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-   -   Full Auto 1022 (https://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=595506)

elohssa63 10-01-2015 08:36 PM

Full Auto 1022
 
A guy at the range today was shooting a full auto 1022. It would empty a 10 round mag in less than a second. I asked what alterations were done to make it full auto, and he said the bolt and trigger were different from a stock 1022. I had no idea such an animal existed. When it fired, it sounded like someone ripping canvas. What do you guys know about this 1022? Thanks

Dr Heckel 10-01-2015 08:50 PM

Look up a Norrell trigger pack for the 10/22. It's a full auto trigger group that also uses a special counter weighted bolt that prevents "bolt bounce"....

http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/...pshmvmqyj8.jpg

Maricopa Smitty 10-01-2015 08:55 PM

I ran into one at the range last year. The guy shooting it said it was a commercial model (aftermarket, not Ruger) intended for a Georgia (?) LE agency's female officers. It sounded like the idea didn't pan out and he got his from a Class III dealer for a really good price.

No idea what the internal mods were, but that gun ran really well considering the overall reliability of rimfire ammo.

elohssa63 10-01-2015 09:02 PM

O.K. guys, thanks. This is a new one on me. :bthumb:

dufferDave 10-01-2015 09:16 PM

As if
 
As if it wasn't hard enough already to keep a 22lr rifle fed.....

timberbeast 10-01-2015 09:22 PM

Sounds like it would be a blast to shoot. :Blasting_

NeauxGo 10-01-2015 09:56 PM

I ran across a video of one in action recently. I had to skip to the action sequences. :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_RoMXz3Opg

chillypepper 10-01-2015 10:19 PM

A friend of mine (07, SOT) has a couple FA 10/22's. His are all converted to open bolt.

ivan 10-01-2015 10:49 PM

Having shot some FA this past weekend (1919 in 308, 9mm Uzi, M16 in both 9mm and 556) and having shot some in the past (American 180, M16, FNC, FAL, G3/HK91, M14, MAC10 in 45), I can say that it is a LOT of fun. At artificially inflated prices and the cost of ammo, I'm content to shoot other folks' stuff once in a blue moon.

The American 180 is a blast - 177 rounds of 22lr, sounds like an angry little buzz saw when you do a mag dump... and it takes a *long* time to go thru 177 rounds on FA...

Chard 10-01-2015 11:24 PM

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...0/DSC00284.jpg

Yours truly with a Norrell 10/22 suppressed. Considered one of the best out there.

I was at a machine gun shoot that was open to the public, United States Shooting Academy, Tulsa OK.

Muzzle of a GE mini gun just to my right.

parshooter 10-02-2015 02:21 PM

.
The current configuration of mine. I posted pics of the internals here.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...ps5e0b23a2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...psblyfyi00.jpg

98_1LE 10-02-2015 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlysAlot (Post 5495817)
The last one I saw was north of 25K... http://www.onlythebestfirearms.com/nfa1.html (scroll down)

Vito always wants too much. They don't pop up often but I think 13-15 is what they trade for. Let me check MGPG.

http://machinegunpriceguide.com/html/us_subguns_4.html

glocker17 10-06-2015 12:35 AM

Quote:

I ran into one at the range last year. The guy shooting it said it was a commercial model (aftermarket, not Ruger) intended for a Georgia (?) LE agency's female officers. It sounded like the idea didn't pan out and he got his from a Class III dealer for a really good price.

No idea what the internal mods were, but that gun ran really well considering the overall reliability of rimfire ammo.
Sounds sketchy, but yes Ruger never made any. Story doesn't sound right as if he bought it from a SOT and he isn't an SOT then it was pre 86' and not real cheap. LE Agencies don't buy pre 86' guns either.

Test_Engineer 10-08-2015 02:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Heckel (Post 5495733)
Look up a Norrell trigger pack for the 10/22. It's a full auto trigger group that also uses a special counter weighted bolt that prevents "bolt bounce"....

http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/...pshmvmqyj8.jpg

Do all/most full autos use a counter weighted bolt like this?

Seems like there'd be a good market for bolts like this among "race gun" enthusiasts. Never have seen any offered though. Just assorted types of "bolt buffers".

titleIIredneck 10-08-2015 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glocker17 (Post 5498855)
Sounds sketchy, but yes Ruger never made any. Story doesn't sound right as if he bought it from a SOT and he isn't an SOT then it was pre 86' and not real cheap. LE Agencies don't buy pre 86' guns either.

Back in the 80's amt lightnings were a clone of 1022 rugers and alot were converted to full auto for use in kentucky and a few other places for prison use. May have been one of them. John norell made 90% of the fa 1022 out there and i belive powder springs as well as a few others made some but most were the amt versions. A few form 1 ones are out there but they are registered recivers not trigger packs.

98_1LE 10-08-2015 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Test_Engineer (Post 5500454)
Do all/most full autos use a counter weighted bolt like this?

No. Most machine guns are either closed bolt locked breech (e.g. M16), or open bolt blowback (e.g. Thompson, Mac/M11, Uzi).

The 10/22 kit is unique that is it closed bolt blowback operated. The weight in the bolt is designed to prevent the bolt from bouncing, by slamming into the bolt just after the bolt closes. This is to make sure the bolt is closed when the hammer comes forward. If the bolt is not closed, the hammer won't get a full/good strike.

22/silencer 10-11-2015 01:17 PM

The Norrell trigger pack does lock the bolt closed , With the detent in the front of housing does it not?

