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  #1  
Old 05-19-2017, 10:56 AM
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Thumbs down Anschutz 1710 D HB or go Custom?



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Been shooting in some prone rimfire matches here in WA 100 yard and 100/200 yard matches (bipod and rear bag) for several years now. I think I've squeaked the most I can out of my 77/22 (Shilen Varmint barrel.) and I"m not keeping up with the big dogs who have mostly gone to Anschutz.

I'm thinking of the aforementioned Anschutz. At $2100 - 2200 for the rifle with the two stage trigger, I'm now thinking if a custom gun on a 40x, Turbo or some other action with good named barrel and a decent smith to spin it together ..... am I into it for more than $2500 including stock? Are Anschutz like any other rifle ... a crap shoot, except with better odds?

Will I notice the accuracy enhancements off a bipod?

Any and all insights are welcomed.
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Old 05-19-2017, 11:38 AM
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The only thing for certain is, nothing. You might get a 1710 that shoots well enough, and it sounds like your competition is successful with it. Unless you step up to a 54 match action rifle, you will not have a trigger that, in my opinion, is quite up to the task. At that price point, you can probably have a rifle built that suits your needs better.
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Old 05-19-2017, 11:57 AM
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I suspect that most on this forum would not see an out-of-the-box 1710 HB as being truly competitive in any competition approaching benchrest (like bipod and rear bag) against a full custom build on a dedicated action like the Turbo (which Bill Calfee considers the finest rimfire action available) fitted with a Jewell trigger, a match-grade barrel like a Lilja, Shilen, or Krieger, and a stock designed for this application. I'm assuming in the above that bipod and rear bag gets the rifle steadied to pretty close to benchrest conditions, although I must admit that I haven't actually done any shooting this way. Although the factory 1710 HB is an accurate rifle, I'm not sure it would be that much of an improvement--maybe none at all--over your 77/22 if your Shilen barrel is a good one, and the rifle is well-bedded.

As for prone competition, on the other hand, I imagine that the advantages of a custom build would be almost negligible, although a prone-position-friendly stock would be an improvement over the factory 1710 HB classic stock.

Your characterization of any particular Anschutz (on a 54 action) being a crap shoot with better odds than with most other brands is pretty accurate, I think, although I believe the odds are much better. Among all the 1710 HBs produced, I think you'd see less variability in accuracy than with other brands, and the average would be higher.
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Old 05-19-2017, 01:57 PM
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While a 1710 D HB can be pretty accurate it would not be my first choice to win at prone competitive shooting at 100-200 yards. The stock is very important for prone shooting and the Anschutz is not adjustable or well suited for prone competitive shooting.
The custom guns with custom actions, barrels and stocks are just plain going to beat an out of the box 1710 D HB sporter.
I would see what the top dogs are using and go that route either used or start a custom build.
Yes it will cost more but it costs more to buy something that doesn't work for what you want then then spend the money anyway on something better and more suited for your needs and goals.
I have been picking up some nice used shooting equipment from older folks retiring and getting out of the shooting game.
Good luck.
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Old 05-19-2017, 06:11 PM
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You need a bench rest with the proper bags. A simple bipod isn't enough for any gun,including a full blown custom (which will cost much more than 2500)
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Old 05-19-2017, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Camster View Post
You need a bench rest with the proper bags. A simple bipod isn't enough for any gun,including a full blown custom (which will cost much more than 2500)
I have experience with good quality bipods used by FTR shooters that are quite efficient. Maybe not as good and stable as the best pedestal rests but as good as common rests

Gilbert
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Old 05-19-2017, 07:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avagadro View Post
Been shooting in some prone rimfire matches here in WA 100 yard and 100/200 yard matches (bipod and rear bag) for several years now. I think I've squeaked the most I can out of my 77/22 (Shilen Varmint barrel.) and I"m not keeping up with the big dogs who have mostly gone to Anschutz.

I'm thinking of the aforementioned Anschutz. At $2100 - 2200 for the rifle with the two stage trigger, I'm now thinking if a custom gun on a 40x, Turbo or some other action with good named barrel and a decent smith to spin it together ..... am I into it for more than $2500 including stock? Are Anschutz like any other rifle ... a crap shoot, except with better odds?

