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  #4876  
Old 08-23-2019, 01:22 AM
Bob4BVM
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Good shooting guys, and good to see I am not the only one throwing "eight 10s and two 5s", so to speak... I can tell you guys are close to what is the heart of the great sport of Offhand Shooting.

For the benefit of those who have joined us here recently, I will mention that that sort of shooting is caused by a known shooters' disease, LSBi. Documentation is as follows, from my post here last summer:

******************
For my part, I am really struggling of late with LSBi 'last-second-blink-itis', a common disease with no known permanent cure...
Several attempts this month have ended in desperately sub-par scores for me.
I will post something, but unless things change drastically in the next few days, it's NOT gonna be pretty

In an effort to help others who may have this condition, I will pass on what little is known about this shooter's malady, LSBi...

SYMPTOMS INCLUDE (but are not limited to):
---Shooting 7 or 8 tens in a row, followed by a seven.
---In severe cases you may get 8 or 9 tens followed by a six.
---In all cases the strays come as a surprise, sure proof that the follow-thru ended in a blink.
---You know you blinked because you could not call the shot.
---In most cases a bull will start off very well, until LSBi symptoms appear seemingly out of nowhere.
---The first stray shot is invariably followed by 2 or 3 more.
---Strangely, the better view you have of the target, the higher your chances of contracting this disease. ie, it is more likely to pop up when using a 32X scope than when shooting with iron sights. Doctors think this may be linked to actually seeing 8 or 9 holes in the ten ring on the target. There is good evidence that iron sight shooters who use a spotting scope to view their targets may be more susceptible than scoped shooters.
---It can be difficult to treat this disease but luckily it usually runs its course quickly, usually receding just at the time you leave the range.
---While the cause of LSBi is poorly understood by science, there is a growing body of evidence that it is somehow related to another shooters' disorder, NT-LSAS(Nine Tens-Last Shot Apprehension Syndrome).
---There is no scientific proof that these two disorders are related, and to make matters worse it appears that either one may spring up first, weakening the shooter's immunity to the other, which then invariably infects the shooter, make further scoring attempts futile.

TREATMENT:
---If a shooter becomes infected with either LSBi or NT-LSAS, it is best to leave the firing line for ten or fifteen minutes, kick back with a soft drink in a quiet place out of the reach of the sound of gunfire.
---In the unfortunate case where a shooter succumbs to BOTH conditions at once, the best thing to do is to quietly pack up your gear and head home, stopping on the way for a cold six pack of beer. For extreme cases a stronger-than-beer beverage is recommended.

! Remember, denial is your worst enemy if you contract this condition !

Failure to take one of these treatments by continuing the shooting session will result in more severe and irreversible side effects including ever-descending scores, hair loss (shooter pulling it out by the handful), and, last but not least, the total degradation of the mutual-trust relationship between the shooter and his gun, sights, & ammo.
This last side effect may be the worst of all, causing the shooter to go out and spend his family's life savings on $12,000 guns, $25-a-box ammo, and $3,000 scopes or $1500 aperture sights.

In some sad cases it has been observed that good Offhand Shooters, in despair over these conditions, have even descended to Benchrest Shooting, where the effects of these diseases are less severe, but still bad enough to destroy a perfect target even if shot from a fixed mechanical bench rest device. This is the worst of outcomes however as the shooter will now spend magnitudes more money than before in pursuit of ever-more-perfect targets (in BR, severe cases will fanaticize about something called "groups"), never suspecting that the disease(s) will prevent them from achieving their goal.
Sadly this usually culminates in an endless downward spiral as the Offhander-turned-BR shooter, now with an almost complete dependence on his equipment, experiences a total distrust of his gun and either sells it off or butchers it up in a futile attempt to correct his shooting problem, again never suspecting the root cause.

If you are with an Offhand Shooter who gets this condition, you may be able to help them by simply being there for them as a sounding board, unless of course their condition has progressed beyond the occasional spontaneous post-shot cussing stage. If you observe evidence of bloody scalp and patches of hair laying around, it is best to just leave the vicinity and encourage the patient to do the same. Sympathy will have no effect on the shooter who has an advanced case. By the same token, if you catch it while shooting alone, feeling sorry for yourself will likewise have no effect. As they say, "misery loves company", so it would be best to just pack up and leave. Try to at least keep a clear head so you don't forget to pick up a strong beverage on the way home.

Hope this helps, it did help me to talk about it as I am no longer in denial. (I think ! )
Sharing my problem as given me the courage to go out & try again tomorrow, wish me luck...


