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  #16  
Old 06-29-2019, 12:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrblShtr View Post
I don't shoot for groups with my H001T, H001TLB or Winny Model 94 except to sight them in for a different type or batch of ammo. I have noticed that accuracy suffers on all three if I try to rest the fore end directly on anything. As Pete pointed out, a two piece stock is prone to allowing the barrel to deflect, which helps to explain the popularity of free-floating fore ends attached to the receiver of precision AR platform rifles.

If I do need to rest a lever action rifle on something (to take as much of me out of the equation as possible) I'll do so on the forward end of the receiver just in front of the lever. This can be a little tricky to get use to and it's unlikely you'll shoot bug holes with this technique, but it should get you to reasonable and repeatable results. Also, when shooting offhand I rest the front of the receiver on my forward hand and brace that elbow in tight to my body to 1) avoid the barrel deflection from holding the wooden fore end, and 2) mitigate some of the "wobble" caused by caffeine and other issues with my technique.

Edit to add that I rarely shoot anything but CCI Blazer 40 grain through my Henry rifles and on most days can hit a two inch spinner on the 50 yard berm at a 90%+ rate with my elbows rested on a bench, using the hold I described above. I use a Marbles tang sight in the rear and a Lyman globe up front.
+1 for the Marbles and Lyman sights. I get about the same results with that configuration. I have also built up a removable pad on the stock to have a good cheek weld for testing.
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  #17  
Old 06-29-2019, 06:11 AM
azimuth

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flangster
While certainly possible, I doubt that your Henry has anything wrong with it that would cause groups like you described. I have recently sighted in several lever 22's without scopes and have had nice groups from each of them. Try using a target with a large black center that is 6-8" in diameter set at 50 yards. With your rifle rested front and back, use a 6 o'clock hold on the bull. Be certain to keep the top of your sights aligned on the white space directly below and center of the bull. Don't worry about point of impact and just shoot for groups. I think you'll be surprised at what you can do with the irons. Once you verify that your rifle is grouping as it should, adjust your sights as necessary. If your H001T has the buckhorn sights, they can be a little tricky getting used to. I usually nestle the bead as low in the rear sight as I can while still being able to see the entire bead. Just place that at the bottom, center of the bull and shoot a group or two. Keep in mind that no matter how you align your sights, consistency is key.
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  #18  
Old 06-29-2019, 06:16 AM
flangster

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Originally Posted by azimuth View Post
flangster
While certainly possible, I doubt that your Henry has anything wrong with it that would cause groups like you described. I have recently sighted in several lever 22's without scopes and have had nice groups from each of them. Try using a target with a large black center that is 6-8" in diameter set at 50 yards. With your rifle rested front and back, use a 6 o'clock hold on the bull. Be certain to keep the top of your sights aligned on the white space directly below and center of the bull. Don't worry about point of impact and just shoot for groups. I think you'll be surprised at what you can do with the irons. Once you verify that your rifle is grouping as it should, adjust your sights as necessary. If your H001T has the buckhorn sights, they can be a little tricky getting used to. I usually nestle the bead as low in the rear sight as I can while still being able to see the entire bead. Just place that at the bottom, center of the bull and shoot a group or two. Keep in mind that no matter how you align your sights, consistency is key.
Great advice! The DiP rail I put on there has a channel that allows the sights to be seen "through" the center of the rail. It will be simple enough to remove the scope and shoot at an A-23/5 target at 50. I wanted to take the Henry out yesterday, but work and other obligations got in the way. Pesky. Today we have rain and our club is closed Sundays . . . looks like next week for troubleshooting.
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  #19  
Old 06-30-2019, 05:57 AM
kidneyboy

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Some suggestions -
Run a few hundred rounds through it before testing for accuracy (This used to be SOP for 22s).

Then try different types of ammo.

If you don't like your results after that call Henry.
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  #20  
Old 06-30-2019, 09:48 AM
Big Pete10
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My Frontier isn't the most accurate rifle I own but it will stay under 2" at 50 yards. I put a scope on it to test it, then went back to open sights. It's my coke can rifle any way. Clay birds and the chips at 25 yards, had my eyes fixed, gonna try clay birds at 50 next now that I can actually focus on the front sight. Also have a 10/22 with a Williams peep gonna try at 50.
I did run 1000 rounds of cheap Fed. Champions thru it before any good ammo. To really use it with a scope would require some kind of cheek rest, stock is way to low for a scope.

