Best .22LR for 100 yrs. - Page 2 - RimfireCentral.com Forums

Go Back   RimfireCentral.com Forums > >

Notices

Join Team RFC to remove these ads.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 10-10-2019, 07:25 PM
CamP

Join Date: 
Apr 2015
Location: 
Fort Worth
Posts: 
904
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)


Log in to see fewer ads
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKnarr View Post
I agree but I'm sure you mean understanding why some ammo is good and others bad. I bought mine because I had a brick of Wolf MT that was outstanding so I bought a half case which turned out to be terrible. The Chronograph showed the outstanding lot had 27 FPS spread while the terrible lot had 82 FPS spread. That's the day I found out I don't believe "Find what your rifle likes" and replaced it with "Test until you find a good lot."

BTW, I've had lots of Eley Match that had less than 30 FPS spread and some that had over 50 FPS spread. Having tested 4 lots of Center X and 4 of Midas I can say based on these 8 lots, their spread for all 8 lots was under 32 FPS spread. I tend to buy more Lapua than Eley.
Yes, we're on the same page. I have had the same experience as you. Tested a certain brand of ammo that shoots lights out, then buy a case of that ammo that is bad. Left me scratching my head until I got my hands on a chronograph.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-10-2019, 09:59 PM
jpickar

Join Date: 
Feb 2008
Posts: 
756
TPC Rating: 
100% (3)
A chronograph is my best friend. When I tested the old Win. Power Points the spread was 18 fps and 25 fps deviation. That is better than most of the target ammo I tested. The newer Power points are nowhere near that close.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-10-2019, 10:59 PM
Steve Newman

Join Date: 
Oct 2011
Posts: 
346
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
jaia, have read some of your real world testing reports and conclusions (love the [email protected] 200yds.)...also the more complex and technical characteristics, such as the corkscrew or spiraling phenomenon that shows up as different POI VS. POA very dramatically in RF bullets, as distance increases and velocity and RPM slow down. My question for you...what brand of ammunition in all your testing proved to have the lowest chrono SD numbers, and which (if different) was most consistent on target. I understand about lot to lot variations, and that a different lot number of the same ammo would not produce the same results. Just interested in which sample was most accurate in all of your testing? Thanks for amassing all of the information, documenting it, and presenting it here on RFC.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-11-2019, 01:55 AM
DaveInDenver

Join Date: 
Oct 2017
Posts: 
111
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Newman View Post
jaia, have read some of your real world testing reports and conclusions (love the [email protected] 200yds.)...also the more complex and technical characteristics, such as the corkscrew or spiraling phenomenon that shows up as different POI VS. POA very dramatically in RF bullets, as distance increases and velocity and RPM slow down. My question for you...what brand of ammunition in all your testing proved to have the lowest chrono SD numbers, and which (if different) was most consistent on target. I understand about lot to lot variations, and that a different lot number of the same ammo would not produce the same results. Just interested in which sample was most accurate in all of your testing? Thanks for amassing all of the information, documenting it, and presenting it here on RFC.
Ditto!
THANKS!
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-11-2019, 07:40 AM
jaia
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Apr 2014
Posts: 
5,929
TPC Rating: 
100% (2)
My best, most reliable, rimfire results with smallest mv spreads?

The big three for 22lr, as usual.
RWS R50, Lapua Midas +, Tenex.

Best results for least price per round?

The SK line...Rifle Match/Pistol Match/Pistol Match Special and Biathlon Sport.


I don't have any use for standard deviation.
It is a number that is a calculation of what will happen with 2 out of 3 shots.
I care about extreme spread, the high and low mv's from a box of 50.
That to me is a better indicator of the quality of that batch of cartridges.

Last edited by jaia; 10-11-2019 at 07:51 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 10-11-2019, 10:28 AM
jpickar

Join Date: 
Feb 2008
Posts: 
756
TPC Rating: 
100% (3)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaia View Post
My best, most reliable, rimfire results with smallest mv spreads?

The big three for 22lr, as usual.
RWS R50, Lapua Midas +, Tenex.

Best results for least price per round?

The SK line...Rifle Match/Pistol Match/Pistol Match Special and Biathlon Sport.


I don't have any use for standard deviation.
It is a number that is a calculation of what will happen with 2 out of 3 shots.
I care about extreme spread, the high and low mv's from a box of 50.
That to me is a better indicator of the quality of that batch of cartridges.
Well I guess standard deviation is different than extreme spread. My results are then what you call extreme spread. 18 fps and 25 fps with the old Win. Power Points. Now what did you find with the target ammo you used.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 10-11-2019, 10:48 AM
jaia
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Apr 2014
Posts: 
5,929
TPC Rating: 
100% (2)
J, have you seen my current hobby in the RFC long range forum? 50 at 200?

