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  #961  
Old 11-30-2019, 05:45 PM
Longhair1957
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaia View Post
Browning Buckmark Silhouette on the Sinclair Bipod
Burris EER AO scope on top.

Eley Action 40 grain 22lr



Still learning how to hold the grip to minimize shifting during trigger squeeze.
Look at the difference between the two patterns produced.





From what I can tell, the heel of my trigger hand is elevating the butt just as I squeeze.
Change in the muscle shape resting on the bags is the cause. By using my supporting hand
under the butt and trigger hand slightly higher on the grip, much tighter results.
Still a long way to go, but at least I'm showing improvement. <img src="https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Wink" class="inlineimg" />

Better results with the Buckmark than my Marlin 60.
Ain't that a kick. <img src="https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Big Grin" class="inlineimg" />
I used to have one of the early buckmark silhouette’s like yours. I did the same thing, harris bipod and a leupold pistol 4x scope.
That was a long ranger squirrel killer!
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  #962  
Old 11-30-2019, 06:00 PM
jaia is online now
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LH, adjustable trigger on y'er Silhouette?
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  #963  
Old 11-30-2019, 06:05 PM
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Jaia, yer startin to become a bona fide pistol shooter!
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  #964  
Old 11-30-2019, 06:11 PM
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Bona fide? Does that mean "needs work?"

It's a bloody tripod with a barrel on top and I still can't keep it steady.
But it does get me out of the house when the wife has the girls over for coffee and conversation.
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  #965  
Old 11-30-2019, 06:14 PM
BillOH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaia View Post

From what I can tell, the heel of my trigger hand is elevating the butt just as I squeeze.
Change in the muscle shape resting on the bags is the cause. By using my supporting hand
under the butt and trigger hand slightly higher on the grip, much tighter results.
Still a long way to go, but at least I'm showing improvement.

Better results with the Buckmark than my Marlin 60.
Ain't that a kick.
https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/...d-pistol-grip/

Maybe something like this on your pistol?
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  #966  
Old 11-30-2019, 06:21 PM
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Might interfere with the magwell Bill.

I might need a wedge shaped block and leather pad
in order to produce a stable grip at the correct height.
The bean bags might be too soft to prevent movement.
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  #967  
Old 12-01-2019, 11:30 AM
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Yup, firmer a pistol rests at the rear the easier it is to get good groups. Tried heavy bags, plastic and wood wedges helped but like any pistol they are super sensitive to shooter input.
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  #968  
Old 12-01-2019, 11:55 AM
David Valdina
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Bullet velocities & consistency based on barrel length.

Maybe this has been done. If so, I never saw it. I don't have a chronograph here in Florida. But I would like to see some .22 ammunition shot out of a short barreled pistol, a short rifle barrel and a long rifle barrel to see if the consistency changes at all with the bullet's length in the barrel. I am willing to bet if there is a difference, the longer barrel will get the most consistency.
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  #969  
Old 12-01-2019, 12:47 PM
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Top, thanks for the confirmation I'm thinking in the right direction.

David, how would you ensure it wasn't variations in the ammo, not barrel length?
Coefficient of friction is going to apply no matter barrel length.
Chamber pressure will vary depending on powder and primer chemistry and amount.
Length of barrel does affect top speed of the bullet.
But I think MV spread is more directly related to cartridge production variations.
Not like rimfire ammo quality is a constant.

Last edited by jaia; 12-01-2019 at 12:51 PM.
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  #970  
Old 12-01-2019, 02:56 PM
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Dave, hope this helps some but it's not always 100% true. Both my Freedom Arms 10" and Anschutz Exemplar 10" barreled pistols use the same settings as most of my 28" barreled older target rifles. My shorter barreled Russian rimfires are faster and use slightly less elevation to hit the same targets from 25 yards to 197 yards.

The exceptation to this is my 28" Remington 40XB which is my fastest gun and uses less elevation than any of my others. Another guy we shot with also has a Remington 40XB and is also a fast gun with settings nearly identical to mine.

This is shooting midpriced ammo such as SK and Wolf which we all use in our guns for my matches. I just got a case of SK Biathalon but haven't tried in the various guns to compare settings versus barrel length.

Think the 10" barrels are still accelerating and the 28" are being slowed slightly. On a good day both short and long will be competitive although the shorter barrels are WAY more sensitive to shooter input with the Freedom being the most picky.

I don't chronograph my shots but use my targets at 197 and beyond to gauge accuracy and how a particular ammo will perform. I accept anything that will consistently stay on my clay pigeon size target at 195 yards good enough for my matches. In some guns I get that with the cheap $2.06 Geco rifle stuff.

These rimfires are sensitive to so many things but I've seen so many competitors at my matches going from being happy to hit a few of my smaller plates to now nearly cleaning my course. I limit my ammo to no more than $8.00/50 so I really think we have critiqued and become so sensitive to what makes the guns shoot AND paying attention to what Mother Nature is telling us we are hitting more and really small targets.

A few years ago we were ridiculed when we told others how far we were shooting but now ELR has become the fad and everyone is giving it a go.

Hope this helps some.

Topstrap

Last edited by Topstrap44; 12-01-2019 at 04:15 PM.
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  #971  
Old 12-01-2019, 03:32 PM
David Valdina
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Follow up on proposed ammo/barrel length test.

If the ammo used is the same, and enough shots are taken, the variable in the standard deviation should be due to barrel length.

My thinking goes along these lines: Commonly held "knowledge" is that 16 inches gives maximum velocity for a standard .22 rimfire cartridge. So that is assuming all of the expansion from the powder has taken place. Beyond that, barrel friction will slow the bullet. And earlier, the powder is still burning. I am thinking it may be more difficult to burn the same partial amount of powder for consistent velocities in a very short barrel. And a longer barrel, although maybe slower, may be more consistent.

This is the problem with sitting around and just thinking.

I also shoot old Wolf Match Extra and SK Rifle Match for almost all of my bench shooting.
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  #972  
Old 12-01-2019, 07:17 PM
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The rest in the second picture is interesting. Is it a commercially made rest or a custom made one?
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  #973  
Old 12-01-2019, 07:43 PM
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In handguns, just as rifles, variations in 'hold' result in spread, it is just magnified with hanguns. It is so predictable that there is an 'error wheel' showing poi changes due to the various holding errors. I havent seen one for rifles, wish I would.
Anyhoo, I figured out for me that to get my primary grip on the gun and Not let go with that hand helped a lot, I do as much other stuff as possible with the other hand if needed.
It is really no big mystery, just do everything exactly the same every time and things tighten up nicely.
Lol......
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  #974  
Old 12-01-2019, 09:19 PM
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I made it. I first made the 40moa mount and planned for a way to add a bi-pod shelf. The brackets straddle the action and the shelf attaches it it.

Still wanted to experiment a bit further to try and eliminate some of the shooter I put with a rear grip/bag hold.

It does really work well but other than using it for our local lo Grange rimfire matches or stretching it out it's pretty impractical. It'll give the rifle guys at the matches run for their money though.

I'll try to add more pictures of various areas tomorrow when I'm on the computer.

Topstrap
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  #975  
Old 12-03-2019, 10:57 AM
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Thanks for the reply and I'm looking forward to more pictures. I would like something for shooting steel plates at around 100 yards and have been scratching my head about designs. I haven't seen anything commercial so far that has inspired me to build an improved version and certainly nothing I would want to purchase. I'm always interested in what others have dreamed up and built that pertains to the shooting sports.
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