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Old 05-24-2019, 01:35 PM
squirrel1
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Leveling reticle on CZ 455 with DIP product 11mm to weaver style rail mount



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Alignging scope reticle on this nightforce 2.5x10.
I have a tool pictured below.
But what if one doesn’t have this tool, then what?

The picatinny rail slots allow a section of 17 caliber cleaning brass rod to fit well, loose but will balance nicely as it is moved from side to side.

I actually used this section of rod and a plumb bob at 50 yards scope at 10x and a level on top of elevation knob.
Aligned the scope this way by looking at clearance under the parallax knob and windage knob by stepping back some 10-12 feet.
Got each side clearance wise the same just by eyeballing.
Scope cross hair (vertical one) aligned with plumb bob string.

After aligning this way tightened scope screws a bit and checked with my device made of aluminum pictured. Seems to be dead nuts on.
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Last edited by squirrel1; 05-24-2019 at 01:41 PM.
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Old 05-24-2019, 02:25 PM
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I'd say use whatever works.

When centering a scope I don't use any gadgets anymore. I do use a bubble level on all my scopes though. Centering a scope is really really simple. With the scope mounted to the rifle and the bubble level mounted to the scope, all a person needs to do is shoulder the rifle normally look at the crosshairs in the scope and rotate the scope to make it as vertical as you can just by eyeballing the vertical crosshair with the top of the receiver. After this you tighten down a ring screw or two so the scope will stay put and then you just rotate the level to where it's centered as you look through the scope. If the last part bothers you, or you don't trust your ability then just put the gun in a vice/cradle or whatever you have to hold it, go ahead at this time and tighten down the ring screws and then and put another bubble level on the top scope cap, center that level by rotating the rifle, once the bubble is centered then simple rotate the bubble level on the scope to match the one sitting on the scope cap. It really is just this simple.

All a scope mounted bubble level does is keep you consistent in your hold/position, it doesn't even have to be aligned correctly. Think about it, it wouldn't even matter if your crosshairs were designed like an X, as long as you hold your rifle where the bubble in your bubble level is centered then you are good to go. The level tells you that you have the same hold/position every time.

But, getting back to squirrel1, did you make that device or buy it? If I didn't have the tool you have I would use this.

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Old 05-24-2019, 02:35 PM
squirrel1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kisssofdeath View Post
I'd say use whatever works.

When centering a scope I don't use any gadgets anymore. I do use a bubble level on all my scopes though. Centering a scope is really really simple. With the scope mounted to the rifle and the bubble level mounted to the scope, all a person needs to do is shoulder the rifle normally look at the crosshairs in the scope and rotate the scope to make it as vertical as you can just by eyeballing the vertical crosshair with the top of the receiver. After this you tighten down a ring screw or two so the scope will stay put and then you just rotate the level to where it's centered as you look through the scope. If the last part bothers you, or you don't trust your ability then just put the gun in a vice/cradle or whatever you have to hold it, go ahead at this time and tighten down the ring screws and then and put another bubble level on the top scope cap, center that level by rotating the rifle, once the bubble is centered then simple rotate the bubble level on the scope to match the one sitting on the scope cap. It really is just this simple.

All a scope mounted bubble level does is keep you consistent in your hold/position, it doesn't even have to be aligned correctly. Think about it, it wouldn't even matter if your crosshairs were designed like an X, as long as you hold your rifle where the bubble in your bubble level is centered then you are good to go. The level tells you that you have the same hold/position every time.

But, getting back to squirrel1, did you make that device or buy it? If I didn't have the tool you have I would use this.

Bought it back in 2003 or 2004.
Can’t remember where from though.
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Old 05-24-2019, 02:54 PM
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Folks can do or believe what they want.

I can shoot a good shooting gun and tell if scope reticle is level.
How?

Put scope level device on scope and align with reticle ( remember indon’t Know if it is scope aligned with the receiver / barrel straight or not.

