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Discontinued 04-09-2021 03:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sulfur-n-steel (Post 12277107)
That video of the 22 shotgun was interesting.

Questions though, what the heck is a 'shotgun license'?

Also, that 22 shotgun is basically a parlor/flobert gun. Can you buy floberts legally in the UK and shoot them?

:bthumb:

So a shotgun certificate and firearm's certificate are actually two separate documents

A shotgun certificate is actually a doddle to get all you need is a safe or secure storage. and one referee to sign you application form, then the police come to inspect you home to see if you have adequate security. in other words do you have a safe that is out of plain sight that is secured to a supporting wall.

It is actually your right as a British subject to own a shotgun without have a "good reason"

Firearms certificate is harder to get, which is why they talk of having a .22 on an SGC in the you tube video, most shooters in the UK have SGC's not so many have FAC's and after the pistol ban many people handed in their FAC's and just kept their shotguns

You have to jump through quite a few hoops to get a firearm's certificate as you need to be in a club for a minimum of 3 months or 12 visit's.
Or if you are wealthy enough and have a large plot of land, or have permission from someone with a large plot of land,

For a firearm's certificate must provide a "good reason" to posses a firearm. i.e target shooting, or Hunting. Then you have to state what you want, for instance a .22lr, a .223 and a .308 and relevant suppressor's as they are classed as a firearm in their own right they will then put these "slots" on your certificate saying that you can purchase one rifle for each slot. if you want more you need to filling in a variation form and pay a fee.

It is a major pain in the bottom, as if you buy a faulty gun and need to return it you also have to send your license back to the police to be reprinted.

With regards to .22 shot yes its a parlor type "garden gun" round often called rat shot in the uk and is very handy in barns and around livestock. However the 9mm Flobert rimfire is quite poplar here and quite often available with a suppressor,

Those two guys in the Video are simply amasing shotgunners.

Discontinued 04-09-2021 04:30 AM

Yes you can own miniature cannons on a shotgun certificate providing its a smoothbore with a bore diameter of less than two inches. and thing rifled or larger would need to go on a firearm's certificate.

My friend does naval and Napoleonic reenactment they use various muskets and flintlocks and even fire paintballs at those Pesky French targets.
There is even a miniature cannon comp where the target is a French three masted sailing ship the x ring is on the center mast

HE actually also fires the starting cannon for the London Boat race and has various celebrity's do the honors and fire the starting Gun.

I like the story about the British guy and Sausage baps, Yes London Taxi's can do an incredible amount of miles, I knew a couple that drove theirs to Finland and now use it for Weddings and events.
Little known fact under some ancient bylaw Black cab drivers are supposed to keep a bail of hay in the boot (trunk) just in case their horses need feeding...:p

Also its against the law not to have a bow and arrow in your house just in case the Saxons try to invade again.


After my wildly lucky success with home gunsmithing my CZ455 I have 1 slot left on my FAC for a .22 rimfire....I'm just not sure what to buy.....
Take a look at what we have on sale here in the UK, what would you choose?

I already have a CZ455 and a 54 modell Match Annie



https://www.guntrader.uk/Guns-For-Sa...fd21-2c23-ed84

DDickie 04-09-2021 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toomanyguns (Post 12267751)
One question I have concerns the Chunnel and how, when, and where do drivers switch driving from left side of road to right side in France.

My only experience of travelling to France by vehicle was by ferry to Calais, where the exit route from the ferry port led to the correct side of the road for Continental driving.

I assume the Chunnel will have a similar arrangement [emoji846]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

James Cottrell 04-09-2021 06:28 AM

I hope you fire those cannon's on the 5th of Nov.:cool:

rockdrill 04-09-2021 07:26 AM

Further to previous info on firearms certificates and shotgun certificates, here are some links to gov't documents on them:

Statistics on on FAC's & SGC's:
https://assets.publishing.service.go...0-hosb1820.pdf

Some definitons under UK law:

Firearm – According to the 1968 Act, a firearm means a lethal barrelled weapon of any description from which any shot, bullet or other missile with a kinetic energy of more than one joule at the muzzle of the weapon can be discharged. It includes any prohibited weapon, any component part of such a weapon and any accessory to such a weapon designed or adapted to diminish the noise or flash caused by the firing of the weapon.