Bob4BVM
***************************

Last edited by Bob4BVM; 08-23-2019 at 01:32 AM.
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  #4877  
Old 08-23-2019, 11:23 AM
kingrider
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Practice; 50-Yd Scoped practice
DATE: 8-23-19
SCORE: 211 2x
NAME: kingrider
LOCATION: Ohio
GUN: Anschutz Mpr

AMMO: sk st+
INDIV TGTS SCORES44,44 1x,43 1x,44,36
Last target killed a good score for me. A five and a six on that one
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  #4878  
Old 08-23-2019, 11:27 AM
kingrider
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*** 25 Yd Scoped practice **** 8/23/19
SCORE: 475 14x
NAME: Kingrider 51
LOCATION: NE Ohio
GUN. Anschutz MPR
GUN SETUP: __Scope _x__Iron sights _
AMMO: cci sv
INDIV targets:96 5x,97 3x,96 3x,93 1x,93 2x
Still had two eights. My goal is zero eights, maybe slowing down will help me
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  #4879  
Old 08-23-2019, 12:11 PM
STRUGL4X'SC

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob4BVM View Post
Good shooting guys, and good to see I am not the only one throwing "eight 10s and two 5s", so to speak... I can tell you guys are close to what is the heart of the great sport of Offhand Shooting.

For the benefit of those who have joined us here recently, I will mention that that sort of shooting is caused by a known shooters' disease, LSBi. Documentation is as follows, from my post here last summer:

******************
For my part, I am really struggling of late with LSBi 'last-second-blink-itis', a common disease with no known permanent cure...
Several attempts this month have ended in desperately sub-par scores for me.
I will post something, but unless things change drastically in the next few days, it's NOT gonna be pretty

In an effort to help others who may have this condition, I will pass on what little is known about this shooter's malady, LSBi...

SYMPTOMS INCLUDE (but are not limited to):
---Shooting 7 or 8 tens in a row, followed by a seven.
---In severe cases you may get 8 or 9 tens followed by a six.
---In all cases the strays come as a surprise, sure proof that the follow-thru ended in a blink.
---You know you blinked because you could not call the shot.
---In most cases a bull will start off very well, until LSBi symptoms appear seemingly out of nowhere.
---The first stray shot is invariably followed by 2 or 3 more.
---Strangely, the better view you have of the target, the higher your chances of contracting this disease. ie, it is more likely to pop up when using a 32X scope than when shooting with iron sights. Doctors think this may be linked to actually seeing 8 or 9 holes in the ten ring on the target. There is good evidence that iron sight shooters who use a spotting scope to view their targets may be more susceptible than scoped shooters.
---It can be difficult to treat this disease but luckily it usually runs its course quickly, usually receding just at the time you leave the range.
---While the cause of LSBi is poorly understood by science, there is a growing body of evidence that it is somehow related to another shooters' disorder, NT-LSAS(Nine Tens-Last Shot Apprehension Syndrome).
---There is no scientific proof that these two disorders are related, and to make matters worse it appears that either one may spring up first, weakening the shooter's immunity to the other, which then invariably infects the shooter, make further scoring attempts futile.

TREATMENT:
---If a shooter becomes infected with either LSBi or NT-LSAS, it is best to leave the firing line for ten or fifteen minutes, kick back with a soft drink in a quiet place out of the reach of the sound of gunfire.
---In the unfortunate case where a shooter succumbs to BOTH conditions at once, the best thing to do is to quietly pack up your gear and head home, stopping on the way for a cold six pack of beer. For extreme cases a stronger-than-beer beverage is recommended.

! Remember, denial is your worst enemy if you contract this condition !

Failure to take one of these treatments by continuing the shooting session will result in more severe and irreversible side effects including ever-descending scores, hair loss (shooter pulling it out by the handful), and, last but not least, the total degradation of the mutual-trust relationship between the shooter and his gun, sights, & ammo.
This last side effect may be the worst of all, causing the shooter to go out and spend his family's life savings on $12,000 guns, $25-a-box ammo, and $3,000 scopes or $1500 aperture sights.

In some sad cases it has been observed that good Offhand Shooters, in despair over these conditions, have even descended to Benchrest Shooting, where the effects of these diseases are less severe, but still bad enough to destroy a perfect target even if shot from a fixed mechanical bench rest device. This is the worst of outcomes however as the shooter will now spend magnitudes more money than before in pursuit of ever-more-perfect targets (in BR, severe cases will fanaticize about something called "groups"), never suspecting that the disease(s) will prevent them from achieving their goal.
Sadly this usually culminates in an endless downward spiral as the Offhander-turned-BR shooter, now with an almost complete dependence on his equipment, experiences a total distrust of his gun and either sells it off or butchers it up in a futile attempt to correct his shooting problem, again never suspecting the root cause.

If you are with an Offhand Shooter who gets this condition, you may be able to help them by simply being there for them as a sounding board, unless of course their condition has progressed beyond the occasional spontaneous post-shot cussing stage. If you observe evidence of bloody scalp and patches of hair laying around, it is best to just leave the vicinity and encourage the patient to do the same. Sympathy will have no effect on the shooter who has an advanced case. By the same token, if you catch it while shooting alone, feeling sorry for yourself will likewise have no effect. As they say, "misery loves company", so it would be best to just pack up and leave. Try to at least keep a clear head so you don't forget to pick up a strong beverage on the way home.

Hope this helps, it did help me to talk about it as I am no longer in denial. (I think ! )
Sharing my problem as given me the courage to go out & try again tomorrow, wish me luck...


Bob4BVM
***************************
Thank you for the timely post, it made me laugh, so I may be okay after that six pack!

