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-   -   Is the bridge burned? (https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=673945)

JTPinTX 04-19-2016 04:46 PM

Is the bridge burned?
I know there was a nasty thread on suppressors (I read it), and a vote taken back in 2012. They were banished from Super Stock at that time. And my intention really is not to open any old wounds, but for the life of me I just can't get my mind around a device designed to protect hearing, knocking an otherwise textbook SS rifle out of qualification for the SS forums and games.

Public education on suppressors and the benefits associated with them has come a long way. State after state has passed legislation making them legal for hunting. In the last few years, and the last year especially, suppressor ownership in the US has skyrocketed. More and more places consider suppressed shooting "polite" shooting. It is not just a looks thing, or a cool thing, a fad. The process is not cheap, and the folks that are buying these things are buying them for life. I have $1000 in tax stamps alone, that doesn't include the cans themselves. They aren't going to go away in 5 years, because for the most part a suppressor is a lifetime purchase. There are real world benefits to them, not just for yourself, but for the people whom you shoot around. Like your kids and grand-kids.

Everything I shoot now except for pistols, I shoot suppressed. Whether that be target shooting, hunting, plinking, practical practice, LR steel, whatever. They are on my rimfire rifles, my LR centerfire rifles, my hunting rifles, you name it.

Super Stock used to be my home here on RFC, but my rifles are no longer welcome here. Rifles that back in the day qualified for many of the games here, can no longer be shot in them. The argument has been made, "Just take the suppressor off for the games." That doesn't work. Everyone here knows how finicky these things can be to fine tune in to a specific load. To those people I would like to say, just try unscrewing 6 oz weight off the end of your barrel and see how well your tune and zero stays put. The answer is, it doesn't. It totally changes the whole character of the rifle. My rifles are tuned for the suppressors, I don't shoot them without them. Not to mention I didn't spend $525 and wait 5 months for a 22 RF can so I could leave it at home and not shoot it.

I could really understand if it was a device designed to make it "tactical", or turn it into an Ultimate, or somehow cheat the SS system. But it isn't, not by a long shot. It is a hearing protection device, that is it. My 10/22's with the Spectre II on them are a heck of a lot more "Super Stock" than many of the rifles that have qualified in the games. And I guess for someone who has never shot subsonic 22 RF through a suppressor, they just don't get it. But it is so quiet, I just giggle and giggle every time I pull the trigger. It never gets old. The loudest noise is that bolt clacking shut every time. You can hear the bullet hit the target.

Anyways, I don't expect a vote, or a rule change, or whatever. I realize that for many places, change is very difficult. For many people, systems, forums, businesses, or whatever it is easier to die than to change. I really expect no different. But I did want you guys to know why, when I come back here to RFC, my home is not SS anymore. That makes me sad, because once upon a time I had friends in here. I guess I will find a new home here on RFC somewhere, just not sure where that is yet.

PEASHOOTER67 04-19-2016 05:45 PM

Start a full time supressor thread and be the moderator for it.

All things suppressors.

Faith, Honor, Family

Blackwolfe 04-19-2016 07:15 PM

I was kind of thinking along the same lines. Why not have a Super Stock Suppressed category?

PEASHOOTER67 04-19-2016 07:16 PM

What he said^^^^

Faith, Honor, Family

PEASHOOTER67 04-19-2016 07:18 PM

I just recently discovered suppressors. Trying to learn all I can.

Faith, Honor, Family

Vincent 04-19-2016 08:42 PM

I happen to be the Moderator not to mention the guy that STARTED SuperStock and the one that tried to get Suppressors made legal.

I got out voted. Badly. My vote counts as one just like everyone else. Ain't life grand? No pulling rank to get one's way. No "This is my ball and I am going home!" Not even "This is a really good idea and even "Your lawn mower is required to have one....by law" or "more states allow them everyday"

Just Yes or No. Simple huh. On a first re vote time alone could be enough to call a vote but let's stick our toe in the water and see how warm it is?

I am shocked that is 4 years ago. Nothing says we could not have another vote but that USUALLY takes a bit of discussion to insure that we have a reason.

I am all for another vote. I have a couple other guys here that would like that.

Any of you guys for or against? Let's hear it.

As usual if it comes to vote you will have had to have had some constructive part in SuperStock, SuperStock Bolt and/or SuperSport over the last 10 years. No need for it to be RECENT:D:bthumb:

By the way Suppressors ARE legal in SuperSport Forum! If you have a barrel with muzzle larger than .750" you already have a place to post. http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...psdbe0d614.gif

crackedcornish 04-19-2016 09:29 PM

sorry but until everybody is allowed to have one, I will still have to vote NO

PEASHOOTER67 04-19-2016 09:39 PM

I don't see a problem with it.
Suppressors don't add any advantage in accuracy over not having one.