Firearm certificate – The certificate lists the number, type and serial number of each weapon held and any conditions attached (a standard condition is that weapons and ammunition are held in a secure place when not in use).

Handgun – Handgun refers to the length of the firearm. Any firearm which either has a barrel less than 30 cm in length or is less than 60 cm in length overall is generally prohibited. The intention is to prohibit particularly dangerous firearms which are easy to conceal. However, the police may issue a firearm certificate enabling the possession of certain handguns of historic interest, muzzleloading pistols or handguns for the humane killing of animals.

Muzzle-loading pistol – The ammunition is loaded via the muzzle of the firearm, that is, from the open end of the gun’s barrel. They are not quick to load and therefore do not pose the same threat as some other types of guns.

Registered firearms dealer (RFD) – A dealer is defined in the 1968 Act as a person or a corporate body who, by way of trade or business: manufactures, sells, transfers, repairs, tests or proves firearms or ammunition to which section 1 of this Act applies, or shotguns; or sells or transfers air weapons. Firearms dealers are not authorised to trade in prohibited weapons without the Secretary of State’s authority.

Rifle – A rifle has the meaning assigned to it under section 57(1) of the 1968 Act. A rifle has spiral grooves in the barrel, uses bullets as ammunition and is typically used for target shooting or for the control of vermin.

Shotgun – A smooth-bore gun (not being an air gun) which: (i) has a barrel not less than 24 inches in length and does not have any barrel with a bore exceeding 2 inches in diameter; (ii) either has no magazine or has a non-detachable magazine incapable of holding more than two cartridges; and (iii) is not a revolver gun. Other smooth-bore guns may require a firearm certificate. It is, with certain statutory exceptions, an offence for a person to possess, purchase, or acquire any shotgun without holding a shotgun certificate. A shotgun uses shotgun cartridges containing lead shot as ammunition and is typically used for clay pigeon shooting or for the control of vermin.

Shotgun certificate – The certificate specifies the description of the shotguns including, if known, the identification number of the guns.

Section 1 shotgun – Contains a magazine holding more than two rounds. This is held on a firearm certificate.

Section 2 shotgun – May have a magazine restricted to no more than two rounds. This is held on a shotgun certificate.

Sound moderator – An accessory to a lethal barrelled weapon or a prohibited weapon designed to diminish the noise or flash caused by firing the weapon.


A major difference between the shotgun certificate (SGC) and a firearms certificate (FAC) is that with the SGC you can own as many shotguns as you want as long as you have safe storage. The FAC requires you to specify calibre, type and reason for them, which when you understand the system is quite straightforward in practice.

sulfur-n-steel 04-09-2021 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Discontinued (Post 12277357)
So a shotgun certificate and firearm's certificate are actually two separate documents

A shotgun certificate is actually a doddle to get all you need is a safe or secure storage. and one referee to sign you application form, then the police come to inspect you home to see if you have adequate security. in other words do you have a safe that is out of plain sight that is secured to a supporting wall.

It is actually your right as a British subject to own a shotgun without have a "good reason"

Firearms certificate is harder to get, which is why they talk of having a .22 on an SGC in the you tube video, most shooters in the UK have SGC's not so many have FAC's and after the pistol ban many people handed in their FAC's and just kept their shotguns

You have to jump through quite a few hoops to get a firearm's certificate as you need to be in a club for a minimum of 3 months or 12 visit's.
Or if you are wealthy enough and have a large plot of land, or have permission from someone with a large plot of land,

For a firearm's certificate must provide a "good reason" to posses a firearm. i.e target shooting, or Hunting. Then you have to state what you want, for instance a .22lr, a .223 and a .308 and relevant suppressor's as they are classed as a firearm in their own right they will then put these "slots" on your certificate saying that you can purchase one rifle for each slot. if you want more you need to filling in a variation form and pay a fee.

It is a major pain in the bottom, as if you buy a faulty gun and need to return it you also have to send your license back to the police to be reprinted.

