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  #1  
Old 02-10-2013, 06:34 PM
boomer1821

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Online match based on CMP rimfire sporter rules?



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Anyone interested in participating in monthly online matches based on the CMP rimfire sporter rules? I'm new to 3-position shooting, and am not really interested in spending big bucks on a match-grade target rifle and equally expensive ammunition and other equipment. On the other hand, I feel like a little friendly competition will push me to improve, and would be fun, as long as it is on a fairly level playing field. Since that is effectively the basis of the CMP rimfire sporter classification, I think it could be a great starting point. At this point I'm looking to see if there are any other interested folks on here.

Of course, this would be completely on the honor system, so I propose that we use the CMP RFS rules as written, with a strong emphasis on the spirit, rather than the letter of those rules. In particular, the weight and trigger pull limits should be "close", like maybe within 10%? I know from my own experience with the 10/22 that one can make such a weight limit fairly easily. Personally, I'm not that hung up on the trigger pull as a competitive issue, but I'm open to ideas.

Please reply here if you are interested.

Rick
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  #2  
Old 02-11-2013, 07:58 AM
realtly19934
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I'm in as soon as the weather breaks on the East Coast. Nothing but offhand at the indoor range where I practice when the temps below 40*. 30 shot or 60 shot?

Mike
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:32 PM
boomer1821

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I'd be inclined to propose both, and see which is more popular. I don't have any preference, although the 30 shot would likely take less time, and so perhaps be more popular due to the convenience. What are your thoughts on this?

Also, what do you think in terms of classifications? To me the CMP rules are fine, but I am strongly in favor of having a separate sub-category for irons vs. scope in the T-class and the tactical class. Thoughts?
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:33 PM
DavePat

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Since it's winter I would vote for shooting at 25yds or 50ft on reduced targets which would allow for indoor pistol range shooting. I would also stick with the standard 60 shot format. Since the group will also be small I would just have 2 classes. A "run what ya brung" class combining "T", "Tactical" and "Aperture" classes and a seperate open site class.
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  #5  
Old 02-12-2013, 10:20 AM
realtly19934
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Not having a "tactical" rifle, I have no input on this but being a shooter with aperture sights I would like a separate class for aperture sights. I would hope there would be more in that class than me. I don't see advantage for scopes in the offhand pasition, but definitely see one in prone or sitting/kneeling. 30 shots will probably garner more entries due to the decreased amount of ammo required although 60 may be better from the standpoint of reducing the effect of a solitary (or two) flier(s).

Mike
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Old 02-13-2013, 12:35 PM
davh
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Sounds like fun...as for rules how about 30rds. After sighters, just fire the slow fire sections of the CMP RS match except cut the time from 10 min. to 5.

The match is for fun so I wouldn't be concerned about classes. Post your results and what you used. Good scores will be acknowledged out of respect and encouragement.

Use sporter class equipment within reason of CMP RS rules.

Just my thoughts.
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Old 02-13-2013, 10:59 PM
boomer1821

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All good thoughts, I'm happy there is some interest. I feel like the half course of fire (30 shots) would be more approachable at least to start. I also feel like it would be interesting to do all the stages with 5 shots rather than just slow or just rapid. Thoughts on that?

I also think maybe it would be helpful to allow shooting reduced targets so we could do all stages at 25 yards if we want. Anyone have a standard CMP RS target that they could measure and give the dimensions so I could make a PDF of a reduced target?

As far as classes and things go, I kind of agree that at least to start, maybe we just report some stats on what we are shooting (weight, trigger pull, sights) and for those who care, they can look for people shooting similar to compare scores.

Is anyone ready to give it a try and start shooting? I have an Appleseed this weekend, but I'm off Monday. I don't have the official targets, but if someone could post the target dimensions, I could do some targets, print 'em and shoot 'em. I'd be happy to email the files out if anyone wants them. Otherwise I'll have to order and wait til next weekend.
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Old 02-13-2013, 11:08 PM
boomer1821

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Quote:
Originally Posted by realtly19934 View Post
Not having a "tactical" rifle, I have no input on this but being a shooter with aperture sights I would like a separate class for aperture sights. I would hope there would be more in that class than me. I don't see advantage for scopes in the offhand pasition, but definitely see one in prone or sitting/kneeling. 30 shots will probably garner more entries due to the decreased amount of ammo required although 60 may be better from the standpoint of reducing the effect of a solitary (or two) flier(s).

