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Old 01-23-2017, 01:27 AM
22Cool
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Do I have the most *precise* stock 10/22 carbine you've heard of?



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*SUBJECT EDIT* - Do I have the most precise base model stock 10/22 Carbine you've heard of?

Darn big words in the subject line for a 10/22 newbie, huh?

*SUMMARY ADDED*:
-I'm a newbie to bench rest shooting and this is my *first* attempt; however I've shot and practiced Bullseye Pistol shooting for 5 years or so.
-This is a factory stock 10/22 Carbine I paid about $220 for and the only mod is a BX trigger. I plan to return the stock trigger in at some point.
-I'm using an Aim Sports *4x* scope I got off Amazon for $24 shipped.
-I'm shooting indoor (see first point); however it is off a shallow bench standing/crouching using a *single bag rest*.
-I shot these targets using CCI Standard Velocity (SV) ammo and hadn't tried good target ammo at the time of this initial post
-Perhaps I'm a "natural" and maybe a lot of luck is involved here, but this gun has to be frikin' near perfect to allow me to make 3 consistent 4-shot groups (minus flier) in a row pictured below as a new br shooter IMHO.
-2/1/17 Update - Named this gun "Facty"
-2/4/17 Update - Looks like this has morphed into a blog!



Some long-winded background before the good stuff...

I've wanted a 10/22 for many years now (maybe 20?) and meant to get one after I got my first rifle...a Savage 954 with a plastic scope (ugh). I somehow deprioritized it and focused on handguns mostly and have only purchased one other rifle (Walther M22 bullpup) in the decades since. However I still wanted to eventually get one and even had someone get me the "Customize the Ruger 10/22" book by James E. House a few years ago (great book!). Last summer I saw a great deal on the carbine at a local Sporting goods chain which also included a free extra magazine, so I got it and put it in my closet.

The new carbine has been sitting in my closet locked up until I recently decided to try some rifle shooting this year...some practice on the long range and/or maybe some steel plate challenge (both which I've never tried). So for the last few weeks I've been breaking in the 10/22 and I did one mod...I put in a BX trigger - I was actually lucky on the stock trigger though since it came in a 4.5 lbs). I also added on a cheap AIM Sports 4x scope I got off Amazon for $24 - note that the cross hairs are somewhat fat for really accurate shooting at 25yds IMHO. After a while the gun seemed to be getting better and better and seemed particularly good with CCI SV.

On a recent range session I managed to get a 5 shot group using CCI SV (Standard Velocity) almost all touching at 25 yds! I suspected that this wasn't a fluke; however I was doing ammo testing that day and later figured I'd try it again later with just CCI SV.

Fast forward to last night...the big night! I fired some of my other guns first and then on to the "stock" carbine. I chose one of my own custom targets I've designed and with it set to 25yds (max for the indoor range I go to), I started shooting off the bench using a single bag rest. Note that I'm new to bench rest shooting and I didn't want to lug around more than one shooting bag (I brought 2 pistols and 3 rifles by myself tonight!).

Using CCI SV, I did 5 shots each target at 25 yards and was initially a bit disappointed...then I remembered that focusing more on the cross hairs rather than the target works better for me. Then for target #4 it was shooting nirvana...I got a first round flier, but the next 4 went into one hole! I stopped to take a picture and also show my setup.

Then with some worry that it was a fluke, I started on target #5. #5 was almost identical to #4! One flier and the rest in one hole!

Okay...stay calm...twice may still be a fluke...can I do it for #6 to set it in stone?

I first adjusted the AIM Sports scope 2 clicks to the "right". Then I thought I'd be more clever and aim low right to get the first round flier in the center...SMACK! BULLSEYE!!!
However then my luck ran out...I pulled the trigger and *click*, nothing...I had to wait and then stand up and check for a jam/stovepipe/etc. It ended up being a Failure to Load (FTL), so I just put the mag back in, recocked, took aim...BANG! Same spot hit! But then another *click*...another FTL! This repeated each time, so I actually had to get up and reload after every single shot on target #6! I'm also pretty sure I flinched a bit on the last shot(s). Still, all holes were touching! This from a "stock" carbine with a newbie bench rest shooter behind it shooting off a short low bench using one rest bag.

So here are some pics since you've waited so long...






Now for some questions for you folks...

1) Any suggestions on how I should treat this treasure? I'm going to leave everything stock (maybe even switch back the stock trigger), but is there a stock class competition? Unfortunately I'll need a scope since my eyesight is poor.