First shoot at 50 yards off of bench. With scope level. Shoot a few groups.
Then intentionally move level off full bubble from center and shoot for groups. Watch poi. Should be lower than before. If not, it higher scope not on right.
Can’t scope the other direction and shoot too, note poi.

Needs to be a good shooting gun a d no wind.

Back to 75 yards and try with half a bubble off in both directions. Same thing. Should shoot a little lower if on straight.

Scopes with smaller objectives and mounted real close to barrels harder to do this since scope cant not as affecting.
This above for 22 lr really. Not flatter shooting gun calibers/ designations.

Ideally if a gun is zeroed for a certain distance and scope is on correctly, it should never shoot high. Assuming perfect ammo/ shoorinf happening.

If I got a life time shot with my 25-06 at 400 yards and had to make a quick shot inwould hold a tad higher than where I wanted to hit purposely. Just in case I had rifle canted not knowing.
I had one of these season before last. But didn’t realize how big this buck was at 430 yards in the rain mist looking at with 10x binoculars.
A 160 classer. Ten pointer. Killed the following August in archery velvet hunt season (new season in Tn btw. - not by me.
Oh well, maybe next time.

One can put masking tape on mount and scope. Separate pieces. Draw a straight line indexing. Then one can loosen scope a little and rotate slightly and shoot and note poi change high low and left to right. Where guns shoots highest bingo!!

Remember the side mounting scopes on the Winchester 30-30s. Lol
Yeah try and zero one of those at 50 yards and shoot at 150. Lol
Scope cant of a different variety here though.
Similar effect as a double barrel side by side shotgun.

Last edited by squirrel1; 05-24-2019 at 03:10 PM.
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Old 05-24-2019, 04:33 PM
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Might sound screwball but I use to line levels, i lay one on top of the receiver(hopefully a flat top) and make sure the gun is level and then one on top of the scope turret cap, seems to work great for me.
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Old 05-24-2019, 05:39 PM
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Originally Posted by whtsmoke View Post
Might sound screwball but I use to line levels, i lay one on top of the receiver(hopefully a flat top) and make sure the gun is level and then one on top of the scope turret cap, seems to work great for me.
I don’t Ike to use those kinds of levels. The body on them some are whacky the they are set up.

One can run the portion of 17 caliber rod through the groove in scope mount slot like I have on mine and take level with squared housing and carefully lower it to the section of cleaning rod and see if level. And use another level on scope cap like you stated. But if parallax knob (if equipped) is the same size as the left right adjuster knob just eyeballing from distance works real well.
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Old 05-24-2019, 06:31 PM
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Line up on the cheap: I have used a lot of different set ups over the years but the cheapest one was some sewing thread from the wife's sewing kit and 2x 1/4" nuts.

Take the rifle and put it into your shooting rest...Take a push pin and wrap some thread around it push the pin into the ceiling and put one of the nuts on each thread. So you have one at the end of the stock and the other in front of the scope in front of the barrel. Center both lines dead center in the back of the stock to make sure rifle is straight and one in the center of the barrel.

if the scope crosshairs are not in line then adjust. It takes longer to set up than to adjust your scope.

Signalman

Last edited by Signalman1; 05-24-2019 at 06:33 PM.
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Old 05-24-2019, 09:36 PM
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Once upon a time I used to believe and do everything I read...like instructions even.

One day I mounted a scope and followed the instruction. Put the rifle in my cradle on my bench put a level on the receiver and leveled it, mounted the scope and leveled it, shouldered the rifle and voila, the crosshairs were crooked. Why you ask, because I was holding the gun in accordance with what was natural for me...not that bench.

Again, just do whatever works for you.
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Old 05-24-2019, 10:52 PM
squirrel1
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Having an aligned crosshair on rifle. This alone will force oneís how they shoulder/hold a rifle to be better. Make the rifle/scope setup drive younthe shooter.
Canted rifle not good. Especially hunting.

