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.22 Mag accuracy(sigh)

48K views 229 replies 88 participants last post by  NDAR15MAN 
#1 ·
Been a follower for.. 5 years maybe? I think this may be my 2nd post. *insert beating dead horse sentiment*
I am on the cusp of ordering a Volquartsen in .22 WMR. I have long been interested in the .22 mag, for the purpose of primarily extended range tree squirrel and/or anything else (100 yd in). I have searched and read these posts about guns and ammo accuracy until my eyes crossed, but I need to do it for peace of mind.I want to hear (or see!) what kind of accuracy to expect. My current expectations are MOA to 99 yards(more likely 75-80). So, anyone want to talk me out of it?

Caveat: I didn't post this in the volquartsen section because as I understand it, the ammo is the limiting factor, especially with a gun with the rep of a volquartsen.
 
#72 ·
As I've described elsewhere, I've got a RAR 8364 and I'm exceedingly happy with it's accuracy out to 100 yards. Which is great as I'm hunting hilly woods, lots of chances for long shots, which I find satisfying. I'm using Hornady 30gr V-Max. Of course I am going for front quarter shots only. It was the 4th brand I tried, so I got lucky. On the other hand, my dependable old Brno 611 will accurately shoot Winchester Supremes out to 75 or maybe 80 yards. Took me a lot of shooting to find just what the Brno liked. I do like taking both firearms out to the range and play around making the long, long shots.

.22WMR rifles can be very accurate if they are well made, and shooting the right ammo.
 
#74 ·
I have a H&K 300 with 2.5x and 6x scopes, and it will bounce a tennis ball out to- and past- 125 yards with Federal 50 grain HP, all week long.

I have a Rossi copy of a Winchester [Mode 62?] with iron sights that will do the same, if my eyes cooperate with me- iron sights are getting to be problematic for 62 year old eyes, and it is not simple to scope those pump action rifles.
 
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#77 ·
I have to think the ammo today is a lot better than in 1959 or the 60s.

Not match grade in .22magnum but good........ my CZ 452 FS regularly does sub minute of angle off the bench at 100. I can count on it keeping shots under the cross hairs at 100.... can't ask for more than that IMO ....:bthumb:
 
#78 ·
Wow, I'm glad I found this thread. I also am considering a Volquartsen .22 WMR. It's been more than a few years since I last owned a .22 Mag and seems not much has changed (accuracy-wise).

I really like the style and features the VQ rifle, and like Buckeye , I guess I was hoping that spending a few more bucks might creep me closer to CONSISTENT moa accuracy.

Looks like I need to do a lot more reading.....and then some tough decisions. I think I'll maybe start reading up on other Volquartsen .22 WMR owners experiences first.

Thanks to everyone sharing their collective knowledge. I decided I needed to register today and tell you all that.

Stay well, everyone.

-Gerry.
 
#79 ·
Narsil, I feel the same on reading more, but I just feel that you (we) will see w/e you want from reviews, range reports etc. You can find plenty of people here and elsewhere that will tell you consistent near MOA at 100 is not an issue. And others that say no way. I tend to believe most people exaggerate, as a general rule(about most things in life).

As for the ammo, I've read a lot of stuff, mostly from other sites, with many reports that sorting absolutely does make a difference. I dont believe as some here that it is impossible to isolate enough variables to affirm sorting is worth the effort. When I get the chance, I want to try with some Velicitors. Remove and weigh the bullet and charge. If the bullet weight alone is consistent in say, a random run of 50, at that point the biggest deviations in weight certainly should come from charge, in which case weighing seems worthwhile.
Theres other data points you could gather too. I do believe primer deviations would have an effect, but the amount of material relative to charge I dont think would show up on a scale.

I originally wanted to "buy once, cry once" with the VQ, but I may end up experimenting with a less expensive gun first to see if its viable. Who knows, I might get lucky.
 
#81 ·
Never trust anything without proving it for y'erself.
Get a rifle, buy a variety of 22wmr cartridges.
Test them at 25, 50 and 100 yards.
I'm confident y'er gonna end up on my side of the opinion poll regarding 22wmr cartridge quality.
Well SOME things are ok to trust w/o doing yourself, just not the fun things. It's not that easy for me to just buy ammo or a gun (in New Jersey) hence all the deliberations.

Believe me, if I lived in my home state of Ohio, I would have done this (probably years ago) already and not even made this post.. and regardless of the outcome, I dont think I would've regretted it.
 