When you had 25 and 18 fps ES from those old Win Power Points,
it's no wonder you are wishing you had more of them. I would too.

Last edited by jaia; 10-11-2019 at 10:50 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 10-11-2019, 12:37 PM
1813benny
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Apr 2005
Location: 
between here n there....
Posts: 
819
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveInDenver View Post
I recall reading that bullets can have a stability issue when they transition back down to sub-sonic FPS (1125) speed.

So, as the story goes, that good target shooters (I am not one of them) generally preferred SV ammo for 100yrds because HV .22lr can not stay above 1125fps at that range.

What do you pros say?
At outdoor prone and position matches, it is 99% SV. On occasion, you nay see some RWS R100 or some old Federal UM1 (“real ultramatch”).

Regards,
Ken
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 10-11-2019, 12:44 PM
wmrike

Join Date: 
Oct 2016
Posts: 
281
TPC Rating: 
100% (2)
Pretty much what Jaia said.

Some guns, regardless of how good the ammo is, will just blow shots all over the place. There's no cure for that. However, if your gun has the chops, feed it the best ammo you can afford, i.e. the top drawer stuff from one of the big three. I've had best results with Tenex R50 (I haven't bought Lapua in decades - I need to revisit that).

Some of the upper mid-line brands (e.g. SK) do very well, but there is a lot more testing involved to get something rivaling, say, Tenex.

If you don't like to test much, buy a half dozen sample lots of some good stuff, test it, and if you see something you really like, go back and get as much of that lot as you can. However, if you do get enjoyment out of the testing process, by all means shoot the mid-grade stuff and look for little diamonds in the rough.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 10-12-2019, 02:53 AM
DaveInDenver

Join Date: 
Oct 2017
Posts: 
111
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaia View Post
Transition from super to subsonic has insignificant effect on the 22lr.
Ammunition quality is everything if you are attempting rimfire accuracy at 50 yards and beyond.

Previous post...

https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forum...1&postcount=25
Love it.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 10-12-2019, 08:37 PM
Phil in Alabama's Avatar
Phil in Alabama is online now

Join Date: 
Apr 2002
Location: 
world of pain
Posts: 
6,489
TPC Rating: 
100% (7)
The drawback to high velocity ammo is greater wind deflection. Wind deflection is something the shooter has to compensate for, not the equipment, and it can be difficult. Minimizing wind deflection can improve scores. Not difficult to understand.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 10-14-2019, 05:15 PM
centershot243

Join Date: 
Oct 2012
Posts: 
12
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil in Alabama View Post
The drawback to high velocity ammo is greater wind deflection. Wind deflection is something the shooter has to compensate for, not the equipment, and it can be difficult. Minimizing wind deflection can improve scores. Not difficult to understand.
I'm confused by this. I always believed that the HV bullet would be deflected LESS by wind because it was subjected to it for a shorter period of time. The slower bullet would be moved further by the wind because it was subjected to the wind for a longer period of time.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 10-14-2019, 06:10 PM
jaia
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Apr 2014
Posts: 
5,929
TPC Rating: 
100% (2)
I've worked through the math, it appears that the hi-v 22lr ends up with a larger cross sectional area
than it actually has. My take is that at supersonic velocities, the air compressed against the nose of the bullet
acts as a skin or sail increasing the apparent surface area and increases the loading surface
that is acted upon by any cross wind in the flight path. No big deal though. Not hard to adjust to drift.
As long as the wind vector is consistent, so is the drift. It's predictable.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 10-14-2019, 06:18 PM
NIB's Avatar
NIB is online now
NRA Member - Click Here To Join!

Join Date: 
Mar 2009
Posts: 
3,416
TPC Rating: 
0% (0)
Quote:
Originally Posted by centershot243 View Post
I'm confused by this. I always believed that the HV bullet would be deflected LESS by wind because it was subjected to it for a shorter period of time. The slower bullet would be moved further by the wind because it was subjected to the wind for a longer period of time.
Counterintuitive isn't it?
Rimfire High Velocity is more greatly affected by Wind Drift versus Standard Velocity.
centershot243 as you said "less deflected" I believe is true where Supersonic Centerfire ammunition is concerned.

http://team40x.com/wind/page8.html

http://www.gunsmoke.com/guns/1022/22drift_cross.html
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 10-14-2019, 08:41 PM
jpickar

Join Date: 
Feb 2008
Posts: 
756
TPC Rating: 
100% (3)
Quote:
Originally Posted by centershot243 View Post
I'm confused by this. I always believed that the HV bullet would be deflected LESS by wind because it was subjected to it for a shorter period of time. The slower bullet would be moved further by the wind because it was subjected to the wind for a longer period of time.
My experience says you are right.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:48 AM.

Privacy Policy

DMCA Notice

Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 2000-2018 RimfireCentral.com
x