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Old 04-16-2017, 02:09 PM
Vee3

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Expensive air rifles.



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I've had air rifles since I could hold a BB gun up to my shoulder, and now own a whole bunch of them 1/2 a Century+ later.

It never ceases to amaze me though, how a fairly high percentage (relative to firearms) of >$1000 air rifles "need something" right out of the box. Sometimes an easy fix by upgrading to better o-rings, but often something more serious and expensive to fix.

Case in point; from Blackpool Air Rifles. This is a nearly $2000 airgun...

Well enough is enough ... from today we are stopping stocking the FX Impact. Sad really as I love the looks .the handling and when they aren't in the workshop being repaired the accuracy, but we simply cannot accept the ridiculous amounts of faults with them . We thought fixing them before they go out would cure most issues but the guns are still going wrong and when you have a 90% return ratio we have to face the fact...These guns are simply not saleable at the moment.
There is a glimmer of hope on the horizon. I have spoken to FX, they are working hard to resolve the issues and hence we may start to stock them again if we feel they truly have addressed the problems.
I know we are going against almost every review on Youtube and the magazines, every pundits advice and most gunshops and distributors glowing recommendations but ...well you can come to your own conclusions.


https://www.facebook.com/permalink.p...bstory_index=0
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Old 04-16-2017, 04:47 PM
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I certainly get your point. But, I think the case you mention with FX is a significant anomaly. I don't own an FX product, but I know it is a well respected company that has produced some very good stuff. From what I gather, the Impact experience is their Ford Edsel, and is quite a mess. That such a well respected company would miss such reportedly gross quality control issues is bothersome. I don't believe it represents their general quality.

I think the other issue involved in the "needs something" question relates more to the buyers than the products. In any sport, the most involved participants buy the most expensive stuff. They also tend to be the most eccentric, and have the greatest need to "personalize" their equipment. Most of it is just that, personal quirks or preferences.
Whether air guns or cars, the makers of after-market equipment love them.
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Old 04-16-2017, 07:16 PM
supersharp
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Funny I'm on a waiting list for this air rifle and could not find anything negative about it, in fact most of the reviews for it are stellar .In a couple of months when mine comes in I have the option of either purchasing it or getting something else as I only have a deposit on it. I appreciate the insight and what you show me .I will do further research to see if anyone else has experienced problems with these ,but again from everything I've seen the accuracy is first-rate but thanks for the heads up.
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Old 04-16-2017, 08:10 PM
supersharp
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One thing I find interesting when I look at all the Facebook replies it's all from people making criticisms but have never actually handled the rifle. I can only find two people that actually had the rifle one had problems but made it work and the other returned it .Sometimes it's Hysteria that causes people to all follow suit which can falsely negatively impact of product. I'm not saying there may not be a problem with this rifle but what I see here it is inconclusive. There's no question that most European top quality air guns are very expensive but there's also no question if you've ever handled them and shot with them that they are superior .I think the Ferrari analogie is a good one ,most of us can't afford one or can't understand why somebody would spend the money for one but in reality you are paying for the performance and the quality of the build that you can't get from a standard car.
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Old 04-16-2017, 11:52 PM
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I really don't see much difference between air guns and firearms. I usually modify to my liking. Almost all firearms I own have had the actions worked and trigger improved.

In airguns all my springers have been tuned to some degree. I have one PCP that is "as is" out of the box. An AA 410E that I have had for around twenty years. It is just an outstanding rifle but was ordered special with custom stock and regulated. Services were performed at Pomona.
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Old 04-18-2017, 04:52 PM
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I have a stock FWB 700 Evolution recommended from Neal Stepp at ISS International Shooters and it's worked fine out of the box.

Trigger, sights and stock required very minimal adjustments.

This was only purchased as a nice gift for myself since I could finally afford one now as an adult.
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Old 04-19-2017, 11:55 AM

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Originally Posted by supersharp View Post
Funny I'm on a waiting list for this air rifle and could not find anything negative about it, in fact most of the reviews for it are stellar .In a couple of months when mine comes in I have the option of either purchasing it or getting something else as I only have a deposit on it. I appreciate the insight and what you show me .I will do further research to see if anyone else has experienced problems with these ,but again from everything I've seen the accuracy is first-rate but thanks for the heads up.
If you have seen nothing negative about the Impact you are not looking hard enough. The gun continues to have QC problems and some questionable design issues.
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Old 04-19-2017, 07:59 PM
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If you have seen nothing negative about the Impact you are not looking hard enough. The gun continues to have QC problems and some questionable design issues.
The majority of negative comments I saw on this air rifle were from people that never had one. I did see a couple of people that have problems and the majority of them were able to fix them .Scrane my question for you is do you have personal experience with a problem with this rifle if not you're just part of the bandwagon of people that are complaining .I'm only interested with people who have first-hand experience of problems.
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Old 04-20-2017, 12:16 AM
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The majority of negative comments I saw on this air rifle were from people that never had one. I did see a couple of people that have problems and the majority of them were able to fix them .Scrane my question for you is do you have personal experience with a problem with this rifle if not you're just part of the bandwagon of people that are complaining .I'm only interested with people who have first-hand experience of problems.
Blackpool is one of the largest airgun distributors in England, so they're not "people that never had one." They clearly have first hand experience.

