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  #16  
Old 01-14-2006, 04:28 PM
MtStream

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Bake we really have to stop posting at the exact same time .
  #17  
Old 01-14-2006, 04:32 PM
Bake

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MtStream
Machine work is @ 1/2 the cost ,give or take,of a aftermarket barrel . Less if you can do the work ,obviously. The reamers & crowning tools add to the cost initially - but are you really going to stop with just one use ? The tools could also be leased/sold to the next guy for his project .

The price I have seen for work on a factory barrel is in the $90 dollar neighborhood. A decent aftermarket can be bought for little more than $100. Sell off the factory barrel and the cost is pretty much the same.
-Bake
  #18  
Old 01-14-2006, 04:33 PM
Bake

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LOL, agreed.
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  #19  
Old 01-14-2006, 04:37 PM
Avid shooter

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Some of us do not have the appropriate tools to do the job. WE do, however, know that a bentz chamber is need to provide the accuracy we want. Why? To provide a more even distribution of force from the ignited powder. There; do I qualify for the make a wish for a bentz foundation now. lol. There are certain things that need to be done by a pro.
  #20  
Old 01-14-2006, 04:39 PM
clint

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The only problem with no mods is I have never seen anything super about a stocker. If you want a SuperStocker it would seem you would want a rifle to look stock, but shoot super.

I think the point has been said enough on barrels, the chamber is around %96 maybe more e of the accuracy of a 10/22, the rest you can tweak till your hearts desire, I don't think you will make it more accurate, maybe more repeatable, more reliable, more eye pleasing.

Clint
  #21  
Old 01-14-2006, 04:51 PM
MtStream

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Quote:
Originally Posted by clint
The only problem with no mods is I have never seen anything super about a stocker. If you want a SuperStocker it would seem you would want a rifle to look stock, but shoot super.

I don't think you will make it more accurate, maybe more repeatable, more reliable, more eye pleasing.

Clint
1)I was under the impression the whole point of super stock is to preserve the "look" of the stock gun (Mainly the classics rather than butchering them to make an Ultimate )
2)Simply facing the barrel &setting the shoulder back @ .1" and a recrown does do a good bit of good accuracy-wise while retaining the reliability,repeatability and look .
ETA: My personal gun has an aftermarket barrel already - sort of eliminates me by my OWN definition of Superstock . Whether or not an owner does their own work or send it out to be done doesn't matter to me . It is a labor of love to me personally .

Last edited by MtStream; 01-14-2006 at 04:54 PM.
  #22  
Old 01-14-2006, 05:20 PM
Uncle Jed

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Well??? Sort Of.. :)

  #23  
Old 01-14-2006, 05:35 PM
sawdust

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Here are my thoughts on what a Super Stock could or should be. In fact I should finish mine next week and I'm going to enjoy it reguardless of how this discussion turns out. These comments are also included in the link at the botton about an Ultimate Sleeper which got a lot of the discussion about a Super Stock class going and contains some thoughts about defining the class.

My idea of a Super Stock would be to retain the factory stock (unaltered apperance), barrel, receiver ( of course) and the trigger guard.

Now what could you do?. Set back and rechamber the barrel, polish the bore, head space the bolt, radius the bolt, pin the firing pin, stone the hammer hook, grind a new radius on the hammer, lighten the hammer, install oversize pins, install set screw for sear engagement, install set screw for pre travel, shim the bolt, polish the hammer face, polish the back of the sear and leg of the disconnect, add a second action hold down, bed the action, bed the barrel, bed the second action hold down, polish the trigger return plunger, install a lighter trigger return spring, LockTite the hammer bushings into the hammer, shim the hammer and sear, secure the trigger guard to the action, polish the hammer strut, and probably a bunch more things I didn't mention. So far none of these improvements show and the gun will look factory stock yet function like a full custom.

Now here are some things to consider that will show. A short extended mag release, 11 deg target crown and a trigger over travel screw. You'll have to look close to pick up any apperance changes. I have most of these mods and improvements scheduled for my Wal-Mart rifle before the first shot is fired. The barrel is being set back right now.