I fail to see the problem not that I'd have a vote. I just don't see why not allow them.

Faith, Honor, Family

lv2fish 04-19-2016 09:50 PM

I'm ok with it. No big deal.
I see it helping vendors on RFC sell a few more cans if they offer them.
I dont own a can myself, but I shoot my friends guns with them.

Vincent 04-19-2016 09:56 PM

I would like to point out that not every one is allowed to have a 10/22 or any other semi auto for that matter. Our site can and is seen world wide and in many places what we know as a SuperStock rifle would not be allowed at all so there are likely places in the world where Suppressors are quite legal while semi autos are not.

It is also not a matter if it can add an advantage or not. There is not any competition in SuperStock so that would mean nothing. Even if we were to add Competition at a later date (not likely in our lives) the game or match owner could simply write suppressors out of his or her game or match.

We tend to think in absolutes and few things truly are.:eek: :rolleyes::D http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g2...psdbe0d614.gif

Vincent 04-20-2016 12:35 AM


Originally Posted by lv2fish (Post 6291113)
I'm ok with it. No big deal.
I see it helping vendors on RFC sell a few more cans if they offer them.
I dont own a can myself, but I shoot my friends guns with them.

Kinda how I see it. The thing is just a MUFFLER!! I have never understood the big deal. When you think about it a firearm is a one cycle (one stroke) internal combustion engine. No fly wheel or connecting rod needed due to being a one stroke where the "piston" goes out the muzzle. Virtually ALL I.C.E.s, even in many forms of racing, are required to have mufflers.

I also never really understood the appeal to have a suppressor until I moved to TN and got to shoot a 10/22 (it would have qualified as a SuperStock except we did not have SuperStock then) and a Ruger KMK678GC MKII Slabside and it immediately made sense. I also understood why some countries practically require them. Less noise is good for shooters as individuals and as a sport. It is hard to argue that more noise is a good thing at any level.

If I could afford it I think most or all of my 22lrs at least would be suppressed but I can not afford even one at this point with out selling something else.

Now we have had SuperStock members that shoot there rifles with thread protectors and no suppressor. Most of our games are group oriented so sighting in in may or may not be needed. As for function other than making the guns dirtier I have not seen the suppressed guns I have shot needing much special tuning for the can.

JTPinTX 04-20-2016 08:55 AM

My point here is not to try and cause a big stink. I know that 4 years ago the vote was overwhelmingly no. I know Vincent fought for it. But I also know that 4 years ago suppressors were a thing very few people had access to or much knowledge about, and now quite the opposite is true.

I am trying to limit my posts on this and not appear that I am forcing the issue. SS can do what it wants, what the members feel is best. I can go somewhere else to play if that is the way it is, no hard feelings.

As far as everyone having access to them, everyone does. The background check process is pretty much the same as buying a firearm. Except that you have it done twice. Once when you file your form-4 with the ATF, and once when you fill out the 4473 (the same one everyone fills out whenever you purchase any firearm). What is different is the price of the can, and the $200 tax stamp you have to pay to get it. My Spectre II cost me $525 all in. You can get into the 22RF can game for about $500 +/-. Cheaper if you want to build one form-1. So it isn't restricted, anyone who can buy a gun can have one. You just have to do your research, jump through the right hoops, and pay your money. Just like anything else. There is a big mis-perception that only "certain people" can own suppressors, SBR's, SBS's. That is just not true. The process is a PITA, but it is not restrictive.

EDIT to add: Actually I mis-spoke just a bit. You do have to be 21 to be approved for NFA items, so it is like buying a pistol, rather than a rifle or shotgun. So it is more restrictive than a 22 rifle in that sense. I just wanted to be clear on that.

Now my other thing is, I don't see the need for another forum. Part of the problem here at RFC is there are too many sub-forums. Go look at 75% of them, and they are dying from lack of posts. Here in SS, you go half-way down the front page and you are into posts from Feb. Same in Tactical 10/22. Same in a whole bunch of the sub-forums. It didn't used to be that way here. I liked it when there was lots of activity, and you could come here and the threads were always moving. So honestly, if SS doesn't want suppressors then most likely I will find one of the forums with the most traffic that will accept me, and go there.

1911CCW 04-20-2016 09:16 AM

I too have been doing a lot of suppressor research. Most of it pertains to the rimfire category but I am also looking at multi-use as well due to the cost and wait time. I would certainly be in for a vote!

JTPinTX 04-20-2016 09:33 AM

2009, here it is a total SS, and posted up in this forum as such:


Taken this morning, and now it is not:


JTPinTX 04-20-2016 09:51 AM

I edited this post so as to not distract from the current topic, I realize I had taken it off course. I apologize for that. If you have questions about 22 suppressors, go downstairs to the NFA forum, and Peashooter has a good thread on it. I posted my thoughts in there.

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