If a large dealer announces that they've had a 90% return rate on a particular gun, it might be wise to take note and investigate further before buying one, no?
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Old 04-20-2017, 12:32 AM
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I really don't see much difference between air guns and firearms. I usually modify to my liking. Almost all firearms I own have had the actions worked and trigger improved.
That's good.

My experience (and many others, as evidenced via various forums I've been part of over the years) has been different.
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Old 04-20-2017, 08:03 AM

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Originally Posted by supersharp View Post
The majority of negative comments I saw on this air rifle were from people that never had one. I did see a couple of people that have problems and the majority of them were able to fix them .Scrane my question for you is do you have personal experience with a problem with this rifle if not you're just part of the bandwagon of people that are complaining .I'm only interested with people who have first-hand experience of problems.
Actually, I was not complaining, I was advising you to do more research.

Do I have one? Of course not! I have read many accounts from people who actually own one. Why would I buy a gun with many reports of problems?

It seems that you will soon be able to form your own opinion. Good luck.
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Old 04-20-2017, 01:18 PM

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Both springers and pneumatics are much more complex than your typical firearm. in a springer, the trigger has to hold back spring pressure substantially heavier than that from a striker or hammer. Pneumatics have to deal with extreme high pressures with an assortment of orings , seals, and regulators. This is why they cost so much and are prone to failures, especially after time as metal fatigues, lubricants degrade, and seals tear, crack, and shrink.

I think the problems attributed to the Impact come from several sources: The design of the Impact is very original, calling for ground up innovations. A lot of untested ideas were incorporated in this gun. Next, because of the great demand for this gun there was a great rush in the manufacturing process. Finally, to get completed guns out the door QC was compromised for the sake of expediency.
As problems became apparent, FX has rushed to put out fires. I imagine that if FX were to redesign the gun with all they've learned they could come out with a fine little rifle. But I imagine this would call for significant changes and leaving previous owners with a sense of abandonment.
But, really, why should FX be concerned? Because of the way the guns look, their features, and the great accuracy of some rifles they continue to sell, at a high price, more than they can produce.
At almost $2,000. a pop I would be very hesitant to buy into the Impact lottery. For that kind of money I would want assurance the gun is 100% right out of the box.
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Old 04-20-2017, 08:49 PM
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Could the problems that Blackwell is having with the Impact be related to the laws in England concerning the very low power that rifles operate at could it possibly lead to customers tinkering with the rifle to get more out of it?
Maybe it's just like someone buying a Maserati when the speed limit is 50. I'm waiting on the new FX Crown and hopefully FX has that model working mor consistently than the Impact.
Actually from what I've read the Impact if handled with recommended setting and not experimented with is actually a great performer but it's easy to F up if your not carefull
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Old 04-20-2017, 11:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Vee3 View Post
That's good.

My experience (and many others, as evidenced via various forums I've been part of over the years) has been different.
Maybe I'm missing the point here. We seem to be discussing one airgun and not expensive airguns in general. I follow yellow forum where I have seen a few of your posts and GTA on a daily basis. Other than usual discussions of likes and dislikes I guess I missed the general disappointment of expensive airguns from what I have read. And to be clear we are talking PCP and not springers correct? Not many springers out there that run a grand.

The reason I ask is I'm considering a new 25 cal hunting PCP. Been browsing for awhile and a few brands that I have been considering is Daystate and KalibrGun. Would these brands also be included as disappointments? If so I have missed or overlooked the negative reviews.

Last edited by sicumj; 04-20-2017 at 11:08 PM.
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Old 04-21-2017, 09:37 AM

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There are quite a few complaints about Daystate in the UK, but most people in the US are extremely satisfied with their DS rifles. Whether this is due to tighter QC on export guns or differing expectations I don't know.
Kalibrguns are manufactured in Czechoslovakia. Fit and finish are a little rough and the engineering is a little primitive, but the rifles are extremely consistent and very accurate, mainly due to their excellent CZ barrels. Most guns Kalibr makes are bullpups, so make sure you can live with the ergonomics. I recently bought a Cricket Mini Carbine which is a new model not widely available here. Short like a bullpup but shoots like a conventional rifle. .22 only, alas.
AirArms makes some very nice non-regulated rifles which are very popular, accurate, and reliable. Criticism of AirArms is hard to find.
For tops in accuracy, quality, and reliability check out Rapid Air Weapons. Made in USA.

As far as people in the UK messing with their guns to boost power: This does not happen. Penalties are severe and the police are vigilant. Where Impacts might have problems in the UK is having to throttle down the power well below design parameters.
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