With any luck this will stay a nice light good looking gun that will be a pleasure to hunt and plink and will benchrest almost as well as our Low Dough Ultimates. I say almost as the trigger is going to stay at 2#, as opposed to 15 oz, and the narrower factory stock forearm won't ride the bags like our benchrest stocks and I have a 4 power scope scheduled for it as opposed to a 24 power. So, thats a preview of what I think a Super Stock can be and in a couple of weeks will be. Probably won't post a picture as there won't be much to see.

Oh yea and a bolt buffer. Sorry Vincent, I just can't find a place to squeeze in a Hi-Rise manifold.

https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums...hlight=sleeper

Good luck

sawdust

Last edited by sawdust; 01-14-2006 at 05:37 PM.
  #24  
Old 01-14-2006, 05:35 PM
MtStream

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Jed
Jed I know you've posted the details on that rifle previously , but can you run it down again ?
Other than the extended buttpad (possibly the barrel - what is it for sure ?) I find that really close to what "My definition " would be . Even the scope will fit in as long as it is a Ruger supplied base .
ETA : got me on the "Running Boar " you sly devil !
  #25  
Old 01-14-2006, 05:48 PM
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Superstock.

I'm building several SuperStocks. I am not building Hobby Stocks, or Limited Modifieds, or Late Model Sportsmans, I am building SUPERSTOCKS.
They are HM2 caliber, .22lr is BORING.....BORING.....BORING!
I already have a 96HMR that you are welcome to compete against, it is only a limited modified though, certainly not a SUPERSTOCK.
Superstock doesn't mean factory only parts. That, is HOBBY STOCK. The only thing Superstock means, is that the body is still somewhat recognizable as the factory passenger car it represents.
I'm building what I am building, regardless of what ever constraints anyone tries to put on this deal, it will be my goal first and foremost to attain accuracy, performance, and looks in that order, and I reserve the right to completely re-design the guts to do it, I turn my nose up at 22lr., and the stock having to retain its stock appearance.
THE REASON I am building a "D" and "C" Sports racer as a professional project is because the only rules are a minimum weight, maximum motor displacement, and some very loose dimensional requirements, and a few antiquated chassis regulations (focusing of safety).
If you wanna build a Hobby Stocker, and call it a SuperStock, that can be YOUR problem, not mine.
If I wanna make a $1,000.00 Mannlicher stock, then I will. If I wanna build a $250 group with a solid brass trigger, and have matching other solid brass components, then I will. If I require of myself that it isn't finished until it shoots under a half inch at 100 yards, then I will.
And if I want to carve on a factory stock to make it what I think it needs to be, to look better and perform better, then I will.
Please do not attempt to call a Hobby Stock a Superstock, and put silly little send your action to Randy rules to it, so you can end up with the the same mediocre perfromance that a 22lr produces. Get REAL about this deal, and it doesn't require a lot of dough, for instance, why not make your Walnut Sporter into an early fingergroove Sporter look-a-like, and put a silver action in it, complete with a vintage (no side hole in the housing) group that has been refinished in some manner to now be silver as well.......Hot Rod Cool stuff.........Spokane Washington is the Home of the First Hot Rod Club ever to exist, "The Dukes". It was born from a bunch of kids that had little money, but lots of innovative ideas, like my Dad's first Hot Rod, a '48 Lincoln he referred to as "The BFB", because it had a "Big F***'in Buick" for a motor.
His friend had a '39 Chevrolet they built up into the fastest and most beautiful Hot Rod around at that time, the first to ever have an aluminum firewall, Dave Larsen bought it for $50, and then had to hide it at my Dad's house, because his Mom would have killed him if she knew about it. It is still ALL original (to it's original build), including the bright yellow Oldsmobile powerplant, that car was built in the Early and Mid- Sixties.
When you say SuperStock, this is the kind of thing I think about, not a heavily restricted still factory POS.
Heck, even my 22lr-22MAG conversion rifle meets the Superstock criteria, you should see what I am doing to a Fajen Silhouette, I am currently referring to it as my "Toma'Cuda".
The rules are: THERE ARE NO RULES.
  #26  
Old 01-14-2006, 05:53 PM
Uncle Jed

