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Trigger device, fire when squeezed and released

26K views 18 replies 16 participants last post by  Acer Ace 
#1 ·
I recently saw a video from the 2016 SHOT show which was profiling the new Fostech trigger assembly for the AR-15 which allows the rifle to fire when squeezing AND releasing the trigger. They have ATF approval for it.

That got me thinking back to the early to mid 1990's when I saw a Ruger 10/22 rifle which had a device mounted in the trigger guard which created the same function. It was thin blued steel and if I remember correctly, it followed the trigger guard up behind the trigger and had a small tang which wedged up behind the trigger. I am not sure of the mechanics of this but it did allow the gun to fire upon squeezing and releasing the trigger, effectively doubling the rate of fire.

This was pre Internet "e-commerce" days so it was likely mail order. I never saw it again and wondered if perhaps the ATF decided to regulate it. There were no springs, screws, adjusters or anything else, just a one piece thin steel device that snapped into the trigger guard and fit along the guard, wrapping up behind the trigger.

Has anyone else heard of this?
 
#4 ·
Retrax... It was the HellFire Trigger. I had one on my 10/22 in the 90s. It would allow incredible rates of fire, until it wore a groove in the aluminum trigger. I quit using it because it was cutting into my trigger blade badly. I looked for a steel replacement trigger, but nothing was available.

I remember one New Years Eve, when everyone was shooting at midnight, I stepped outside and let off a full burst from a Ramline 30 magazine. It was dead quiet. I had a second Ramline 30 loaded up, and did it again. It was quiet for about 2 minutes, then everyone started shooting again. The HellFire simulated full auto rate of fire. It was fun while it lasted. I still have both Ramline 30s, the instructions and the little tab from the HellFire(somewhere in a box), but the piece of spring steel that wrapped inside the trigger guard to hold the tab, is long gone.
 
#15 ·
Retrax... It was the HellFire Trigger. I had one on my 10/22 in the 90s. It would allow incredible rates of fire, until it wore a groove in the aluminum trigger. I quit using it because it was cutting into my trigger blade badly. I looked for a steel replacement trigger, but nothing was available.

I remember one New Years Eve, when everyone was shooting at midnight, I stepped outside and let off a full burst from a Ramline 30 magazine. It was dead quiet. I had a second Ramline 30 loaded up, and did it again. It was quiet for about 2 minutes, then everyone started shooting again. The HellFire simulated full auto rate of fire. It was fun while it lasted. I still have both Ramline 30s, the instructions and the little tab from the HellFire(somewhere in a box), but the piece of spring steel that wrapped inside the trigger guard to hold the tab, is long gone.
I still have one in its original package.
 
#6 ·
They do not make the HellFire anymore. There may be a similar product but I'm unaware of it.

There is a device called the BMF Activator. Its a crank that bumps the trigger 4 times for one revolution of the crank. It is a legal device because the rifle still only fires once per trigger pull. You can not however legally modify it to use a device to actuate the crank, such as an electric drill.

I have 2 BMF Activators, new in box, but have never used them.
 
#9 · (Edited)
I think I have one of the 'gadgets' you're asking about. Don't remember if I ever even tried it. Still new in the package. I use to sell at gumshoes and I remember getting from a guy selling them from the tables next to me. Guess I need to dig it out and try it or sell it.

Okay, just looked for it and it was laying right on top of my reloading bench. It isn't the hellfire, it's called the 'TAC Trigger's. I opened the package and it's basically a piece that mounts on the bottom of the trigger guard via set screw. Has a couple of flat tin pieces that supposed make it possible to 'float' the trigger. I guess it makes for rapid fire. No time to mess with it now, maybe next spring I can get outside with it.
 
#12 ·
Any type of electronic trigger will probably get you in hot water with the Bureau of no fun.

As for all this full auto stuff with 10/22s, I just got a slidefire recently on clearance at Cabelas, and while it looks silly, holy crap is it fun. We burned up a brick before we realized what was happening. Got me to thinking about a slidefire 15-22, then I saw the FosTech thing, then I wanted a 22LR AR with that, then a 9mm AR with it...I've got the sickness.
 
#13 · (Edited)
yes in sporting clays years ago , old trap shotooters had them to stop the flinch. gun had to be marked with an orange sticker. SO DANGEROUS they finally out lawed them a lot of sighs from members. SO BAD, u did not have shoot on that squad. 10 person squads,in big shoots. 9 of us left a squad 1 time. not funny

act accordingly legal but bad news

xit
 
#17 ·
ATF, with the blessing of the NRA and the Trump administration, has published an administrative law rule banning bumpfire or slidefire stocks as being full auto conversion parts. And since they're all made after 1986, they can't be registered with an NFA tax paid. As of the spring of 2019 they will be declared illegal and it will be a felony to possess one, even if it's not installed on any gun.

Now, that doesn't bother me much. Because ATF has it right that these bump-fire or slide-fire stocks have the effect of letting you consciously pull the trigger one time and the gun will keep shooting as long as you hold the "trigger" (or the trigger -like ledge or shelf used to brace your trigger finger).

But ATF's published decision, its thought process, boils down to the idea that it just makes the gun shoot too fast without you the user having to take special and deliberate steps to keep it shooting. The "steps" you take unconsciously without pulling and releasing the trigger using your muscles for each individual shot are what gets these banned.

I don't see the same reasoning having any application to binary triggers.
You intentionally pull the trigger. You intentionally release the trigger. Each is its own action, and each gives you one shot.

As for trigger-cranks, like the BMF Activator that I've had for years (decades, going back to the middle 1980s!) it has to be cranked by hand constantly. If you stop cranking it, it stops shooting. Each 1/4 turn of the crank gives 1 shot. So you have to manually pull the lever through a 90-degree arc to make the second shot follow the first shot.

I think those will remain legal, too.

Plus, we know that Congress knew about Gatling guns, which were invented in the 1870s, when they passed the NFA in the 1930s. If they wanted to ban hand-crank operated guns that fired rapidly, they could have. They did not.

But a bump fire or slide fire stock is something Congress couldn't have predicted or contemplated back then.
 
#18 ·
The hell fire does not work as a binary trigger. It is simply an early bumpfire device.

FTR you do not need any gadget at all to bumpfire a semi. the gadgets only make it easier for most folks to do it.

Also, other examples of early bumpfire devices you may want to avoid being in possession of are rubber bands or extra shoe laces.
 
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