With regards to .22 shot yes its a parlor type "garden gun" round often called rat shot in the uk and is very handy in barns and around livestock. However the 9mm Flobert rimfire is quite poplar here and quite often available with a suppressor,

Those two guys in the Video are simply amasing shotgunners.

Interesting.

So question, have you ever been turned down for a purchase?

Once you have made a purchase and own a shotgun or rifle, does that mean you should'nt be turned down for any further purchases?

Is there a maximum you can purchase, or purchase over a period of time?

Do they ever insist on coming back to inspect your storage?

Can you legally modify your firearms? lengthen, shorten, etc.?

Are there walk in gun shops, or is all buying done mail order?

sulfur-n-steel 04-09-2021 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockdrill (Post 12277459)
Further to previous info on firearms certificates and shotgun certificates, here are some links to gov't documents on them:

Statistics on on FAC's & SGC's:
https://assets.publishing.service.go...0-hosb1820.pdf

Some definitons under UK law:

Firearm – According to the 1968 Act, a firearm means a lethal barrelled weapon of any description from which any shot, bullet or other missile with a kinetic energy of more than one joule at the muzzle of the weapon can be discharged. It includes any prohibited weapon, any component part of such a weapon and any accessory to such a weapon designed or adapted to diminish the noise or flash caused by the firing of the weapon.

Firearm certificate – The certificate lists the number, type and serial number of each weapon held and any conditions attached (a standard condition is that weapons and ammunition are held in a secure place when not in use).

Handgun – Handgun refers to the length of the firearm. Any firearm which either has a barrel less than 30 cm in length or is less than 60 cm in length overall is generally prohibited. The intention is to prohibit particularly dangerous firearms which are easy to conceal. However, the police may issue a firearm certificate enabling the possession of certain handguns of historic interest, muzzleloading pistols or handguns for the humane killing of animals.

Muzzle-loading pistol – The ammunition is loaded via the muzzle of the firearm, that is, from the open end of the gun’s barrel. They are not quick to load and therefore do not pose the same threat as some other types of guns.

Registered firearms dealer (RFD) – A dealer is defined in the 1968 Act as a person or a corporate body who, by way of trade or business: manufactures, sells, transfers, repairs, tests or proves firearms or ammunition to which section 1 of this Act applies, or shotguns; or sells or transfers air weapons. Firearms dealers are not authorised to trade in prohibited weapons without the Secretary of State’s authority.

Rifle – A rifle has the meaning assigned to it under section 57(1) of the 1968 Act. A rifle has spiral grooves in the barrel, uses bullets as ammunition and is typically used for target shooting or for the control of vermin.

Shotgun – A smooth-bore gun (not being an air gun) which: (i) has a barrel not less than 24 inches in length and does not have any barrel with a bore exceeding 2 inches in diameter; (ii) either has no magazine or has a non-detachable magazine incapable of holding more than two cartridges; and (iii) is not a revolver gun. Other smooth-bore guns may require a firearm certificate. It is, with certain statutory exceptions, an offence for a person to possess, purchase, or acquire any shotgun without holding a shotgun certificate. A shotgun uses shotgun cartridges containing lead shot as ammunition and is typically used for clay pigeon shooting or for the control of vermin.

Shotgun certificate – The certificate specifies the description of the shotguns including, if known, the identification number of the guns.

Section 1 shotgun – Contains a magazine holding more than two rounds. This is held on a firearm certificate.

Section 2 shotgun – May have a magazine restricted to no more than two rounds. This is held on a shotgun certificate.

Sound moderator – An accessory to a lethal barrelled weapon or a prohibited weapon designed to diminish the noise or flash caused by firing the weapon.


A major difference between the shotgun certificate (SGC) and a firearms certificate (FAC) is that with the SGC you can own as many shotguns as you want as long as you have safe storage. The FAC requires you to specify calibre, type and reason for them, which when you understand the system is quite straightforward in practice.

Nice info!

So where/how do you get 2 round magazines?

Are they just regular magazines that are modified when imported to only hold 2 rounds?

LtCrunch 04-09-2021 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Discontinued (Post 12277371)
After my wildly lucky success with home gunsmithing my CZ455 I have 1 slot left on my FAC for a .22 rimfire....I'm just not sure what to buy.....
Take a look at what we have on sale here in the UK, what would you choose?

