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  #106  
Old 05-25-2020, 07:56 PM
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I reload my own 3" buckshot loads with 5 pellets of 00 buckshot. I found that the 00 shot better out of my Mossberg 500 with 24" full choke than 000 buckshot did. I also use the 3" 00 buckshot loads in my Shockwave. They shoot good out of both. As far as powder charge, I load the 5 pellets of 00 buckshot the same as I would for 11/16oz of birdshot. 5 pellets of 00 buck is really close to the same eight as 11/16oz of shot (slightly under).
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  #107  
Old 05-26-2020, 01:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toomanyguns View Post
I used (4) 0.350 round balls (about the same as 000 buck) that did quite well.

Anxious to see your results with the .357's, especially since I have 3 mayo jars full of cast .358 bullets.

Note: 165 grains = .36 oz.; should give good velocity compared with normal 1/2 oz. load. The (4) .350 balls I used weighed 255 gr. or .56 oz. I did not chrono.
I've been making brass 410 shells from 303 British( annealed and fire formed) and load them like one assembles a black powder shot gun the brass case holds up well
and uses large pistol primers. thus primed with smokeless cover the powder with a 45 cardboard wad, place a 1/2 composition wad on top of that I then stick a rod into the case to figure out if I need more wadding. I take a plastic 410 wad with the petals
cut around the 158 grain solid cast .357 wadcutter pushed hard into the wad and then thru a seating die (I've tried different ones) that crimps the end of the case
over the .357 enough to hold it in place. They shoot well enough.
My next experiment will be to screw the plastic wad onto the bullet and keep up with this fascinating, keep me involved subject.

S SP
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  #108  
Old 05-26-2020, 04:45 AM
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I have a couple of boxed of .303 blanks I've been hanging onto for the same purpose I just need a 410 to go with them!

Ive had my eyes on a Cooey or silenced Mossberg 500


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  #109  
Old 05-26-2020, 02:46 PM
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Southern, Tell us how they worked. I have some UHU glue coming that is supposed to glue a wad to a slug. I am looking at cork as a possible wad material. It was used a long time ago. I picked up some 12"x12"x1/4" cork tiles at Walmart and I was looking at wine bottle corks. I think I need 1/2"- 3/4" to stabilize the bullet. A 10mm leather punch works pretty well to cut the wads. Also found that chucking a fired 9mm case with the primer drilled out into a drill press also works well for cutting wads. I think the 165 grain round nose bullets were too long and the wad came off. I was going to try a 158 semi wad cutter when I get the glue.
I am trying this stuff in cylinder bore.

Last edited by JTJ; 05-26-2020 at 07:38 PM.
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  #110  
Old 05-27-2020, 01:38 PM
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I drilled out the primer pocket on a 38 spl case and chucked it in the drill press. Removed the rim with a file and now I have a .357 wad cutter. I can cut 4- 1/4" cork wads before I have to push them out. 357 case would work just as well. Wine bottle corks could work but wine corks are not consistent. I have to find a synthetic cork to try but real cork is biodegradable. Would like to find a piece of heavy wool felt. Old fashioned ways are sometimes better.
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  #111  
Old 05-29-2020, 02:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JTJ View Post
Southern, Tell us how they worked. I have some UHU glue coming that is supposed to glue a wad to a slug. I am looking at cork as a possible wad material. It was used a long time ago. I picked up some 12"x12"x1/4" cork tiles at Walmart and I was looking at wine bottle corks. I think I need 1/2"- 3/4" to stabilize the bullet. A 10mm leather punch works pretty well to cut the wads. Also found that chucking a fired 9mm case with the primer drilled out into a drill press also works well for cutting wads. I think the 165 grain round nose bullets were too long and the wad came off. I was going to try a 158 semi wad cutter when I get the glue.
I am trying this stuff in cylinder bore.
I shoot a lot of BP revolvers, thus I have a good supply of .45 cardboard wads that I use over powder all the 410 Hulls that I use are recycled brass from 303 British annealed and fire-formed as well as 9.3x74R to make 3 inch 410s I have no plastic hulls. the hull comes out almost as a .45 case. so .45 wads work well. I build up the column with a combination of 1/8 paper cards and 1/2 fiber wads. the 410 plastic wad is too small in diameter for these hulls I do use them for building slugs
I have use .32 lead bullets but they keyhole. I am playing with .158 cast wadcutters they fill the 410 plastic wad well, I cut the petals off the top of the bullet, press the bullet all the way into the wad and load it. once i have the proper height i place the cartridge into a 44-40 seat die with the bullet punch removed and use a hand held rod to gently push the top of the .158 slightly below the rim of the case and make a crimp, the crimp looks similar to a .32 Nagant cartridge.