Mike
I actually agree with you. I feel like the scope gives a significant advantage over irons, even at 25 yd, especially for sitting and prone. To me, scope allows much more precision to consistently acquire the same aiming point compared to irons. I think that especially true in the Appleseed where the smallest targets are SO small, even at 25 yd, that it's pretty difficult to discern differences in the aim point with irons.
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:48 AM
myopiclefty

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I'll play! Was already planning to compete outdoors at a local club when the weather improves up here but if we can agree to a short range indoor course option until then, all the better.
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  #10  
Old 02-14-2013, 09:29 AM
davh
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I plan to shoot this weekend, now do we submit 6 targets of 5 shots or 3 targets of 10...make the call boomer and we will follow.
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  #11  
Old 02-14-2013, 01:40 PM
DavePat

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[QUOTE=boomer1821;4421410]All good thoughts, I'm happy there is some interest. I feel like the half course of fire (30 shots) would be more approachable at least to start. I also feel like it would be interesting to do all the stages with 5 shots rather than just slow or just rapid. Thoughts on that?

I would like to use the standard CMP RFS COF with 10 shots per each stage for a total of 60 shots. Doesn't take that much time when you remove all the waiting periods and are shooting on a 25 yd pistol range with computer target retrieval. This is what I use in practice sessions 3-4 times a week.

I also think maybe it would be helpful to allow shooting reduced targets so we could do all stages at 25 yards if we want. Anyone have a standard CMP RS target that they could measure and give the dimensions so I could make a PDF of a reduced target?

The 10 ring on the CMP B-19 target is 45.5mm in diameter so it should be half that for a 25 yd reduced size target for prone and sitting.

/QUOTE]
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  #12  
Old 02-14-2013, 10:29 PM
boomer1821

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Given that we are just starting out, I propose that we keep things flexible and low-key, and see how much interest we see. As long as we report consistent information, we can compare ourselves to others, if we choose. On the other hand, maybe it will simply interesting to be shooting "with" others.

For myself, I have never shot the CMP course of fire. So I am going to shoot the full COF but with 5 shots each, just to get the hang of it. Since I've shot the Appleseed AQT, I am confident I can meet the timing and changes of position. However, if anyone has trouble, I think they shout give it a go anyway, and simply note if they aren't able to make the timing or don't have the dexterity to do the position changes "on the clock".
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Old 02-14-2013, 10:39 PM
boomer1821

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FYI, I was able to find a source of the full dimensions for the CMP B-19 target [thanks for that clue, DavePat!] They are:

CMP SPORTER RIFLE TARGET DIMENSIONS
CMP B-19 (White X & 10 rings)
X RING - 7/8"
10 RING - 1-3/4"
9 RING - 3-5/16"
8 RING - 5-3/16"
7 RING - 7-3/16"
6 RING - 8-15/16"
5 RING - 10-3/4"
4 RING - 12-5/16"
3 RING - 14-3/8"
2 RING - 16-3/16"
1 RING - 18"

My feeling is, shoot whatever distance you have available to you, indoors or out, just use the proper targets for the distance you shoot. The official ones are available at the CMP online store, and probably other places. Or you can make yourself a target in MS PowerPoint or something like that, and then shrink them down proportionately for shorter distances. I'll make some up shortly; if anyone wants me to email the PDF, just let me know.

As far as the choice of full or half COF, I submit that either is acceptable, but if you shoot the half COF, shoot each stage (6 targets) with 5 shots instead of 10 per target. For those interested in "competing" we'll just double the score for those who shoot the half COF to compare with those who shoot the full COF. Not a perfect system, but I think it's better to shoot than not!

We'll see how it goes by the end of Feb, and refine from there.

Does that sound OK?

Last edited by boomer1821; 02-14-2013 at 10:58 PM.
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  #14  
Old 02-14-2013, 10:55 PM
boomer1821

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Actually, I just found the B-19 target online here

Can't completely vouch for the accuracy, but it appears close. Of course you'll need to scale down when you print if you want to shoot at 50 ft, or at 25 yd when the stage calls for 50 ft.

Speaking of which, in case someone doesn't know, the CMP Guide to Rimfire Sporter can be found online here

Last edited by boomer1821; 02-14-2013 at 11:03 PM.
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  #15  
Old 02-15-2013, 07:43 AM
boomer1821

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One additional caveat: if you are shooting the half COF, you should cut the allowed time in half too.
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