2) Should I clean the barrel or just action? I'm pretty sure the FTLs at that last target was due to a need for cleaning since the CCI SV seemed fine for all the other shots I did prior. I cleaned it after I got it and then once again after maybe 100 shots and that was maybe 200 shots ago.

3) Have you seen or heard of another stock carbine doing one hole groups at 25yds? How rare is this? I mostly hear postings of people saying they're disappointed with the accuracy of stock 10/22s and others saying that they're normally not MOA in stock form. I'm simply blown away by this.

BTW - Minus the flier, the smallest group is 0.125" center to center. Dang.

If any good bench shooters are in NY north of NYC (near NJ border), feel free to PM me and I can let you try it out at my local range.

Off to bed...way past my bed time!

Last edited by 22Cool; 02-04-2017 at 12:26 AM. Reason: Clarified stuff since I'm nitpicky...plus I keep finding mistakes. =P
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Old 01-23-2017, 09:20 AM
DrBill1

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Thumbs up Stock 10/22 Accuracy

I just purchased a "Light Target Varmint" 10/22 heavy stainless barrel, 2 stage trigger, with a WOOD stock and rubber but-plate. I do not see an official Ruger listing corresponding. My range is exactly 43Yd long and I too am pleasantly surprised with its out of box accuracy (especially after trying to get a take down model to shoot recently). All my groups run less than 5/8" with a variety of HV ammo. Anyone have info on my new 10/22?
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Old 01-23-2017, 09:43 AM
22Cool
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrBill1 View Post
I just purchased a "Light Target Varmint" 10/22 heavy stainless barrel, 2 stage trigger, with a WOOD stock and rubber but-plate. I do not see an official Ruger listing corresponding. My range is exactly 43Yd long and I too am pleasantly surprised with its out of box accuracy (especially after trying to get a take down model to shoot recently). All my groups run less than 5/8" with a variety of HV ammo. Anyone have info on my new 10/22?
Nice! However that is a *Target* 10/22, which is specifically made more accurate with the spiral forged match barrel and such and costs twice as much as the carbine, which I was shooting. Shortly after posting I tried to update the subject line to include "carbine", but it only changed it within the thread.

I was considering the non-TD Target (still am actually) since the book I referenced tested it with lots of different ammo and it appeared to shoot surprisingly well compared to the modded 10/22s - almost showed there wasn't a need for the book itself!

Last edited by 22Cool; 01-23-2017 at 09:47 AM. Reason: Missed TD part
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Old 01-23-2017, 09:46 AM
22Cool
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DrBill1 - I missed that you mentioned "Takedown". That is great accuracy on a TD! I have a SS regular TD on on order and have been researching a bit on how to make it more accurate, so you're doing something right!
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Old 01-23-2017, 12:37 PM
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Mission impossible

Quote:
*EDIT* - Do I have the most accurate base model stock 10/22 CARBINE you've heard of?
Maybe.

I share your enthusiasm for the stockers. Or should I say slightly modified stockers.

Here is a 21st century receiver, bolt, trigger group w/ a 90’s oem barrel (factory chamber/crown) in a vintage carbine stock with a cheapo barska scope I got from RFC member for $20 used. It does have a modified trigger.

Rifle named ‘Ruby’ for the ruby colored shellac I used in the re-finish for the base coat under the clear lacquer.

25yd target shot when photo was taken



Also, IMO, having both, the barreled actions (nib) of the carbine and the sporter are the same. In practical terms, the only difference is the barrel band and looks. The profile of the stock, inletting, etc. are the same.

Here is a 50th model DSP with a Brimstone trigger job and match ammo. Did some bedding tricks as well. Barrel was NOT re-chambered or re-crowned. The 25yd target is a SuperStock ” club qualifying target. I am told others have done it in the distant past, but I don’t see any others doing recently. I think that is because not many people bother to try not because I am a great shot or because mine is the most accurate ever.

Rifle named ‘Cheekbone’ for the diy cheek rest that is molded to fit the cheekbone.

25yard target



Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to make the RFC SuperStock ” club with that box-stock carbine allowing only the following modifications (my rules not SuperStock rules):

1. You can modify or replace internal trigger group parts but must retain the oem housing.
2. You can do any bedding tricks you want.
3. You can remove the barrel band if you want.
4. You can use any ammo you want.
5. You can use any target you want.
6. You can use any rest you want.
7. You can shoot the target indoors or outdoors.
8. You must shoot a qualifying target and measure it according to the RFC SuperStock or Ultimate (they are the same rules regarding measuring/qualifying) games rules.
9. You can replace parts in the oem bolt for reliability. (I highly recommend a ‘sharp-claw’ titanium extractor w/ extra power spring).
10. You can do what I call an ‘accelerated break-in’ to smooth the cycling action. See RFC abuser name Chaser for tips on how to do that.
11. You must use oem receiver, bolt, charging handle, stock, barrel.
12. You can NOT have the oem barrel re-chambered or re-crowned for improved accuracy.