I am interested in your idea of gluing the bullet to the wad. Balistic Products have slug/ball wads. something like this
https://www.ballisticproducts.com/St...tinfo/0724105/ or any of these ( modified) https://www.ballisticproducts.com/-4...s/products/93/

Hope this helps

SS
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  #112  
Old 05-29-2020, 04:51 PM
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I am using clay buster wads but that stump wad looks interesting. If the opening is close to .36" the bullet could be glued inside or it could be cut and glued. It looks like it might only be .300". The clay buster acts like a sabot for the .357 bullet. the stump would be part of the bullet. I pinned and glued 1/2" long wads to a few 158 grain semi wad cutters. Crude but they are loaded and will be tried out when I can get to the range. I wish I could get hold of a few to try. My UHU glue has not gotten here yet. The MG410 wad looks like a possibility too.
https://www.ballisticproducts.com/MG...info/072MG410/

Last edited by JTJ; 05-29-2020 at 05:16 PM.
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  #113  
Old 05-30-2020, 01:09 AM
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410 slug experiments

I did some testing with the brass hulls and .358 wad cutter at 25 yards today
it groups OK but all the rounds key holed. that's not good.
so I'm gonna try to follow you. and glue/screw a wad with a fin of sorts. from a bit of research it looks like a .390 projectile would be about ideal, unfortunately I have no .390 die to reduce a lead .44 ball closest I have is .410 I passed a few through a improved cylinder chock it's tight but the lead should swage down through it.
I put together about 5 rounds. I'll give that a shot ( no pun intended) tomorrow.
Oh! super glue takes a while to glue. I put together a few with a 40 caliber bullet
I'll reload in the morning. Keep you posted.

S SP
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  #114  
Old 05-30-2020, 07:59 AM
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I personally would not go any bigger than .390 for your slug, especially if it is a hollow base. The reason I say this is because of what Hornady stated about their Triple Defense 410 shells. The Triple Defense has a .41 caliber slug over 2 pellets of 000 buckshot. Hornady does not recommend shooting those shells through a full choke.

Make sure that what ever type/size slug you use that it will easily pass through the choke on your barrel.

After trying both 00 and 000 buckshot with my reloads, I found that the 00 buck patterns better out of my 24" full choke Mossberg barrel compared to the 000 buck.
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  #115  
Old 05-30-2020, 10:01 AM
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Thanks for the info. The 41 slug I'm using is a swaged down 44 lead ball for muzzle loader and it's solid base, shot through an Improved Cylinder.

S/SP
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  #116  
Old 05-30-2020, 03:46 PM
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You are good then if you are using an improved cylinder choke. Just avoid a full choke. I just measured my 24" full choke Mossberg barrel and it measured right at .390"
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  #117  
Old 05-30-2020, 10:41 PM
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ballet in 410

I had a good day shooting the new loading in 410 with a lead ball-et swaged down from a 454 lead round ball. The ball-ets come out round top, smooth walled flat base.
The improved cylinder measures .394 and the ball-et comes to .409 a difference of .15 so there is a tiny amount of constriction nothing to really worry about.
the ball comes out at 130 grain adding the fiber-wads brings it up to 151.6 grains excluding 12.6 grains of powder.In the fire formed 33 British it looks like a .444 marlin case, and I have tried those as well, different 410's have different size chambers and extractors.The .444 rim is too small in the M6 and there fore will not extract. I have a H&R Topper they work well in it.
The new load shot accurately at 25 yards hitting a 6 inch target with no exaggerated flyers. this is a light load 1/2 oz of shot weights in at .218 grs.

Next comes a chrono test to determine how fast it's going.
If it did not rain I'd be still at it.
I had a good day shooting.

S SP
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  #118  
Old 05-31-2020, 06:36 AM
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Glad to hear that your slug loads are working.


To add info on why Hornady does don't recommend using the Triple Defense loads in a full choke is because the slug has a hollow base that the 00 buck fills on firing. The buck shot expands the base of the slug and would be too tight for the full choke.
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  #119  
Old 05-31-2020, 10:27 PM
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There are several slugs for shot guns some better than others. the best of the mfg is the Breneke 410 for penetration. From a casting, re-loader point of view the pellet shaped Lyman is a very accurate slug unfortunately they are not available in 410 at least not here in the US.I have found a Russian company that makes a mold same as the sabot Lyman in 410 and am considering getting one.
the waisted sabot in 12 ga is an awesome round I have shot them in both 12 ga Muzzle loader and conventional shotguns. accurate to 75 yards.
From my research on 410 slugs the best are hollow base weight forward to minimize yaw I even thought of making a cherry in that design, someone with a lathe could cut a cherry or it could be cut with hand files and turned in a block of aluminum.
it is interesting to note that shot is much heavier than a slug, the 410 can use 1/2
oz =218 grains
11/16= 300 grains
3/4=328 grains
Thus equivalent weight slugs would be a lot more efficient on game.and yet commercial slugs are puny 1/5 oz =88 grains, sure they go fast and lose velocity fast as well. granted the shot deforms slightly as it passes chock a lead slug should also deform should it not? more research.
S SP
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  #120  
Old 06-01-2020, 11:09 AM
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Brenneke .410 Magnum slug info.

Cartridge or Gauge .410 Bore
Model Number 37898
Shot Size Slug
Velocity (fps) 1755
Shell Length 3"
Quantity 5 Rounds
Ounces of Shot 1/4
-----------
109 gr. slug at 1,755 fps. Yes, they could load a heavier slug and I will write them and ask that they do so. I would think they could have a 275 - 300 gr. slug at about 1,000 - 1,200 fps.
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