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The gun started life with me in 1976..
It was and is a Liberty Model..
I wanted to try a new barrel for many year's , but did not want to mess up the origional stock.. " Opening the barrel channel "..
When I bought my kid's, Camo 10/22 last year I was looking for a 40th Anniversary Edition for him..
None were left around here then, but the guy did have a take off stock that he sold me for $25.00 with the kid's gun..
Light's went off here and I seen a opertunity to start a project..
In reality, I am a bolt and receiver from haveing Two for myself..
The buttpad dont do much for recoil, but it did bring the ballence right back to the center of the magizine,as Bill Ruger was smart enough to figure out..IMO
Check out a few of your's to see where the balence point is..
It makes for better offhand shooting I beleive.
Eventually,, I plan on putting my old 1976 Model, back to Origional Condition..
I have kept all the part's for that reason..
The origional walnut stock has some pretty good looking grain ,and most likely, I will refinish it to bring it out as it should be..
It has more than served me well over the year's..
Jed

Last edited by Uncle Jed; 01-14-2006 at 08:57 PM.
  #27  
Old 01-14-2006, 06:09 PM
RICOCHET

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uncle JED,

what kinda scope you have on that rifle?? looks small and compact, kinda what i'm looking for to place on my plastic lite weight rig gun.

thanx.








  #28  
Old 01-14-2006, 06:16 PM
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So far so good. This can NOT be a STOCK class. There is no point in that. Remember, this is FUN. That was why I tend to think of this as a noncompetitive class.

I'm a racer. I took 300 dollar 10,000 rpm Yamaha Kart motor that would last half a season and turned it into a $1000 14,400 rpm motor that lasted for a hour and a half. And then needed a 500 dollar rebuild. I spent nearly $2000 a race in 1980's dollars to race a twin engine Kart!! That was for a half hour practice and a one hour race. This was good enough to run at a Nation Championship level. Racing/competition have a way of making things LESS fun in alot of ways. Let's NOT make this type of rifle anything like THAT.

Rules....remember the less the better I think. This is about sharing and learning. If sawdust wants to set his barrel back and rechamber (thats what I'm planning next) and Phil wants to put a Green Moutain Sporter whats wrong with that? If they are not directly competeing whats the problem and why should anybody tell either of them what to do? ENJOY YOUR RIFLE.

I think, for me the stock should stay Ruger or Ruger inspired. My 1976 Carbine has the walnut stock but it stick out WAY past the but plate all around. Because of that there is a LARGE chip next to the butt plate. So my plane is to sand down the stock to match the buttplate. It will look alot better, it will protect the stock from chipping again aand it will leave the stock with less of a "clubby" feel.

Then I'm going to do something RADICAL with the bedding!! What? Melvin Forbes of Ultra Light Arms found that his thin barreled guns shot better with complete, full length, bedding. YUP!! I'm gonna bed the whole darn thing and then I'm going to clamp it tight with the barrel band. Think of how stiff that barrel will be. Just that 6 inches or so sticking out. Will it shoot little tiny groups? Heck, I don't now but I will.....and so will you. Because I post it and you will know if it worked or not.

In fact I think I will bed it first, test it. THEN I will set the barrel back and test it again. I will then post that. Get the idea? If we all do stuff like this we will find out what works and what does not.

What will we learn? Alot of things I hope. One thing that I am almost sure we will learn is that there is more than one way to skin a cat. That there are MANY ways to make these little guns shoot.

What do you think? Maybe worry less about what is or is not a SuperStock and start (or continue) building them. Personally I really don't care what barrel you have. Mine will be a Randy tuned stocker that already shoots VERY well.

Is there anybody fighting about what is or is not an "Ultimate"? Than why fight about this?
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  #29  
Old 01-14-2006, 06:17 PM
Uncle Jed

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Quote:
Originally Posted by RICOCHET
uncle JED,

what kinda scope you have on that rifle?? looks small and compact, kinda what i'm looking for to place on my plastic lite weight rig gun.

thanx.
That is an 18 year old ,Leupold Veri-X II Rimfire 2-7X28 that sat on my 77/22 RM till last spring when I upgraded the scope on my Mag, because between better 22 mag ammo today, and the fact that my 77/22 RM shoot's very well.
The Mag ware's a 3-9x33 EFR Rimfire today..
My 10/22 build will most likely get one this spring..
  #30  
Old 01-14-2006, 06:26 PM
RICOCHET

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thank you uncle JED.








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