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  #16  
Old 12-06-2020, 06:30 PM
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Bought a wooden dowel rod from walmart that was just a little thinner than the chamber. Used some 2000 grit automotive wet dry sandpaper. I cut the sandpaper just a tad shorter than the chamber then glued one end of the sandpaper to the dowl. After it dried I wrapped the sand paper around the dowel til it was kind of tight going into the chamber as I rotated it into the chamber. Then once in the chamber the proper length I just used my hands and kept twisting the dowel in the same direction to keep the sandpaper wound up and polished the chamber. Try the plop test and re-due till a round easily went in and came out when barrel was turned upside down on it's own.

Nothing real scientific, but hay it works.
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  #17  
Old 12-06-2020, 07:46 PM
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I have three 41's, a 1971, a 1991 and a new one which has the exact same behavior as described by the OP. I've gone through at least 1,500 rounds attempting to solve via process of elimination. In fact, I just returned about an hour ago after going through 300 rounds and discovered this thread.

New out of the box it was a disaster. Knowing it would be at S&W for at least 12 weeks and that the odds of it being returned in good working order were slim, I opted to send it to Clark Guns and pay for it.

The slide stop was replaced (micro crack NIB) and the the pistol was "tuned" to shoot SV SK Standard Plus. It was much improved upon its return with reliability up to about 85-90% which I consider unacceptable because of the reliability of the 71 (96-98%) and 91 (close to 100% with HV or SV and with 7" barrel, about 95% with 5.5" after market barrel). I've tried SK, Eley, CCI, various recoil springs, both factory and Wolf, as well as most of the suggestions in this thread.

Finally, I discovered a thread on Bullseye forum discussing how the chambers on the new ones are so tight they need to be reamed. I took it to my most competent local gunsmith who is a wizard with 1911's but sees a limited number of 41's. Nevertheless, he was aware of the issue and performed the reaming. This got the reliability up to 93-95%, interestingly almost always 100% on the first 25-30 rounds.

Today, it occurred again after 27 rounds. The best way I can describe it is it's like trying to fire with the safety engaged. For the first time I tried the 5.5" barrel on the new one and it fired 50 rounds with one FTF, as well as the 5.5 ever performs. This is leading me to conclude that possibly the chamber needs another reaming. But I'm really just guessing, which is why I'm here looking for other ideas.

I completely agree with LD Bennett who stated "How can a $1200+ new match grade pistol have problems like this? ", and feel somewhat foolish for not just giving up, taking my losses and moving on. Unfortunately, the puzzle has become addictive and I really like 41's. I'm going to try to get it reamed again tomorrow and will report. Here is a link to the actual tool. https://www.brownells.com/aspx/searc...aspx?pid=25193

Thanks for chiming in on this thread. I am glad to know that it wasn’t just me. Hopefully we will get these pistols working like they are supposed to soon.

Definitely weird behavior.


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  #18  
Old 12-06-2020, 08:11 PM
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Not unusual, just the new norm with these pistols. They are good and you just have to realize if you buy new that you are going to have to work the tight chambers out on them.
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  #19  
Old 12-06-2020, 08:53 PM
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The bad news is that these pistols should be good out of the box. The good news is the chambers can be opened up. Owning a newer model 41 requires some love of the pistol and also some patience.
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  #20  
Old 12-07-2020, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by jhbpa View Post
Today, it occurred again after 27 rounds. The best way I can describe it is it's like trying to fire with the safety engaged. For the first time I tried the 5.5" barrel on the new one and it fired 50 rounds with one FTF, as well as the 5.5 ever performs. This is leading me to conclude that possibly the chamber needs another reaming. But I'm really just guessing, which is why I'm here looking for other ideas.
Check the hairpin like trigger bar spring on the right side, under the trigger bar. Brownells Link
I had the same symptom you describe years ago- FTF like the safety is on, rack slide, then it works (for a while). This spring has a tendency to break right in the middle of the eye, but stay in place, and you can't see it is really in two pieces unil you fish it out of its recess (but still works- sorta). I bought several after this happened to me.
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  #21  
Old 12-07-2020, 09:56 PM
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Will do, thanks.

Also have update. Gunsmith did some more chamber reaming and polishing, fired 125 rounds, four FTF, with two I was able to bump slide forward with hand and fire, other two required removal from chamber, they appeared to have been struck with pin but just barely compared to empty cases. Taking the evidence back to gunsmith tomorrow.
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  #22  
Old 12-08-2020, 04:26 AM
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It's a pain but you will get there.
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  #23  
Old 12-10-2020, 03:45 PM
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Called the gunsmith today. He didn’t find anything physically wrong.

He was able to duplicate my issue with CCI standard and another std velocity. (I left him a box with the gun). He agreed it had issues regularly with Std.

He tested with two different HV rounds and said it functioned with no issue and recommended breaking it in with HV.

Is break in with HV a thing? If other people have done it this way, About how many rounds before it was “broke in”?


