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Those barrel tuning screws - do they work for you?

4K views 18 replies 12 participants last post by  fourbore 
#1 · (Edited)
You never know.......

For the last couple of years, I have had a Harrell tuner on my 52E for use in our club's Unlimited class. I found the tuner did improve my scores and worked with it quiet a bit to ensure I had the best tune I could achieve. While the gun could not consistently beat the custom built guns, I felt it acquitted itself quiet well . Then our club changed up things a bit for this year....we are now shooting only two classes: an Unlimited class and a Factory class with two targets each - IR 50. So, I decided to pull the tuner and shoot the gun in the factory class.

A couple of weeks ago, I decided to get the gun out and do a little tuning up for our first match of the year. The original Marksman stock is of the later E type and did not have the barrel tuner like the Ds and early Es have. Last year, in order to preserve the original stock, I picked up a used D stock for the gun, refinished it and pillar bedded the gun into it - free floated. And it came with the factory barrel tuner. I had never tried the tuning screws with this gun. On a whim, I decided to see if they would make much difference. I've tried them on my D with mixed results. So, 3 clicks up after barrel contact.....and the thing seemed to shoot really well. So at our match this Saturday, I shot the two required targets (IR 50), and came away with two consecutive scores of 250 each. I thought that was pretty fair for an old stock Winchester rifle...they knew how to build them back in the day.

What boggles my mind is that the gun shot better than it did with the Harrell tuner. I know that conventional wisdom says that one should be able to do better with a properly adjusted tuner (and yes, I did my best to get the best tune) on the end of the barrel than with those two barrel tuning screws, but not in this case. So, maybe we shouldn't discount those old factory Winchester barrel tuners until we have given them a chance. Those old boys may have been onto something. :D
 
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#2 ·
I think the tuners worked for the most part. The real problem is getting it to repeat the next time you use it. Wood stocks are tough to tune on a consistent basis. My experience has been that with a conventional wood stock(not laminated), that the forearms are just too flexible and the wood changes as the weather. This changes the amount of pressure on the barrel. The 52's that I have built for competition always get a good pillar bedding and a generous free floating.
Steve
 
#3 ·
Steve, I think your logic is pretty sound concerning this. I know that with the D, I have had it shoot very well free floated one time only to find that it prefers pressure from the tuning screws next time. We shot in the rain Saturday, so there was humidity aplenty. I forgot to back off on the tuning screws from my previous session, and when I checked them, one screw lacked two clicks touching the barrel and the other needed to be backed out three to clear. So, the stock definitely had shifted a bit. But I backed both out completely and reset to three up after contact.....and again it did very well. As you imply, consistency is the loose screw here.....time will tell if it continues to like the pressure from the screws. But I can say that I never got two 250 scores in a row with the Harrell tuner......probably just the way the mop flopped. But I can hope....can't I? :rolleyes:
 
#6 ·
One other comment and then I'm backing out of this subject. It could go on forever, and has been tossed around for the last 60+ years.
When shooting bench matches, I always place the rest fairly close to the receiver to minimize leverage from the forearm creating stress to the barrel/receiver. This is especially true with rifles such as the D with tuning screws touching the barrel. Just the weight of the rifle alone increases the pressure these screws are creating on the barrel. Full floated barrels are less prone to fluctuations, but are affected somewhat, non the less. Cheek pressure adds even more variations to the equation.
I started out as youngster shooting Schuetzen competition with falling blocks. We learned very quickly, that where the rifle was placed in the rest had a huge influence on POI. It also taught me to use consistent cheek pressure.
Steve
 
#7 · (Edited)
Thanks for the tip on front rest placement Steve I have been putting it about 3 inches from the end of the stock on my E international #705 I will place it closer to the receiver next month at the 200 yard match...now to learn how to read the wind better lol shot a 296 19x saturday with little wind at 100
 
#8 ·
Backing off the tension screw after a session is a good idea, and one that I did not do last week. Must remember to do it tonight.

I guess this also means you need to re-sight-in at the beginning of each session.

The other is my 52b repro does not have the tension screw clicks.
 
#11 ·
Backing off the tension screw after a session is a good idea, and one that I did not do last week.

