had actually checked these pellets and ensured they were not rubbish.
These where not match grade just ordinary domed pellets

Airguns among other things taught me to closely examine what I feed my guns I became an Ammo Snob.

I would suggest a quality magnifying glass, and really look your ammo, prepare to be horrifiyed!
In recent years It became apparent that many ammunition manufacturers where cost cutting. Even Eley they sold off airgun pellet production and Wasps vanished from the market which is a crying shame for old airgun enthusiasts as we cannot get 5.6 mm quality pellets for our vintage British airguns
Even Eley club/sport is now garbage at least 1 in a box will misfire or have no priming compound, the heads look rough and un-lubed inconsistent velocities, dirty powder and cheap brass are the order of the day. Thankfully Tenex escaped this

Don't even get me started on Remington or Federal ammo, next time you purchase and therefore encourage this dastardly manufacture, just look at those rough, loose fitting heads that look like they were sand casted and made out of the hardest lead known to man, no more slimy lube because the snowflakes don't want to get dirty hands!
Bringing wet wipes to the range is just too much for some people!

CCI standard used to be exceptional, as did mini mag but after examining a recent batch of standard velocity I noticed many heads where actually malformed as clearly an obscuration had entered the press at the time of manufacture, Yet again CCIi where using coal for gun powder.

Even my beloved RWS Geko seemed to go downhill and had all of the above attributes, I remember the sales rep from Germany saying he felt embarrassed to sell such kakka, as we had an RWS sponsored shoot where 80% or the competitor's returned the ammo because it would not function in a Ruger or Buckmark and was rough,dirty and above all inconsistent.
It looked like the heads where from the Rmington bulk not the beautifully formed Geko which was a stalwart of almost every Gallery rifle shooter in the UK. Fortunately for me I was compensated with 5000 RWS rifle match

In the UK we used to use really decent cheap ammo such as RWS Geko and CCI standard. This stuff cost £1:80p a box and would happily put round upon round on the same hole without a problem if I used my Anschutz 54. Today things are a bit different.

Our Club secretary (Boss) is a bigwig in the UK NSRA and held several prone rifle records, he relayed to usused to regularly clean 100 with BSA Martini using supplied military ammo "grey box".

I believe this stuff was Eley as the cases have the "E" stamp on them and found them to be superbly accurate. I was even given a job lot of "Crammo" for next to nothing which contained a few gems such as ICI .22 shorts made sometime in the 60's judging by the box and a couple of "grey box" British .22 military issue along with some Canadian Military .22 I remember using the "grey box" Eley stuff as a cadet in the 2nd royal tank regiment (2RTR) it was outsandingly accurate!

Nowadays the only ammo I will feed my guns is quality SK + and RWS club for the Ruger and Tennex for my Ansuchtz, although the Annie really loved the SK bean can stuff too, just don't tell anyone!

RWS club was so good that I had only to misfires in 3 years of comp with the 10/22 it burns so clean its hard to tell if you even used the gun, I must have shot close to 50k rounds on the ciruit in that time, even cllub has become less consistant, it functions flalwessly but the groups are somewhat larger than they used to be.

However, the Ruger 1022 simply adores Tennex but my Wallet does not especially at £25 a box of 50 so its a Fiver a mag in the Ruger muhahahaha

It is quite easy to find good ammo, you just have to pay a tad more for it.I would encourage anyone else to steer away from the Remington Bulk or other trashy ammunition as you are only encouraging these companies to continue with this abhorant and most shocking practice!

The younger generation are at risk of never knowing good ammo at affordable prices.
 
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