Last edited by Big Pete10; 07-03-2019 at 11:12 AM.
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  #21  
Old 07-01-2019, 09:26 AM
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I had the same issue at first with my Henry 22 WMR carbine. After replacing the stock sights with a set from a Marlin 336 (similar to the sights on the frontier), I proceeded to put about 150-200 rounds through the gun to break it in. Then I began to sight it in. So, that's what I'd suggest you do: grab a brick of el cheapo ammo and go plink for a couple hours. The bore will start to "wear in" and you'll find that, after a good cleaning and a few fouling shots, the groups will improve greatly.

When I bought my carbine, it patterned like a load of buckshot from a 10 gauge. But after breaking it in, if I do my part, I can get it to group about 1.5 inches at 50 yards. And since it's my truck/farm/do-all varmint gun I figure that's plenty good enough for knocking off groundhogs out to 100 yards, or the occasional marauding possum in the chicken coop.

You might try that, along with the other's advice, and find that your accuracy (and satisfaction!) will greatly improve.

Mac
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  #22  
Old 07-02-2019, 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by dutchmac View Post
I had the same issue at first with my Henry 22 WMR carbine. After replacing the stock sights with a set from a Marlin 336 (similar to the sights on the frontier), I proceeded to put about 150-200 rounds through the gun to break it in. Then I began to sight it in. So, that's what I'd suggest you do: grab a brick of el cheapo ammo and go plink for a couple hours. The bore will start to "wear in" and you'll find that, after a good cleaning and a few fouling shots, the groups will improve greatly.

When I bought my carbine, it patterned like a load of buckshot from a 10 gauge. But after breaking it in, if I do my part, I can get it to group about 1.5 inches at 50 yards. And since it's my truck/farm/do-all varmint gun I figure that's plenty good enough for knocking off groundhogs out to 100 yards, or the occasional marauding possum in the chicken coop.

You might try that, along with the other's advice, and find that your accuracy (and satisfaction!) will greatly improve.

Mac
That's very helpful Mac. Wanted to get to the range today, but a bum heel kept me in. Saw a doc and hope to be out at the range next week. Thanks for the advice.
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  #23  
Old 07-03-2019, 10:36 AM
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Flangster-

2 MOA is also for CZ 452. I was shocked when I so informed by CZ.
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  #24  
Old 07-03-2019, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Fotheringill View Post
Flangster-

2 MOA is also for CZ 452. I was shocked when I so informed by CZ.
LOL. Yeah, I can't see being satisfied with a 452 that shot that way. Maybe CZ chose that as a "defect" standard because it clearly points to something being wrong with the set-up (bad crown, for instance). In the case of the Henry, I was so surprised at a 3- or 4-inch "cone of fire" off a rest at 50 yards with a model for which folks have so much affection that it occurred to me to ask here whether I was "doing it wrong."

In an ideal world, I would have been to the range two or three times since my original post, but weather and an annoying injury have kept me from testing out some of the excellent advice offered above. I can't see Henry making its reputation on rifles that shoot 3 inch groups at 50 yards, so I will get there eventually . . . either by trying a different technique, or through Henry's customer service, or Davidson's through which I purchased the rifle. They do say "it is about the journey," but I can't think of a journey I wouldn't rather start with a 1 MOA rifle. . .
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  #25  
Old 07-03-2019, 01:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flangster View Post
That's very helpful Mac. Wanted to get to the range today, but a bum heel kept me in. Saw a doc and hope to be out at the range next week. Thanks for the advice.
Any time, sir. Glad you found it useful.

Mac
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  #26  
Old 07-15-2019, 12:58 PM
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Flangster, any updates?

Most of my own accuracy shooting has been with rifles that have separate forestocks attached to the barrels. Some are lever action like the Henry and others are single shot classics. I'd read and learned myself that where on the forestock the rifle is supported certainly does play a part in the accuracy. And for the most part I find that when going for the ultimate accuracy it's better to support the forestock fairly far back towards the receiver. But as always YMMV.... My feeling is that by being closer to the receiver I reduce the effect of any hold pressure changes.