I already have a CZ455 and a 54 modell Match Annie

Hey Eddie, won't you have to put that new 10/22 you've been awarded on your FAC?

The cannon segue was fun! Quick story, we figured out a showy blank load for our 2-3/8" bore. 1 ounce of black powder with a couple of shredded pads of 0000 steel wool and then a rag on top for wadding. That's what the picture I posted shows. Makes a heckuva ball of fire and then leaves a burning rag about 20 yards out.

One day at work it was afternoon and we were all having a beer and decided to torch off the cannon. So we rolled it out of the warehouse, loaded up, lit the fuse and stood back. Right as it went off two Hispanic kids were coming by on skateboards. Next thing we knew they were both facedown flat on the ground....they thought it was a drive by :D

Cheerios,

Frank

toomanyguns 04-09-2021 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LtCrunch (Post 12277729)
Hey Eddie, won't you have to put that new 10/22 you've been awarded on your FAC?

The cannon segue was fun! Quick story, we figured out a showy blank load for our 2-3/8" bore. 1 ounce of black powder with a couple of shredded pads of 0000 steel wool and then a rag on top for wadding. That's what the picture I posted shows. Makes a heckuva ball of fire and then leaves a burning rag about 20 yards out.

One day at work it was afternoon and we were all having a beer and decided to torch off the cannon. So we rolled it out of the warehouse, loaded up, lit the fuse and stood back. Right as it went off two Hispanic kids were coming by on skateboards. Next thing we knew they were both facedown flat on the ground....they thought it was a drive by :D

Cheerios,

Frank


LOL

Where do you work? I would come of of retirement to work there. ;) :bthumb:

LtCrunch 04-09-2021 02:07 PM

2 Attachment(s)
I own a small mom and pop mining supply company run out of a back alley warehouse in a sketchy neighborhood west of Denver Toomanyguns. Our company motto is, "Make money and have fun!"

I'll put you on the waiting list but it'll be awhile, our turnover is virtually non-existent ;)

Pictures from a Saturday warehouse air rifle/rimfire shoot.

Frank

gcrank1 04-09-2021 02:43 PM

When the job is so good you would pay to work there ;)

Cattleman30 04-09-2021 03:10 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Al the Infidel (Post 12277257)
Twist rate?

Al. The barrel liner has a gain twist with a final rate of one turn in ten feet. The liner is 3/8” thick and made of 4140 while the outer barrel is 1018 steel. This tube within a tube design results in great strength.

A popular American pastime is groundhog hunting with a Coehorn mortar. This 1/2 scale fires half filled twist top beer cans.
Attachment 252335
Success rates are low for some reason. Perhaps testing the newer lots of Coors light....

sulfur-n-steel 04-09-2021 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LtCrunch (Post 12277833)
I own a small mom and pop mining supply company run out of a back alley warehouse in a sketchy neighborhood west of Denver Toomanyguns. Our company motto is, "Make money and have fun!"

I'll put you on the waiting list but it'll be awhile, our turnover is virtually non-existent ;)

Pictures from a Saturday warehouse air rifle/rimfire shoot.

Frank

I dig the model planes hanging in the shop :bthumb:

Al the Infidel 04-09-2021 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cattleman30 (Post 12277905)
Al. The barrel liner has a gain twist with a final rate of one turn in ten feet
Success rates are low for some reason. Perhaps testing the newer lots of Coors light....

Perhaps ammo that would detonate upon impact would raise the kill ratio? A thought. :rolleyes:

Discontinued 04-10-2021 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LtCrunch (Post 12277729)
Hey Eddie, won't you have to put that new 10/22 you've been awarded on your FAC?

The cannon segue was fun! Quick story, we figured out a showy blank load for our 2-3/8" bore. 1 ounce of black powder with a couple of shredded pads of 0000 steel wool and then a rag on top for wadding. That's what the picture I posted shows. Makes a heckuva ball of fire and then leaves a burning rag about 20 yards out.