I am picking it up Saturday.....


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  #24  
Old 12-10-2020, 04:26 PM
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Break in might be a thing now. I would use a buffer if I was to shoot HV.

Here’s something, I built up several 1911 frames to setup Marvel 22 top ends and a few were balky at first- Amsoil synthetic gun oil got them running great. Reliability is important for timed/ rapid bullseye matches.

The Amsoil was the thinnest oil I’ve ever used and it does evaporate quicker then other gun oils but seemed to slick up the slide/frame. unfortunately it’s discontinued but I saw what seemed to be a substitute on line.
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  #25  
Old 12-14-2020, 07:49 PM
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Model 41 not cycling consistently. Advice?

So I picked up my 41 from the gunsmith this weekend. I went to the range and misbehaved the same as it has been since new. (Sure does shoot straight when it does fire.. I love that part)



I did try one thing new this weekend and it seemed to make an improvement.. not solved by any means.. but a small improvement.



When squeezing the trigger, I ensured a good follow though. (held the trigger back for a 1 thousand one count before releasing. I did notice a bit less of the bad behavior. I am still convinced this problem is related to the trigger reset.



I also took it apart and was carefully watching how things work when inserting the magazine. I noticed I could see the side of the hammer easily with the grips off.



What is the purpose of the middle notch in the hammer? If I pull the hammer back about halfway, it clicks and acts like a 1911 half cocked hammer. The hammer stands about vertical.

What is this even for?



I started to wonder if it is possible that when my pistol make the "chunk" sound that maybe the hammer is falling/stopping on this notch?? The tension required to pull the slide back when this happens is practically the same as when the hammer is being cocked. So, I am thinking it might be related. Not sure but thought I would throw this out there for comment and to see if anyone could think something that could cause this.



Thanks for the input as always.

Last edited by smithpa68; 12-14-2020 at 10:07 PM.
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  #26  
Old 12-15-2020, 11:35 AM
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Another possibility is that the magazine lips are not delivering the round to the center of the chamber. When that happens, the soft lead bullet hits the edge of the chamber, deforms slightly, and the match type chamber will not allow the damaged cartridge to full seat. It does not take much of a burr on the bullet to not fully seat in the chamber.

If it is the trigger reset that seems to be the problem adjust it correctly. That would be to minimize the over travel right to the point where the trigger will just not allow the hammer to fall when you pull the trigger. Then back off that over travel adjustment 1/4 to 1/2 turn.

As for "break-in", my Texas Hi Std Trophy came with directions to fire about 300 to 500 rounds of Hi Vel ammo. Then start shooting Std Vel ammo. It worked fine for that gun.

As to why use Std Vel ammo in the end:

These blow back guns balance the recoil energy of the fired cartridge to cycle the slide. But it is designed as a balance situation. It is that energy against the moving of the slide mass, the resistance of the recoil spring, the energy to cock the hammer, and overcoming the friction of the moving parts. If all is right and balanced then the slide will travel just far enough to gently kiss the slide recoil stop. If you add more energy to the cartridge, that excess energy has to be absorbed by the pistol recoil stop on the frame. It hammers on the frame, perhaps damaging the frame eventually (buffers minimize that but do they absorb all the excess energy? If you add a more powerful spring it hammers on the barrel breach face with the faster closing of the slide. That can also upset the timing of the gun. You should use the least powerful ammo that reliably just locks back the slide on the last shot out of the magazine.

Just some thoughts.

S&W should be ashamed of these guns. They use to know how to make them but apparently not any more.

LDBennett
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  #27  
Old 12-15-2020, 05:46 PM
Doug
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LDBennett View Post
..........................
S&W should be ashamed of these guns. They use to know how to make them but apparently not any more.

LDBennett
Ditto.
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  #28  
Old 12-16-2020, 07:30 AM
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See above^^.
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  #29  
Old 12-16-2020, 01:10 PM
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I agree 100% with LD back in the day when quality meant something the 41 was an excellent pistol! But new ones now should never be offered in the shape the come in! Apparently S&w does not care about quality or pride !
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  #30  
Old 12-16-2020, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Turtle1903 View Post
I agree 100% with LD back in the day when quality meant something the 41 was an excellent pistol! But new ones now should never be offered in the shape the come in! Apparently S&w does not care about quality or pride !
In the months leading up to High Standard's failure in 1984, production quality suffered to the point that much of their production could no longer be realistically sold at retail. To the company's credit, the company stamped these inferior products with a "V" serial number suffix, thus indicating their inferior quality, and that they were being sold without warranty.

In that spirit, perhaps it's time for S&W to publicly proclaim that the 41 is no longer the product that it once was, and to identify their inferiority by stamping a "V" suffix on the serial number.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg HS 'V' Serial #.jpg (72.8 KB, 73 views)

Last edited by coltlog; 12-16-2020 at 02:47 PM.
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