#85 ·
While I have to wonder why anyone's using 22 WMR over the LR for squirrel ,being how much more expensive and louder it is to disrupt the woods over a sub 22LR. ~ but if that your fancy I've had best results with the std win 40 gr. ~~JMJ~~
 
#90 ·
Whatcha gonna miss @ 100yrds even with with 1-1/2" accuracy?
You are right, the ammo is the limiting factor! until they clean up the tolerances, apply better bullets & stop making such a mess priming (Ive found the priming compound all over the internal case) it isn't gonna get any better..
Most are having better luck with the light bullets because they are better made!
but I like the 40 & 45gr better for my purposes.
 
#92 ·
Depends on your expectations. I'll agree that as a hunting round the WMR is plenty accurate...squirrels at 100yds and rabbits out to 150.
I think what people find annoying is that with a little more care in ammo manufacturing it would be easy to get 1moa or better out of the round.
It does kind of suck that I I have a rifle and scope combo that totals $1500 and what keeps it from being a 1moa shooter is the $12 box of ammo.
 
#93 ·
22 magnum is probably my favorite all around hunting caliber, but for squirrels out to 109 yards I’d find a 17hm2. Not because of accuracy but for the trajectory and it won’t tear them up as bad.

I think if I could only keep one caliber rimfire it would be a 22 magnum. I’ve never had a problem with accuracy and it has plenty of power too. I might choose the 5mm if ammo was more readily available.

Iron
 
#94 · (Edited)
22wmr...plenty good for 100 yd inch and a half groups.

I have higher expectations from my rifles and ammunition. ;)

I really want "sub-moa all day long if I do my part" at 100 yards. :eek:

Sadly, cartridge quality doesn't allow it.
The 22wmr is intended as a short range hunting/varminting cartridge.
Because of that, I can't believe claims of consistent accuracy at 100 yards,
no matter how many fanboyz I annoy. :rolleyes:

As a hunting cartridge, the only use for shooting groups with the 22wmr is adjusting the scope.
If you want to determine consistent accuracy, shoot a one dot one shot target.
See how many times you hit that squirrels eye, and how many times you miss,
then get back to me about making consistent head shots at 100 yards with the 22wmr. :D

Sadly, none of those sub-moa claimers have been willing to attempt a box of 22wmr at 100 yards
using a one dot one shot target, from any setup, then post the results. None. :(

Instigator? Who? Me? Maybe....:cool:

Consistent center of critter out to 75 yards, that I'd believe. :eek:man:
 
#96 ·
It's sad that this is the state of affairs.
This past summer we picked up an Ithica .222Rem (a heavy barrel varmint gun made by Tikka in the 90's.
It will truly put 5 shots in 1/2" at 100m. Now I don't expect that out of any rimfire...but with proper carefully manufactured ammo you'd think the WMR would at least be capable of truly (not internet truly :D ) 3/4" groups.
 
#95 ·
The wife, my brother , and I are fairly new to the 22 mag. About 5 or 6 years now. The wife has a 9422m and My brother and I both have Ruger 77/22 mag. None are tack drivers. The two Rugers like CCI 40 gr best. The wifes 9422 thinks Hornady 30 gr are best. The wife and i sight in at 75 yards for the simple reason that our range is limited by our property conjure. Both of our rifles, with preferred ammo, shoot 1.5 or less at that range. Don't remember what my brother gets at his 100 yard range. I think about 1.5 also. Using different ammo produces different results. The wife's 9422 seems to tolerate different ammo better.

Any way this is accurate enough for what we want. It just knocks the stuffing out of *****, woodchuck, and other pests. Seeing the damage it does to them makes me not want to shoot anything I'm going to eat with a 22 mag.

If you believe a 22 mag will not be accurate enough for your purposes ,then, don't get one. Personally I cannot hit a squirrel in the head from field positions at 100 yards.
 
#102 ·
Keep in mind there have been high grade Remington 40x rifles in the wild since the 70s, so premium 22 mags have been circulating for decades before my birth.

In college I built dies for a 22 mag, we would load 40 grain v max moly's over hogdon lil gun. Quickload gave the data, we were a smidge over pressure but not bad. Its one of the few cartridges that seemed to benefit from moly coating. We single loaded them in a green mountain barrel on a ruger 7722. It would hold 5 on a inch dot, so close to 1.25 inches.

It was incredibly expensive and tedious, juice wasn't worth the squeeze after I started buying centerfires. But it took a few coyotes and a badger before being retired. Still have a few boxes in Oregon, whenever the crazy subsides I'll bring some up and do some pictures.

For now, I leave it for 75 yards thumping fox size animals and smaller.
 
#99 · (Edited)
CZ 455 Lilja heavy 20 inch barrel, tried multiple setups including barrel block.
Multiple brands and types of 22wmr ammunition. No real difference from
the results with the factory barrel...all because of lack of consistent trajectories.
MV spread and cartridge defects prevent any rifle from producing predictable results.