So then, therefore,

The mission is to make the SuperStock ” club w/o an accurized-barrel and NEAR bone stock rifle, and that will be the starting point for you to answer your own question.
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Old 01-23-2017, 01:00 PM
22Cool
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Originally Posted by 86c View Post
The mission is to make the SuperStock ” club w/o an accurized-barrel and NEAR bone stock rifle, and that will be the starting point for you to answer your own question.
Thanks for all the info and great shooting off a beautiful rifle!

Actually, I'll try to do one better with this rifle. If possible, I'd like to return the original trigger group and join the 1/4" club with no mods.

I think this one shoots that well and will likely do better with better rests (remember, I used a single bag in the front to shoot those above) and some more practice since I'm new to this. Maybe I'll get a better scope since I don't think I can see the circles on that tack-driver target with the fat crosshairs on the present scope, but it's tricky to change something when it's working well. Also I have yet to test it with better target ammo (never felt that I was good enough for it).

I'll also try shooting the outdoor when weather permits to see how this does at longer ranges.

TBH - I'm still somewhat in shock and still trying to wrap my head around how this is possible after all I've read and researched on the 10/22. Once or twice can be by chance, but not thrice with the last one done in 5 separate re-fires. We'll see if it continues shooting this well (fingers crossed) and hopefully the FTL issues stop with a simple cleaning of the receiver area. For now I'm going to treat this rifle with care and attention.
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Old 01-23-2017, 01:22 PM
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If you can pull it off (pun) w/ the box-stock rifle (especially the trigger) my hat is off to you!

You don't have to trust me on this but it is the best bet you have...

SK Rifle Match ammo.

Since I started this thread I have proved over and over that the SK RM out shoots any other ammo in the $10/box range in all my 22s across the board. Rifles, Pistols alike.

https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums...368&highlight=

The ONLY time I saw anything beat the SK RM was when I had a Kidd barrel in a 1022 that shot best with Center-x.

Also note that Tac-22 has out performed ALL others including SK RM in my 1022s at 100yds.

Last edited by 86c; 01-23-2017 at 01:28 PM.
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Old 01-23-2017, 02:20 PM
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100% dead bang box stock 10/22 with factory everything...




Doubt mine is the "most" accurate factory 10/22 but it'll likely run with it.
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Old 01-23-2017, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 22Cool View Post
DrBill1 - I missed that you mentioned "Takedown". That is great accuracy on a TD! I have a SS regular TD on on order and have been researching a bit on how to make it more accurate, so you're doing something right!
Congrats on how good your rifle shoots!

Re Dr. Bill, I think you misread his post. It wasn't the TD that he was saying got 5/8" groups, if I read him right.

Last edited by Tom_in_MO; 01-23-2017 at 07:52 PM.
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Old 01-23-2017, 03:23 PM
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Here is fun, simple, cheap, easy way to start keeping score against yourself and/or the world.

https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums...play.php?f=263

I believe that this is the best use of match ammo and definitely the best way of determining the real world accuracy of it all.

This is the factory sporter shown above.




-------------

Last edited by 86c; 01-23-2017 at 03:29 PM.
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Old 01-23-2017, 04:29 PM
22Cool
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Originally Posted by Tom_in_MO View Post
Congrats on how good your rifld shoots!

Re Dr. Bill, I think you misread his post. It wasn't the TD that he was saying got 5/8" groups, if I read him right.
Thanks! Sorry to Dr. Bill for the confuzion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 86c View Post
Here is fun, simple, cheap, easy way to start keeping score against yourself and/or the world.

https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums...play.php?f=263

I believe that this is the best use of match ammo and definitely the best way of determining the real world accuracy of it all.

This is the factory sporter shown above.




-------------
I'm still a ways off from tack-driving. I actually did read up on it a few days ago and even printed some targets out; however I don't think I'm dialed in enough and I need a better scope. Also thanks for the tip on the ammo...I do have at least two 50 round boxes of SKRM from a while ago for when I was testing a Walther G22 which also shot really well (or is it me? ).


gmd1950 - I definitely think your stock rifle is in the running...darn fine shooting! So how do you treat your stock factory sporter when it shoots so well? Do you clean it regularly?