One day at work it was afternoon and we were all having a beer and decided to torch off the cannon. So we rolled it out of the warehouse, loaded up, lit the fuse and stood back. Right as it went off two Hispanic kids were coming by on skateboards. Next thing we knew they were both facedown flat on the ground....they thought it was a drive by :D

Cheerios,

Frank

Duh You are right Frank :p

I will have that slot filled by my gifted 10/22 my mind is going and im not passed 50 yet although it is looming.

And I cannot deny that 10/22's are a great deal of fun I'm super curious how it will shoot totally stock. now I'm wondering what scope if any to add as I like open sights



Interestingly in the UK we call them open sights and you chaps call them iron sights


Once that slot is filled by my new to me 10/22 I can apply for a variation but last time I checked it was around £20 but without that empty slot I cannot purchase another rifle until my renewal, then I can add extra weapons free of charge.

Shotguns certs have no slot system, you can have as many as you can fit in you gun safe just have to email or write to the police to say to acquires serial number xyz123 also the same applies for rifles you have 7 days to inform the police of acquiring or disposing of a weapon.

Another quirk is that anyone is allowed to posses shotgun shells or a shotgun for 72 hours provided they have a copy of the certificate holders S.G.C

Possession of rifle ammo without an FAC almost always ends in prison sentence. Apparently it is an offense to posses ammunition no on your slot i.e. i couldn't technically use or posses Mrs discontinued Ak103 straight pull. but as im a qualified range officer I'm exempt which is rather nice.
guns belonging to a club do not have any restriction's except that you must be a club member or visitor.

I'm also qualified for high muzzle energy and moving target as well as military ranges.

To answer some other questions there is no upper limit on how many rifles/long barreled pistols or shotguns provided your gun safe has adequate storage.

There is an understanding that anymore than 21 guns would require you to have an monitored intruder alarm. which doesn't sound as bad as you would think as with modern technology you can monitor it yourself via mobile phone.

if you need to up your storage the police would need to inspect the new cabinet although I know that some F.E.O's (firearms enquiry officers) are happy to have you take a photo and email it in. provided you are already a certificate holder.

Also we would not ever be subjected to ammo shortages due to the fact that most FAC's only allow 1,000 rimfire to be possessed, unless you have a reason or apply for a variation. When I ran the club i had to have separate FAC and was allowed to poses 100,000 rimfire and 30,000 centrefire cartridges.

I love cannons I have one too although somewhat smaller.

https://canary.contestimg.wish.com/a...e7-1-large.jpg

I'm also into RC as I see in your nice photographs. I especially like the Corsair I made one myself from a converted foam rubber band plane.

https://i.imgur.com/03VwDJh.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/HtPbWi5.jpg

I used to design my own as well, I'm a frustrated Spitfire pilot born 50 years too late

my current project is a Paul Guillows flying machine rubber band plane i also converted to RC

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6417LG7qlCY

Just waiting for a windless day when I'm not stuck at work...always calm on weekdays never Saturday.
I was also out yesterday with an old friend driving our RC pan cars, I stupidly put in a 46,000kv (46,000 rpm @10volts) brushless motor in that pan car and its actually quite dangerous now, I'm guessing close to 70 mph, if I can drive it without it "donuting"

https://i.imgur.com/l8klIIR.jpg

Note the Leupold Sticker on the bonnet


I'm really into old RC transmitters I prefer AM/FM to this newfangled digital 2.4ghz i just had to buy the Futaba Bionic gold it was unused still boxed for £30 on ebay. N.B we cannot mail order and pressure bearing parts for firearms i.e. not barrels or receivers .

What is it about RC and shooting? I was on an RC plane forum for many years and most of the people there where also shooters, it became apparent when people mentioned that used bullet heads and shot to ballast their model planes, we all discovered that we were into shooting too!

On a more morose note,

I was deeply saddened to hear of the Death of the Duke of Edinburgh, he was a great man who served in WW2 as a naval officer The duke supported British shooting, the flags will be flying at half mast all over the country and no doubt at Bisley too as he was our patron for the many shooting organisations and I feel for her Majesty at this difficult time.

The Duke of Edinburgh awards scheme is brilliant, my school friend even did air pistol shooting as a component of the awards scheme which has helped countless young people all over the world.

He was a keen wildfowler right until the end!

https://basc.org.uk/obituary-his-roy...prince-philip/


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