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Old 11-17-2019, 08:15 PM
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Help! New Savage B22 FV-SR WAY, WAY OFF when suppressed



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Hello,

I've lurked on RFC for a long time but never started a thread. I hope I am doing this right, as I don't want to get dinged by an admin. I am nowhere near as experienced as most members here, but I have encountered a problem and would really appreciate your input.

On October 9th I purchased a Savage B22 FV-SR, which was then ready for store pickup on the 14th. I mounted a trusted Nikon rimfire scope and put just a few rounds through it. I didn’t bother finding exact zero, but just plinked at stumps with some CCI Quiets to get it in the ballpark. All seemed fine.

However, last week, the first week of November, I was finally able to mount my suppressor, a SilencerCo Warlock II, to do some backyard shooting with the same ammo. It was like a different gun. I ran out of adjustment on my scope turrets just getting the faintest idea of where my rounds were landing—at 20 yards! I restarted by finding mechanical zero on the turrets and repeated the process. The point of impact was not discernible anywhere on the target.

I first suspected the scope rings, however unlikely. The Nikon scope mounts to my CZ with dovetail-base rings, so I had purchased Leupold picatinny-style rings for the B22. I went out and bought some Weaver rings to swap out for the Leupold. Same result. So the rings were not the problem.

I then decided to double-check the scope. I remounted it on my CZ 452. All was fine. Could it be the Savage’s rail/receiver alignment? I again mounted the scope on the Savage and fired a few rounds unsuppressed. All was fine—a decent, albeit informal group, demonstrating that the rail was aligned properly on the receiver.

I asked myself, "Could the problem then have been the suppressor?" I had experienced no problems with the SilencerCo suppressor when hosted on my target pistol, a Ruger Mark IV 22/45 Lite. I doubted that the issue would be the suppressor’s weight affecting barrel harmonics on the B22. An all-aluminum suppressor weighing 3.0 oz. on a heavy bull barrel should not be an issue. I also made sure to align the baffles within the tube, as some say to do.

***

So this past Monday, November 11, I took the Savage and the pistol to a friend’s property to do a proper test.

Since much of my shooting is done in the backyard, I restricted myself to CCI Quiets to replicate my usual environment. This is a 40 grain bullet with a muzzle velocity of 710 fps.

This first image shows two, five-shot groups from the Ruger Mark IV pistol at 12 yards. The group marked with slashes from lower-left to upper-right (/, red) are unsuppressed. The group marked with slashes moving from lower-right to upper-left (\, blue) are suppressed.



As you can see, the suppressor moved the POI left just a bit.

Even accounting for this slight POI shift, moving out to 20-25 yards with the suppressor shouldn’t put me off the paper entirely. So I then moved the target to 25 yards. Below is the pistol grouping, unsuppressed and suppressed, at 25 yards. Again, this is acceptable. Such a shift would not be beyond a scope’s adjustment.



***

It was time to move to my new Savage B22. After an impromptu zeroing of the rifle, I was able to produce the group below at 25 yards without the suppressor:



I then mounted the suppressor for five more shots. I applied the white paper around the target itself to see if any rounds impacted the general area off the target. Below is the result. There are a few tears in the lower right piece of white paper from bullet fragments striking the leg of the target stand. They are not impact holes from a 22LR.




The two shots that impacted the target stand were very, very far away from the target’s center. Please forgive the poorly focused picture, but they measure approximately 16 inches from the center. Taking into account this change in POI at this short a distance, I am amazed I didn’t get a baffle strike within the suppressor.




I am no expert marksman, and I am even further from being a gunsmith.

My admittedly novice conclusion is that the Savage’s barrel is likely threaded incorrectly.

Before I go through the immense hassle of sending this back to the manufacturer, I thought I'd get input from you guys. I tried to account for many variables. In retrospect, I know I should have tried at leas two different ammo types. Yet, the CCI Quiet is my go-to for backyard plinking.

Thanks for reading this LONG first thread of mine.

-Momo

Last edited by Momo; 11-17-2019 at 08:19 PM. Reason: Relinking images properly
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  #2  
Old 11-17-2019, 08:45 PM
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a little POI shift is normal when putting on a can, but with a decent suppressor like that the groups should not expand like that. it is possible the threads are not square to the bore, since you dont have any other problems when this suppressor is on another host. i would check the baffles to make sure you dont have a baffle strike. a friend has allowed me to shoot a couple of his form 1 cans he built. the quietest one, that is very quiet on a pistol, does have quite a bit of POI shift. but the one that is louder on a pistol, but still quiet on a rifle has no shift at all and actually improves group sizes on all my hosts. but that quiet one exhibits that shift on all the hosts. so i would think in your case it could certainly be the threading.

Last edited by Clem-E; 11-17-2019 at 08:47 PM.
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Old 11-17-2019, 08:51 PM
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I am grateful to you for jumping in!

I will inspect my baffles better to follow up.

With this being my first suppressor, I just wanted to be sure I wasn't committing some newbie error by assuming the problem might be with the new rifle.


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Old 11-18-2019, 07:51 AM
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No problem, I also just thought of something else. measure the depth of the threads on both your hosts. sometimes, there can be too much thread engagement that puts the muzzle to close to the first baffle. so you could try spacing the can on the barrel with washers from the hardware store and see if that helps.
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Old 11-18-2019, 03:01 PM
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Thanks, Clem-E. I'll try the wave washer that came with the Ruger pistol first.

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Old 11-18-2019, 04:19 PM
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Clem! I got home and tried the washer, and started seeing grouping immediately. I'll have to fine tune it, of course, but for all intents and purposes, the problem is SOLVED.

As I said in my initial post, I have lurked on these boards on and off for years, but this is the first time I've brought a problem, and your solution really affirms to me the helpfulness of the RFC community.

I cannot thank you enough.

-Momo

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Old 11-18-2019, 06:58 PM
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Cool. Some thread depths are different and some cans only want a certain amount of engagement. Glad it fixed the issue!
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Old 11-18-2019, 08:43 PM
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Never heard that one. Thanks for sharing.
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  #9  
Old 11-19-2019, 01:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clem-E View Post
Cool. Some thread depths are different and some cans only want a certain amount of engagement. Glad it fixed the issue!
Pro info!
Yoda-man!
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Old 11-20-2019, 07:59 AM
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Happy to pass the info along gents
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  #11  
Old 11-20-2019, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clem-E View Post
.... some cans only want a certain amount of engagement......
Very true. Most US produced 22LR cans spec the total thread length at 0.40" - 0.41".
For whatever reason Savage has not followed these numbers. Some of the MKII are close to 0.75".
On my MKII my Outback II will thread on far enough to contact the blast(first) baffle. Not a good thing.


.





.
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Old 11-21-2019, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HotRod9mm View Post
Very true. Most US produced 22LR cans spec the total thread length at 0.40" - 0.41".

For whatever reason Savage has not followed these numbers. Some of the MKII are close to 0.75".

On my MKII my Outback II will thread on far enough to contact the blast(first) baffle. Not a good thing.





.











.
HotRod,

I imagine that could have been ruinous should you not have caught it beforehand.

I still have so much to learn. After getting my B22, I just blithely screwed on my can (you know, the one I "owned" for 11 months and 11 days before being allowed to "possess" it) and plinked away.

Sometimes it seems like no matter how much research one does ahead, there's still something one could miss.

I guess that's when you get involuntary enrolled in the School of Hard Knocks.



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