Will I notice the accuracy enhancements off a bipod?

Any and all insights are welcomed.
What would be the group size to be in contention? also what ammo are you using?

a good solid Match 54 with a benchmark (I prefer these) barrel chambered correctly for the ammo you are using with probably be less that $2500
if you can find donor action for around $800-900 plus another $700 for a barrel and barrel work.
I got a Benchmark .900 that I found C-X that shot 18mm at 100m for 10-shots
chamber on it was done for Lapua. Evelio McDonald does my barrel work.

Lee
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Old 05-19-2017, 07:50 PM
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You need a bench rest with the proper bags. A simple bipod isn't enough for any gun,including a full blown custom (which will cost much more than 2500)
There is a guy by the name of George who might very well disagree with that.

he does pretty good I hear with a bi-pod against some big name BR shooters
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Old 05-19-2017, 08:28 PM
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There is a guy by the name of George who might very well disagree with that.

he does pretty good I hear with a bi-pod against some big name BR shooters
I just know that I was more consistent with a rest,and it wasn't a fancy one.
I think that we'll agree that the OP isn't building up a new Turbo action for 2500.
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Old 05-22-2017, 12:06 AM
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I wouldn't put much past the OP right now ... he has visions of sugarplums swirling in his head.

g
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Old 05-22-2017, 02:47 AM
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Turbo, Stiller, 40x, 10x and Hall .... many choices, am I missing any? Seems most work with a M00 trigger. Are they all different inlets? I believe the 40x is a M700 short action. any insight on the rest. Do they have Remington recoil lugs? Many Q's, I haven't been down this road yet.

Best
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Old 05-22-2017, 03:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avagadro View Post
Turbo, Stiller, 40x, 10x and Hall .... many choices, am I missing any? Seems most work with a M00 trigger. Are they all different inlets? I believe the 40x is a M700 short action. any insight on the rest. Do they have Remington recoil lugs? Many Q's, I haven't been down this road yet.

Best
Have no idea of what you should get. But, if I wanted to remove as many variables from the equation as I could, and had the money, I'd go custom with a 2500x from Stiller. That or the Trident from same. Shorter bolt throw on that model, which might be an advantage for you. Don't know...

As to the actions, most custom actions require some work to get smooth and functioning to their peak. Stiller's actions come about as "hands off" as you can get IMO. Put on a barrel, trigger and stock and you're done.

The stock part is what would be the biggest thing to me. Prone is a lot different than from a bench. You can figure out a way to attach a bipod to any stock, but the hold and back end of the stock is what would matter the most I suppose.

Triggers...For a Turbo, 10x, 2500x/Trident, etc you can use a jewel, BixnAndy or Flavio Flare. The Bix and FF are far and away better than the Jewel. Not even close IMHO.

Barrels...whatever flavor you choose would be fine I suppose. Shilen, Benchmark, Muller, etc. Those are the three biggies.

On the flip side, the Anschutz match position rifles would give you a very nice two stage trigger, a stock more suited to prone shooting and a history of doing very well in competition.

To me, I'd probably lean towards the 1913 Anschutz in a stock more suited to prone shooting. That tiny bit you might pick up from having a custom built action would probably be offset by the advantages of having a stock more suited for prone shooting.

Of course you could drop a bundle into a custom built stock for an aftermarket action, but have no idea who you'd have make it.

Hope this helps.

Oh, as to shooting off a bipod. I'm not going to say you can or can't do well with one. But know a bunch of people who make some big name BR shooters do a double take when they see them show up with bipods on their guns. These guys give up nothing to the guys using custom rests. YMMV

Good luck

Kenny
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  #14  
Old 05-22-2017, 06:15 AM
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For the best accuracy I would say custom is the way to go, there may not be much difference but in competition every little bit is going to help. As for the bi-pod I have seen some impressive scores with shooters using a bi-pod the key is setting them up correctly on the gun and on the bench or wherever you may be using the bi-pod
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  #15  
Old 05-22-2017, 01:12 PM
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Would you trust Pac-Nor to spin on a new barrel or would specialized smith be the way to go?
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