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  #46  
Old 06-12-2004, 11:05 AM
CAMPYBOB

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the fit and stiffness determine the level of function. if you have dropped 40 pounds, my guess is that you deserve a new coat that fits you better.

i prefer te double-thick canvas coats over the leather ones. the canvas, if carefully stored when not worn, they seem to retain more of that stiff, 'new coat' feeling.

straps v. buttons? if the coat fits well, i see no advantage to either system. i suppose the nra strap style allows for a bit faster adjustment and is a bit quicker to get in and out of.

i know fellows that swear by their creedmore coats...so maybe it's just a question of fit. perhaps you could borrow a friend's smaller size coat to try a few rounds with?
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  #47  
Old 06-16-2004, 01:57 AM
tony stark

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Campybob
You're right I deserve a new coat!
How do you recommend what is the best way to store the coat when it's not being used? Also on some coats there are some straps that go back over the back of the coat. What do they do?
The one I am looking at is the Gehmann, canvas and suede. They say that it can be tightened up almost 1 and a 1/2 sizes smaller than you buy with the buttons. I know that for international rules there are some limits as to how tight you can waer your coat, but at this point I'am not concerned with it.
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  #48  
Old 06-16-2004, 08:50 AM
Robbo

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Tony,

If the straps you are talking about go over the shoulder (of the shoulder that the rifle butt is on) they are for taking up any looseness in the jacket, so that you can get a repeatable stock weld.

I store my coat on a hanger when not shooting. During transport, I simply fold it and stick it in a duffle with the rest of my stuff. I shoot in a basic nylon canvas international style jacket.

Regards,
Robbo
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  #49  
Old 06-16-2004, 06:37 PM
CAMPYBOB

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the straps that go over the shooting shoulder draw excess material snug to stablize the area where your buttpad locates.

there is only one way to buy a coat, imo...and that is to go to a store that stocks several brands/styles in multiple sizes and start trying them on and getting into position while wearing them.

this is why i consider myself fortunate to live 'only' 2-1/2 hours from champion shooters supply! heheh! carl joos is great about letting you try on a dozen coats and he'll even lend you a rifle! carl has even lent me a sweatshirt when i left mine at home. while i've been shopping there, i have met folks that traveled 300-400 miles to spend some time shopping at the store rather than to mail order.

i would assume there are other stores that treat folks similary well. champion's choice comes to mind.

i realize that not everyone can purchase a well fitted jacket this way. that is why i suggested that you borrow from your fellow competitors to see what may work best for you.

while you can bet that the euro-coats will be well tailored to the sport, i still think a good fit and plain old stiffness mean more than the name sewn on the tag.
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  #50  
Old 06-26-2004, 01:05 AM
tony stark

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Robbo
The coat has arrived!
The straps going over the shoulder really make a differance in how the coat feels.
I will finally be able to get out Sunday morning and see how it works. Laying on the dinning room floor can tell something but not all.
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  #51  
Old 06-26-2004, 01:20 AM
tony stark

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Campybob
One of the honors about living out in the country is that if your looking for ANYTHING special no one is going to have it.
I don't mean to cripe but I am getting tired of no, don't have it, never heard of it, don't know where you can get it. Sorry about the rant.
As far as local competitors go there's me and Scott. If anybody else is shooting position smallbore around here, I don't know who they are. But that's okay they will come around. This is the most irritating, frustrating and generally the most FUN I've had in a long time.
Your right if the equipment works, it does make any differace who makes it. Seems like the stuff you fabricate yourself, work the best!
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  #52  
Old 06-28-2004, 01:06 PM
Robbo

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Hi Tony,

What type/style of coat did you end up getting? Did it work out for you?
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  #53  
Old 06-29-2004, 01:36 AM
tony stark

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Hi! Robbo
The coat is a Gehmann I.S.S.F. suede and canvas type. The buttons are adjustable by unscrewing them, pulling the button out of the coat then pushing the pointed, threaded shaft of the button back through the coat and screwing the button back on the shaft. Simple, easy and cheap!
As far as how it is going to work has yet to be determined. It's like getting a new rifle, sling, handstop, glove ect. ect. I know it gives me a lot of support that my old coat didn't. Since I have lost the 40+ pounds not even my street clothes fit me!
Did you get a chance to look over the EEA CM2 rifle yet?
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  #54  
Old 06-29-2004, 08:57 AM
Robbo

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Hi Tony,

Good news on the coat. I hope it works out well for you. I know what you mean about all the new gear. I'm finally getting back to working on my shooting after getting the new rifle/handstop/sling/coat working together. This is where that "dope book" comes in handy!