I guess this also means you need to re-sight-in at the beginning of each session.
I got an early Remington 40X with the stock tension screws back in the mid 1990's. I have never turned them and they are touching the barrel. Also have never backed them out after each range session. Never heard of that until a few years ago...I don't really care to have to go through re-sighting in the gun each time I take it out, so they are left as is.

The gun is still as accurate each session as it always was, and it has won several BR-50 matches back in it's days.
 
#10 ·
I have to agree with Mr. Dokey on this. I could never guarantee any consistency when using the factory tuning screws. Set them at one session and turn them out when finished and start the whole process over for the next session. Got to be a real pain, so I just backed them out completely and let the barrel free float. Find ammunition the gun likes, watch the wind and go for it. Not very scientific, but it works for me. I really lucked out in certain respects because both my "D" and "E" like the same ammunition.

Rick H.
 
#12 ·
I have used them on a D and an E with some success. The funny thing is, I begin each match by trying the gun free floated. If it shoots, I leave it that way. If it is being fussy, I turn the screws in until barrel contact and then three more clicks. I have sessions where the guns shot really well free floated and others where it needed the barrel contact. Depends on the phase of the moon or some such.



But make no mistake. There have been times where using the screws won some matches for me.
 
#13 ·
I have a BRNO Model 4 rifle with a barrel tensioning screw. For a long time I didn't fool with it. I always thought that the rifle should do better than it did so one day I began playing with the tension screw. It didn't take long to find a sweet spot and now the rifle shoots like it should have all along.

FWIW, I leave the screw set as it is.
 
#14 · (Edited)
Brown tuner

I've got a couple of these old screw in tuners made by Brown if anyone is interested. I've fooled with the tuners on 52's and 40X rifles and they do work. When I was messing with them I used a continuity meter that came with an old 52 to establish contact between the barrel and the tuner screws. It would have been really handy if the adjustment screws didn't have any detent as someone mentioned earlier.

T
 
#15 ·
I am guessing here. My guess is the location of those screws was critical. It may have worked on those 52's because Winchester did some trial and error and found the sweet spot. That spot was a function of the barrel harmonics which is determined by the geometry of the barrel. All guess work here. Thinking that all those 52's with bobbed barrels would have the tuner in the wrong spot. Also guessing, that adding one of these to another brand of rifle would be hit or miss proposition as to the best location.

Did the Brown screw come with instructions for determining the best location? Or am I all wrong on this?

I think I read some where the German K98 Mausers had pressure, spring loaded, plunger in the stock and the location was based on the above method. If I remember right, which is in doubt.
 
#16 ·
I am guessing here. My guess is the location of those screws was critical. It may have worked on those 52's because Winchester did some trial and error and found the sweet spot. That spot was a function of the barrel harmonics which is determined by the geometry of the barrel. All guess work here.
I'm nearly certain that the 52D tuners were in the same location for both the standard weight and heavy weight barrels. Position is probably important, but I doubt that Winchester achieved optimum placement.

And now for a Public Service Announcement.

If you always leave the screws backed out to free float the barrel, lubricate the screws at least once per decade. I recently purchased a 52D standard weight that had sat in a safe unused since 1982 and probably had not been used much (if at all) since 1964. With all the recent talk on tuners, I decided to see if they made a difference. But the old oil had turned to varnish and the screws were stuck. With the screws in the backed out position, the tuner can't be removed from the stock. I had to be careful with the penetrating oil, so as not to saturate the stock, but eventually got them freed up.
 
#19 · (Edited)
I tried without success too find that K98 device with a google. I must have that K98 wrong. Maybe it was an Enfield discussion, but; I could swear it was German.

This is the brown patent (google patent, app like google maps) :

https://patents.google.com/patent/US2497861A/en?oq=2497861

If I am reading this right. The user will determine the optimum location then install two brown screws?

Expert stock fitters or bedders have found that the location of bedding points and the pressure exerted by them on the barrel and action 2 bedding points to determine settings best suited to a given rifle and/or to a given ammunition. Having determined the best settings, the user of the rifle", by means of this invention, can accurately and rapidly re-bed his gun to achieve the same bedding point setting on his rifle which is best suited to given ammunition regardless of any stock warpage or of changing temperature conditions.
 
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