98_1LE 10-11-2015 06:17 PM

By detent do you mean the silver lever stickup up from the trigger group?

I'm not sure, but believe that would be the disconnector, basically the switch that releases the hammer when the bolt is fully closes.

parshooter 10-11-2015 06:55 PM

.
I believe he is referring to the spring-loaded ball detent next to the ejector.

There is a matching slot for it in the bolt.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...r/IMG_0533.jpg

Vincent 10-11-2015 07:13 PM

Years ago a new manufacturer of 10/22 accessories sent me his best hammer/sear combo to test for him. Both hammer and sear were adjustable! I was using my 1976 Carbine that was pretty much stock. This was about 2005.

I was at the range to mainly shoot another bolt action project and had the place to myself. It started raining and then turned into a deluge. Under the steel roof it was as almost unbelievably loud. I figured I would wait it out but would try the trigger.

Not really aiming I pointed it down range and touched the trigger. Ziip! "What the heck?" I said out loud. 9 rounds and a stoppage so fast I could not get my finger off the trigger. Loaded another 10 rounds. Zip! all 10 down range. I was a little paranoid but I could not hear anything else due to very hard rain, figured "Why not he wants me to test this thing".

I took the trigger assy apart and adjusted the hammer AND the sear as far out as I could. ZIP!! 10 rounds. Next one was 9. Another 9. Then 10. And so on. I think if I had the mag spring turned tighter it would have done 10 every time.

Well I could not stand it so I shot several hundred rounds until the rain let up and it was great. The cycle rate was unbelievable!! I could not shoot a burst in a normal way but if I just "slapped" the trigger it was 3-4 rounds. I mean that as the very quickest way I could touch the trigger without actually squeezing it. Normal trigger application meant empty mag no matter how quick I tried to lift my finger.

I am NOT a believer in the 22 lr as a defense (or offense) round but one of these would be devastating at 100 yards and less. It was easy to keep all ten rounds into a 12" circle at 100 yards even in a driving rain and that was well under 1 second as far as I can tell.

Being paranoid about legal issues I took the rifle apart and the hammer went into the trunk and the sear into the glove box. I even mailed them back to him in separate shipping envelopes. He got the back and put them in his rifle and got a crisp 1.5-2.5 lb trigger:confused::confused: He said he tried his hardest and could not make it full auto (I think he was secretly jealous:D:D).

We started comparing things and my early trigger housing was VERY different. His was crisply molded and mine looked fat and almost organic. Turns out the center to center on the holes in the housing is different in the old style housing. Since then others have reported several different makers hammers and sears getting doubles and triples in old housings

If you have an old rifle from the 60's or at least mid 70's beware just buying new parts for them. Either have your whole assy reworked by someone that knows what they are doing oe get a newer housing because the BATFE frowns on ANY firearm that fires more than one round with one pull of the trigger. They even prosecuted a gunsmith that had a customer double barrel shotgun with worn parts that was firing both barrels!!:mad::mad:

At the same time they announced his arrest my gunsmith friend had a 10 gauge double in his shop that was doing the same thing. I watched him shoot it the first time and thought "Man does that thing throw a lot of shot downrange!!" while he was thinking "Wow that SOB kicks like a freaking mule!!":D:D Of course we asked a couple friends to test fire it! :rolleyes::D:D The reaction was always the same. At first they were stunned a 10 kicked that hard. Then they opened it and TWO empties came out! :eek::mad::mad::D:D

By the way the gunsmith won his case but it ruined him as it took all the money his shop was worth and then some to beat the case against him.

Be very careful if you decide to screw around with your 10/22!!

parshooter 10-11-2015 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent (Post 5503339)
...
I am NOT a believer in the 22 lr as a defense (or offense) round but one of these would be devastating at 100 yards and less. It was easy to keep all ten rounds into a 12" circle at 100 yards even in a driving rain and that was well under 1 second as far as I can tell. ...

I've had more than one 10/22 project do double and triple tap bursts when the springs were too light. Replacement of those solved the issue, at least for me.

Regarding the American 180:
The A180 was adopted by the Utah Department of Corrections to arm prison guards.

Despite the relatively low power of the .22 LR round, testing demonstrated that automatic fire could penetrate even concrete and bulletproof vests from cumulative damage. However, the target would have to remain still for an improbable amount of time to allow the cumulative damage to amass in the same area to achieve this.


Random YouTube video of one being fired.

22/silencer 10-12-2015 12:12 AM

[QUOTE=98_1LE;5503304]By detent do you mean the silver lever stickup up from the trigger group?

The spring detent, it slows the bolt down, and locks it shut. Also should be adjustable. on the other side of the sear trip lever as in picture of parshooter.

parshooter 10-12-2015 01:06 AM

[QUOTE=22/silencer;5503700]
Quote:

Originally Posted by 98_1LE (Post 5503304)
By detent do you mean the silver lever stickup up from the trigger group?

The spring detent, it slows the bolt down, and locks it shut. Also should be adjustable. on the other side of the sear trip lever as in picture of parshooter.

I refer to this as a "ball detent." It fits into the slot cut into the bolt and, yes, does "lock it shut" somewhat.

Or were you referring to something else?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...ps2njfadqz.jpg

98_1LE 10-12-2015 07:55 AM

I stand corrected, thank you.

22/silencer 10-12-2015 09:48 AM

i stand corrected. it was my understanding that the detent was adjustable with an allen screw in the bottem of the hole. so it could be adjusted to run with a supperrsor or not.


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