Sorry, I didn't get chance to look at the rifle on Friday. The store was unusualy busy and the owner was having a bad day. So discretion being the better part of valor..... I should be going again this Friday, hopefully it won't be so busy.

Regards,
Robbo
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  #55  
Old 07-12-2004, 06:48 AM
Proneshooter

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Highpower to smallbore is a drop of 2 classes at the beginning. At least that is how it seems to always end up at our Club when a master in HP starts shooting smallbore prone. They score in the Sharp Shooter range for a few matches until they learn to follow through on their shots.
I had a master junior HP shooter come to shoot air rifle at the Citadel and it was frustrating for him at first. It took a bunch of practice for him to learn to follow through on his hold. Worked out well for him as he was the top shooter in our conference for 4 years.
Smallbore can be a problem with finding the best ammo for your gun. I do feel that most of the blame that the ammo gets is from bad shots. I do some RBA and see guys losing shots to mirage and they say the ammo shot it out.
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  #56  
Old 07-12-2004, 06:51 AM
Proneshooter

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Walt Walter used to do a dope book for smallbore.
[email protected]
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  #57  
Old 07-16-2004, 02:34 AM
tony stark

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Robbo
I picked up the info on the cm2 off the other thread. i ordered it and still waiting. is 4 position smallbore all fired on the same target?
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  #58  
Old 07-19-2004, 10:28 AM
Robbo

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Tony,

Yup, all stages of a 4 position match use the same targert. That being said....the NRA rule book lists 13 different "official" targets! Most are based on different distances, or to make things even more confusing "reduced" targets to simulate shooting at greater range.

The short answer is for 50 foot 4 position NRA smallbore rifle rules, use the A-17 11 bull target. The center bull is for sighting in purposes and the course of fire is 1 shot in each of the record bulls (10 shots) per position for a total of 40 (plus sighters) rounds per match.

If you are working with beginers, you might want to limit them to 5 record shots per position, or only shoot 1 or 2 positions per session until they get used to the positions. If I remember correctly (it was a long time ago!) when I leared it was prone for 2 or 3 sessions, then learned sitting first and shot prone afterwards (again 2 or 3 sessions), then learned kneeling first and shot prone and sitting (2 or 3 sessions) afterwards, then learned offhand first and shot prone, sitting, kneeling afterwards. From then on it was prone-sitting-kneeling-offhand everyweek. Sometimes if having difficulty with a position you'd shoot more than one taget (11 bulls) until you got the groove.

I've included links to the NRA rules books, coaching and Eddie Eagle programs for you. Is it just me, or does everyone find the NRA site painful to use?

http://www.nrahq.org/education/train..._pos_Rifle.asp
http://www.nrahq.org/safety/eddie/
http://materials.nrahq.org/go/produc...?cat=Rulebooks
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  #59  
Old 07-20-2004, 01:39 AM
tony stark

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Robbo
I took the CM2 to the range Sunday (07/18/04). I wiped the barrel out with Breakfree and patched the bore dry. After spending about 8 shots getting it sighted in, I shot a 98 with the rifle off of sandbags. With the 7 to 10 MPH variable wind we have been having almost all year. This thing really shoots!
The rear sight is a new departure into CRUDE. But it does work and it does seems to track true. The crown on the muzzel is about 1/2" to 5/8" deep, cut at about a 60 degree angle. I am impressed! I ordered 15 rifles for my program this afternoon.
Thanks for the target info. I guess my next step is offhand. I applied what I have learned with the smallbore rifle to my high power shooting. In a prone match we had a littie while back we shot two strings. I scored out at 197 out of 200, back to back
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  #60  
Old 07-20-2004, 07:43 AM
Robbo

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Hi Tony,

Glad to hear that the CM-2 worked out for you. What distance and what target were you shooting at? 16 rifles? That must be a good sized program you have going.

Congrats on the 197-its amazing how shooting smallbore improves your highpower, isn't it? Have fun learning offhand-it can be fustrating, but when it's going good its great!

Robbo
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