Sent from my SM-G930R4 using Tapatalk
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  #4880  
Old 08-23-2019, 01:34 PM
zukiphile is online now
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I took advantage of the cooler weather and played hookie this morning. Being able to wear a coat made a big difference in the shape of my groups even though my scores weren't great. Shooting in a T-shirt should be its own division. j/k
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  #4881  
Old 08-23-2019, 07:24 PM
Purple Bikerr

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Quote:
Originally Posted by STRUGL4X'SC View Post
then on the very last shot I give a mighty jerk and shot a 6!
I give the "mighty jerk" every bull. They may not all be 6's, but they are still jerks.

If you do it only once per set, you're doing great.
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  #4882  
Old 08-25-2019, 09:13 PM
72coupe
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August 25 yard Iron Sight PRACTICE 8/25/2019
Score: 472-16X
Name: 72coupe/Roy Woodman
Location: Wichita Falls, Tx
Gun: Ruger Precision Rifle
Set up: Good iron sights and a bloop tube
Ammo: Federal Automatch
Individual Target Scores: 95-2X, 92-3X, 99-5X, 92-2X, 94-4X six 8s
Notes: Good light, wind 10 mph, temp 91 all in all a good day for shooting. After 30 shots I began to have some chest pain so I only shot 2 more targets. I will be calling my cardiologist in the morning.

Last edited by 72coupe; 08-27-2019 at 07:45 PM.
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  #4883  
Old 08-25-2019, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by 72coupe View Post
August 25 yard Iron Sight Entry 8/25/2019
Score: 472-16X
Name: 72coupe/Roy Woodman
Location: Wichita Falls, Tx
Gun: Ruger Precision Rifle
Set up: Good iron sights and a bloop tube
Ammo: Federal Automatch
Individual Target Scores: 95-2X, 92-3X, 99-5X, 92-2X, 94-4X six 8s
Notes: Good light, wind 10 mph, temp 91 all in all a good day for shooting. After 30 shots I began to have some chest pain so I only shot 2 more targets. I will be calling my cardiologist in the morning.

if it is severe - don't wait until AM - do it now!!!
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  #4884  
Old 08-26-2019, 01:35 AM
dangerranger
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Last week I retired. So I have some time to shoot these matches again. I enjoyed them before, But work changed my hours. Now I can set my hours to what ever I want.
I did shoot 5 bulls to see where I'm at, 351 2X. It was 101 deg with no breeze at all. Somehow I don't remember the target moving that much before!
I have another week to try and get some dry fire practice in,and a set done for score. Thanks for having me! DR
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  #4885  
Old 08-26-2019, 08:53 AM
72coupe
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Originally Posted by Merle View Post
if it is severe - don't wait until AM - do it now!!!
Merle I have had 5 heart attacks and I am acutely aware of what is going on in my chest. Thanks for your concern but I hope to get it taken care of this morning. Maybe another stent.
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  #4886  
Old 08-26-2019, 11:42 AM
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Merle
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Originally Posted by 72coupe View Post
Merle I have had 5 heart attacks and I am acutely aware of what is going on in my chest. Thanks for your concern but I hope to get it taken care of this morning. Maybe another stent.

OK then - you are more aware than most.
I have lost several friends to heart attacks, and didn't want it to happen to you.
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  #4887  
Old 08-26-2019, 08:17 PM
72coupe
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I hope everyone knows the symptoms of a heart attack. They can be very subtle at first.
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  #4888  
Old 08-27-2019, 03:30 AM
Bob4BVM
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Originally Posted by 72coupe View Post
I hope everyone knows the symptoms of a heart attack. They can be very subtle at first.
We're all rooting for you Roy, hope this turns out well for you. We need you inspiring us at the top of the Irons match !
Prayers,
Bob
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  #4889  
Old 08-27-2019, 01:01 PM
Ide
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XXXX 50yd Iron Sight Entry XXXXX
171-1X
Dan Ide 72
Morrison Gun Club Morrison Il.
Mossberg 144 LSB
Aperture Front / Williams Peep Rear
Blazer
35-0x 42-0x 38-0x 33-1x 28-0x = 171-1X


XXXX50 yd Scope Entry XXXX
193-2X
Dan Ide
Morrison Gun Club
Savage B-22
BSA Scope at 8 power
CCI Std. Vel.
39-0x 35-0x 40-0x 36-1x 43-1x = 193-2X
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  #4890  
Old 08-27-2019, 07:57 PM
72coupe
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25 Yard Iron Sight Entry 8/27/2019
Score: 476-8X
Name: 72coupe/Roy Woodman/72 tomorrow
Location: Wichita Falls, Tx
Gun: Ruger Precision Rimfire with some good stuff on it.
Set up: Tracker rear sight with a Centra aperture, Sinclair tall boy front with a Centra aperture and a bloop tube
Ammo: Federal Automatch
Individual Target Scores: 94-1X, 97-2X, 93-3X, 96-1X, 96-1X three 8s
Notes: After I got out of the cardiologist office I took the rest of the day off and went to the range. It was beautiful, 73 to start, no wind, medium overcast with occasional rain. I shot 2 other targets but they were a 470-7X and 466-5X. I can't figure out why my X count is so low. Well other than I am not shooting very close to the center.
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