Finally had enough frustration and sold the Lilja.
Ammo wasn't good enough to allow the barrel to shine.
 
#103 ·
I'm not really confident I can, just hopeful :bthumb: Besides, its something to try.

My little ruger has impressed me with the limited time I've had it at the range. The way it shoots so far at 50 metres using Hornady 30gr and CCI 40gr maxi mags tells me it might just be able to hang around an inch at 100 with good technique, wind flags out etc.
 
#107 · (Edited)
Y'all got me thinking about my wmr loading days. Have a relative searching my folks shop to find the dies we made 10 years ago.

Found the notebook, looks like we were more than a smidge over pressure as the pmc based rounds shot a 40 grain v max moly to 2250 in a green mountain 20 inch barrel over h110. Looks link the cci did better with lil gun, and hit over 2300fps in the same barrel. Honestly dont know why those powders were settled on with that brass. Think quick load was pretty new and that was what it suggested. We had a couple case head separation problems before we swapped to moly.

Moly was the current hotness of the day back then, didn't really help accuracy or velocity but did seem to smooth out the kablam. All rounds were shot out of an encore or a 77/22. Doing napkin math backwards looks like we were in the 35kpsi range to get that speed from 40's. We tried to do a subsonic load with a fast twist barrel but couldn't get it to do any better than patterns. We postulated at the time that 22wmr lost its base all the time at 36 or 37kpsi. But were were college sophomores so.....our science was quick load and test. We blew a couple magazines out the bottom and may or may not of stuck some wmr brass in a finger and leg....

Theorized yesterday with the friend who did the project and came to three conclusions that may or may not have merit.

1. The consistency of ammo was better on the 22 wmr cci machines in 06. 3x ammo rushes doesn't appear to have improved the quality of both hmr and wmr ammo.

2. The 40grain bullet is so much better than all the wmr bullets. We shot a lot of bullets in a 22 hornet and the pulled wmr bullets never shot the same as the 40s.

3. The higher pressure helped. This is a tough one to prove, but some cartridge combos definitely have an affinity for high pressure.
 
#109 ·
Y'all got me thinking about my wmr loading days. Have a relative searching my folks shop to find the dies we made 10 years ago.

Found the notebook, looks like we were more than a smidge over pressure as the pmc based rounds shot a 40 grain v max moly to 2250 in a green mountain 20 inch barrel over h110. Looks link the cci did better with lil gun, and hit over 2300fps in the same barrel. Honestly dont know why those powders were settled on with that brass. Think quick load was pretty new and that was what it suggested. We had a couple case head separation problems before we swapped to moly.

Moly was the current hotness of the day back then, didn't really help accuracy or velocity but did seem to smooth out the kablam. All rounds were shot out of an encore or a 77/22. Doing napkin math backwards looks like we were in the 35kpsi range to get that speed from 40's. We tried to do a subsonic load with a fast twist barrel but couldn't get it to do any better than patterns. We postulated at the time that 22wmr lost its base all the time at 36 or 37kpsi. But were were college sophomores so.....our science was quick load and test. We blew a couple magazines out the bottom and may or may not of stuck some wmr brass in a finger and leg....

Theorized yesterday with the friend who did the project and came to three conclusions that may or may not have merit.

1. The consistency of ammo was better on the 22 wmr cci machines in 06. 3x ammo rushes doesn't appear to have improved the quality of both hmr and wmr ammo.

2. The 40grain bullet is so much better than all the wmr bullets. We shot a lot of bullets in a 22 hornet and the pulled wmr bullets never shot the same as the 40s.

3. The higher pressure helped. This is a tough one to prove, but some cartridge combos definitely have an affinity for high pressure.
Thanks jaia! I'm glad someone can maybe put the info to use. Here a while back I think you mentioned some accurate powder that you thought looked similar to the factory mag powder.. Would you care if I picked your brain for that info?

comfisherman- never thought of using lilgun! I have used H-110 & it is much to slow for the ignition system of the mag! as is A1680.. These are simply the powders I had on hand. I started this load @ 2.0gr & ended up with the bullet stuck about 2" from the muzzle.. As I raised the load, the powder ignited so slow as to have a muzzle loader effect! Probably due to ignition & the position of the powder in the case.. I need a powder with more bulk & faster burn rate in order to achieve a acceptable Sub load.. BTW, I use a cut down 223 seating die.. Dont really have to size! (but I have tried it) But flaring the case mouth is a must! really helps get the flat base bullets seated straight.
 
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