I've not shot my Henry off any bag rest. But I have shot my big single shot off such a rest when doing ammo testing. To ensure that the pressure is back at the same spot as I normally hold I rolled a small towel up and laid it across the groove of my rather plump Caldwell bag rest so the forestock was supported at roughly where I'd be hand holding it.

Another option would be to use the bag rest as a wrist support so you are actually holding the forestock as you would be when field shooting or free standing with it. The rest aiding with steadying your hand.

There's also no doubt at all that different ammo makes all the difference. I've got a CIL branded Anschutz rifle from back when Anschutz made rifles for other distribution companies. Odd thing is that after testing it with some fancy match practice ammo and a couple of SV ammos I found it shot the best with plain ol' Blazer..... so try a lot of variations.

I've never shot my own H001 with the match ammo and off the bag. But it always makes me look like a better shot than I think I am. And when shooting off my elbows from prone I've managed to shoot it as well as I can shoot my club's Savage peep action Mark I rifles. Five targets for two shots each from prone in the 20 yd basement range. 4 out of 5 will have the holes within 1/4" of each other and it's not rare to be touching. Almost ever target though has one pair and sometimes two pairs where I pull one or the other and the spacing is more like 1/2 to 3/4".... Maybe not stellar performance compared to match shooters with the same rifles. But that's the old guy eyes and nerves and tolerating the discomfort of being bent backwards. The point though is that I can match that performance with the plain sighted Henry.

I've never tried mine with a scope.
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  #27  
Old 07-15-2019, 05:41 PM
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My Henry Frontier Long Barrel Experience

First of all, I do love this gun. I have hand polished the wood, added an appropriate looking gloss finished 3-7 scope, leather on the loop and a Montana leather sling. It is now so pretty I don't want to take it out.

That said, I shoot CZ 452's and Savage BTVS in competition. The Henry will never be as accurate by design. I didn't expect it to be as accurate as my bolt rifles. But it is a fun shooter.

When shooting SK STD + and using a bench rest on the wood, not the barrel, I can shoot 1 inch groups at 50 yds all day. Easily adequate for hunting. Maybe not enough for match shooting. Giddy Up! Did I mention how much I love this gun?
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  #28  
Old 07-15-2019, 05:44 PM
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I would try out the following:
CCI SV
CCI Minimags - 40gr round nose
CCI Blazers - 40gr

These generally shoot pretty good in most rifles.

Eley club usually does pretty well too. The lube is more waxy than greasy - so it's probably Ok in a tube mag.

As a rule - I don't like to shoot greasy or drippy ammo in tube mags. That rules out the spendy high end Eley, RWS, and Lapua stuff that shoots fantastic in most rifles. The trouble is that it greases up the tube mags and then dust and grit sticks inside them.
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  #29  
Old 07-15-2019, 08:18 PM
flangster

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Yes: Update

Quote:
Originally Posted by BCRider View Post
Flangster, any updates?

Most of my own accuracy shooting has been with rifles that have separate forestocks attached to the barrels. Some are lever action like the Henry and others are single shot classics. I'd read and learned myself that where on the forestock the rifle is supported certainly does play a part in the accuracy. And for the most part I find that when going for the ultimate accuracy it's better to support the forestock fairly far back towards the receiver. But as always YMMV.... My feeling is that by being closer to the receiver I reduce the effect of any hold pressure changes.
BCR: Yes! My experience bears yours out exactly. I went back to the range with some CCI-SV and played with the support point of the rifle. Best groups were resting the rifle as far back towards the receiver as I could -- was using a sandbag (jeans leg filled with sand and tied at both ends).

Results were night and day. I posted about it here:

https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forum....php?t=1165821

Long story short, my groups shrank to an inch or under simply with the one change that you suggested above. Here is a target with the Henry's stock buckthorn sight.



Here is a set of targets with the Henry wearing a Williams peep sight:



And the bottom groups on this one are with a scope:



The top left scoped target above shows what I was getting with the rifle rested on the wooden forearm. The bottom right shows a couple of ten shot groups with the sandbag under the area just in front of the receiver. What a difference.

So -- follow up: happy camper.
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Last edited by flangster; 07-15-2019 at 08:21 PM.
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  #30  
Old 07-16-2019, 04:29 AM
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My Henry might have something wrong with it!!! It will put Quality ammo under a quarter at 50 yards just about every time I shoot it... sometimes a nickel will cover the group
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