Now on a bench where yardage stays the same. Not so much a problem. One can make the gun zero easily. Say at 50 yards. Just donít expect to be lights out at a 100 in the horizontal if your shoot that far.
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Old 05-25-2019, 08:56 AM
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Leveling scope retical has always been challenging for me. I've tried so many methods but recently I've purchased a jig from Brownells that's really working well for me. It is the Arisaka Defense Optic Leveler. Very simple to use, it is a base piece with a 11 degree ramp slot and a wedge piece with 11 degree angle.
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/06...g?v=1436806291
Base on rail or flat on receiver, slide the wedge in the slot under the flat on the bottom of the scope to make contact with the scope. Rotate the scope to have full contact with the wedge inserted fully. Tighten the rings. Instructions say to tighten one side to spec before rotating the scope for full contact with the wedge.
I check the level sighting to a plumb bob line and it has been spot on for me. So simple that you can do it without a cradle for the gun. Just hold it in your lap if that's all you have at the moment.
If you naturally cant your rifle it will be readily apparent when you sight through the scope. Eliminated a lot of frustration for me.
Of course YMMV
This only works if the retical is level in the scope to start.

Last edited by fwood; 05-25-2019 at 08:58 AM.
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Old 05-25-2019, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squirrel1 View Post
Having an aligned crosshair on rifle. This alone will force oneís how they shoulder/hold a rifle to be better. Make the rifle/scope setup drive younthe shooter.
Canted rifle not good. Especially hunting.
I would disagree 100%. Why would you want to adapt to the rifle? Why not make the rifle adapt to you? If your car's steering wheel is too far away are you going to sit forward in the seat or adjust the steering wheel to reach you? By your statement above you would just lean forward.

Also, what difference would the cant make if the cant is the same every time?

Also, tell David Tubb he shouldn't cant his rifle when he won his 11 NRA rifle championships.

Also, in a hunting situation, cant would be even more important. But then again aren't you are the one who claims to have kill 1.2 million squirrels?
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Old 05-25-2019, 11:12 AM
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Very easy process. Level the rifle then put a bubble level on the top turret cap and twist the tube until the bubble centers.
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Old 05-25-2019, 12:36 PM
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I just eyeball it with a plumb line, and tweak at the range. I have an astigmatism, so what looks level to me ain’t gonna look level to you.
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Old 05-25-2019, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squirrel1 View Post
Alignging scope reticle on this nightforce 2.5x10.
I have a tool pictured below.
But what if one doesnít have this tool, then what?

The picatinny rail slots allow a section of 17 caliber cleaning brass rod to fit well, loose but will balance nicely as it is moved from side to side.

I actually used this section of rod and a plumb bob at 50 yards scope at 10x and a level on top of elevation knob.
Aligned the scope this way by looking at clearance under the parallax knob and windage knob by stepping back some 10-12 feet.
Got each side clearance wise the same just by eyeballing.
Scope cross hair (vertical one) aligned with plumb bob string.

After aligning this way tightened scope screws a bit and checked with my device made of aluminum pictured. Seems to be dead nuts on.
Well...now we know who's been shooting the barn.
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Old 05-26-2019, 03:41 AM
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Only two things matter in this regard:

1. Make sure the vertical member of the crosshair is pointing at the exact center of the bore, then fasten everything down. Keep your reticle plumb/level when shooting and you are good to go.

2. Optional: put a permanent bubble-level on your scope, calibrating the bubble with a hanging plumb-line. (This is the hardest part because when you tighten down the level screws that pulls the bubble off slightly, forcing you to start over.)

Then all you have to do keep your bubble centered when shooting.

To verify you got the crosshair pointing at the exact center of the bore do a "tall target test" at 100 yards. If the cranked up group is not exactly vertical above the control group, you didn't get the crosshair pointing at the exact center of the bore.

Using your action or scope turrets to level your reticle assumes you got the rifle set perfect to begin with and that the mfgrs made everything perfect. I don't trust them.

I don't trust my eye to be able to see when the reticle is pointing at the exact center of the bore, either, but I do trust the tall-target test, which is quick and easy to do. All the levels, gadgets and gizmos don't mean jack if, when you are done, you flunk the tall target test. I say just get right to it. Dead simple. Then you KNOW.
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