I'll have to figure out how to fix that first round flier...I believe I read it has to do with the firing pin being unpinned, but I don't want to change anything. Maybe I'll just aim differently for the first shot since it seemed to work last time.
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Old 01-23-2017, 07:30 PM
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Basically you leave it alone, I use a Patchworm to pull a couple of patches sometimes when it needs it but with a lot of rifles on hand none get shot enough to need a lot of shooting. Many here say I should at least do something with the trigger, maybe one day. Enjoy your rifle.
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Old 01-23-2017, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by gmd1950 View Post
Basically you leave it alone, I use a Patchworm to pull a couple of patches sometimes when it needs it but with a lot of rifles on hand none get shot enough to need a lot of shooting. Many here say I should at least do something with the trigger, maybe one day.
I've read from good sources that the trigger doesn't necessarily affect the accuracy - including that book I mentioned where the author had one particularly heavy 11lb trigger example; however it still shot really good groups. Supposedly you learn to shoot that trigger. Still, I would 100% agree that a nice light trigger feels worlds better than a heavy gritty one.

Regarding cleaning...

I'm torn between:
1) Never cleaning the barrel - I've never done this. Sounds uncivilized.
2) Shooting it "clean" by shooting some copper jacketed ammo through once in a while to blast out any lead build-up - I do this once in a while with my pistols, but I usually still eventually clean it when the action gets really dirty.
3) Full clean - my usual practice once it gets dirty enough to affect accuracy or action where I use a barrel cleaning spray and then a snake bore pulled through a few times with a tiny bit of oil on the end of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd1950 View Post
Enjoy your rifle.
Best advice yet! However I'll add a bit..."Enjoy your rifle...and don't mess it up if it's shooting great."
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Old 01-23-2017, 08:11 PM
22Cool
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Just to give folks an idea of why this situation is a dilemma for me...

I was actually in the process of trying to build my first custom 10/22s...three of them! First would be long distance target with an Odyssey stock and silver Kidd barrel and trigger group. The other two I was planning on calling "Fire and Ice" - "Fire" would be with a red stock (got it already and it is GORGEOUS) and black gun parts as well as some decals on the barrel (will use the tri-fluted barrel from KSA), "Ice" would be one with blue stock (got a Boyd's unfinished and will stain myself and maybe give it a white stripe) and silver parts.

I was planning on using the stock 10/22 receiver for the first and second custom builds, so leaving it stock was the last thing on my mind. Additionally, what if it actually shoots worse after these $$$$ mods?!?
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Old 01-23-2017, 10:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 22Cool View Post
I've read from good sources that the trigger doesn't necessarily affect the accuracy - including that book I mentioned where the author had one particularly heavy 11lb trigger example; however it still shot really good groups. Supposedly you learn to shoot that trigger. Still, I would 100% agree that a nice light trigger feels worlds better than a heavy gritty one.

Regarding cleaning...

I'm torn between:
1) Never cleaning the barrel - I've never done this. Sounds uncivilized.
2) Shooting it "clean" by shooting some copper jacketed ammo through once in a while to blast out any lead build-up - I do this once in a while with my pistols, but I usually still eventually clean it when the action gets really dirty.
3) Full clean - my usual practice once it gets dirty enough to affect accuracy or action where I use a barrel cleaning spray and then a snake bore pulled through a few times with a tiny bit of oil on the end of it.



Best advice yet! However I'll add a bit..."Enjoy your rifle...and don't mess it up if it's shooting great."
A trigger is absolutely the first accuracy upvra6de done to most firearms. It does absolutely nothing to make the rifle more accurate..It does however make the monkey yanking on the trigger more accurate.

Guys do get good groups with 11lbs pulls. We used to get good groups with slugs, out of 870 slug guns back home in Illinois for deer season. Yep, had to use slugs and a shotgun....silly.

Good groups and maximizing a rifles ability are often times, two different animals. I have traditionally, lightend triggers before I even shot a firearm and that includes pistols and shotguns. A couple didnt need it, but most did.

Simply put; you wont find many people who obsess over absolute accuracy. Who dont also obsess about triggers measured in ounces...these are obsessive people regardless, but you get the jist.

Anyway, you have what appears to be a great shooter. Enjoy it and be sure to buy enough to last a year. Just in cant you cant any for a few years
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