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Swedish Mark III Thread

22K views 83 replies 12 participants last post by  Tacoma 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
Some time ago i bought my first pistols two walthers PP one in 22 and 32 acp both are german made not french, i use them for competition in a class called field snubby(sweden). But i cannot shoot precision with these its way to hard...

Im thinkin off buying a bullseye pistol(bullseye in sweden is at 30yards) Precision shooting. Im thinking off getting a ruger mk3 with a rink grips. The problem is that i have never handled one off these guns and i dont know how much work you need to put on it for me to have a chance. I know the trigger is really bad. I have a ruger 10/22 wich i really like but the original factory barrel and trigger.....maybe is not match grade so to speak.

What about the ruger pistols ? what can you expect off it, and i mean with ironsights at 30 yards. Ammo is not a problem here, i can buy norma, cci, blazer, lapua, SK(whole sortiment) fiochi,eley and some other crappy brands.

I really like american weapons so i would really like to give this pistol a chance, people here use fwb aw 93 ALOT! at one competion wich i attended there was 340 ppl competing and 80% off them was using fwb aw 93... i saw 2 rugers..:D:D:D

So please you guys out there that been using this gun for precision shooting ..help!
 
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#2 · (Edited)
Is it possible?

I don't shoot for precision, but I will tell you that my Mark III 22/45 trigger is light and crisp after installing a Volquartsen (VQ) Adjustable Trigger, a VQ sear, a Clark Custom Sear Pin and Hammer Bushing, and removing the Chamber Loaded Indicator (CLI).
My trigger breaks without my barrel moving, but I do not have a gauge. I would guess 2-2.5 pound trigger pull.

Can you get these aftermarket parts overseas? If not, have Sarona Gun Works (SGW) set it up and ship it to you. Sarona is a sponsor here. He has a number of years experience with Ruger .22 semi-autos.

Edit: the gun I mention above might have the BAM hammer bushing. BAM is also a sponsor here. I believe the Clark parts are in an older Mark II.
 
#5 ·
Sarona seems to know what hes talking about, i actully been reading alot of stuff
Don't let him fool you. He knows a LOT of stuff about Ruger guns after 40 years! I kid him that Bill Ruger used to ask him for advice before he (Bill Ruger) died! :D:D:D If SGW doesn't know the answer, it doesn't exist. ;)
 
#4 · (Edited)
Is it possible?

The Clark Bushing is Mark II style and does not have the step that the BAM bushing has to best fit the Mark III hammer. When you take out the magazine disconnect parts from a Mark III, the step in the hammer is evident. The best replacement part to use on a Mark III is the Mark III replacement style, such as the BAM bushing, or the Tandemcross bushing.

Best of luck to you! Please post a photo of the new gun once you receive it. [emoji106]🏽
 
#6 ·
The Clark Bushing is Mark II style and does not have the step that the BAM bushing has to best fit the Mark III hammer. When you take out the magazine disconnect parts from a Mark III, the step in the hammer is evident. The best replacement part to use on a Mark III is the Mark III replacement style, such as the BAM bushing, or the Tandemcross bushing.

Best of luck to you! Please post a photo of the new gun once you receive it. [emoji106]🏽
Don't sell the Clark Bushing short. I have 'em in all my MkIIIs. Got 'em before the others even existed. Sure the others are different, but the Clark will work fine if it's all you can get.
 
#7 ·
This MKIII has an 8" Tactical Solutions barrel (the longest they make now is 6") and modified iron sights (narrower). It has a Volquartsen trigger group, I made the grips and the magazine safety has been removed. The cost was about 2x the cost of the pistol alone.

I can't do this every time but the pistol can:

 
#12 ·
If you are new to bullseye-type shooting, then a target type factory Mark III pistol should outshoot you for quite a while (think years) - this is even more true with iron-sights since iron-sight scores are always lower on average than red-dot scores.

Most people dislike the factory Ruger trigger and opt for the Volquartsen accurizing kit early on. You can replace other parts, but it is not needed IMO unless your pistol has a particular problem that needs fixing - this includes replacing the grips.

I don't have bench-rest data, but here's a real-world anecdote (FWIW): I scored a timed-fire target for a bullseye league colleague a couple matches ago. She put 10 shots in the 10 ring (3.25" dia @ 25 yards) in 20 seconds, one hand. Factory Ruger MarkIII Competition with a Volq. trigger and an Ultradot red-dot. Her inability to repeat that every time was not the pistol's fault.

That said, understand that the MarkIIIs with Volquartsen triggers are considered entry level bullseye pistols - it is built to a price-point.

The fwb aw 93 seems comparable to the Pardini .22 pistols the good+serious shooters use in my little league. These are $2500 pistols. Whereas the Ruger with a Volq. kit is $500-700, depending on the base pistol.

*All that said* because you live in Sweden, it would be a good idea to go talk to some local bullseye shooting coaches and see what they recommend. It's possible you have some better choices that we don't in the US, or that the Ruger is a poor choice for reasons other than performance (parts support ? import taxes ?...).

-Mark
 
#13 ·
*All that said* because you live in Sweden, it would be a good idea to go talk to some local bullseye shooting coaches and see what they recommend. It's possible you have some better choices that we don't in the US, or that the Ruger is a poor choice for reasons other than performance (parts support ? import taxes ?...).

-Mark
And their answers are , Buy a morini cm22 , feinwerkbau aw93 or pardini pistols :p. But the reason that i want a ruger is.

-It seems to be durable due to its robust construction which i really like on pistols.
-There are a lot of aftermarket stuff for it.
-it has a huge fan base
-it seems to shoot very good for the money, enough for me.

Only downside i have seen buy reading in this forum is that it seems to sometimes have shifty quality, now i have bought a couple of rugers 10/22 before, yes they are not so polished and have a bad trigger, but they shoot good and are robust.

So i kinda expect the same thing out off a mark III pistol.
 
#14 ·
OK, I am not sure what class of shooter you are, but maybe you need to find some bullseye type coaches that deal with newer-to-the-sport shooters (rather than ones that think you need to *start* with a specialized $2500 pistol).

I know one coach that loans prospective bullseye shooters factory Mark 3 22/45s with bull barrels. And rarely cleans them :)

An additional thought: in my observations, there seems to be a middle tier between the entry level Rugers and high-end fw, Pardini's, etc occupied by pistols including the S&W Model 41, Marvel conversions on 1911 frames and full Volquartsen builds. Depending on your skill & budget, you might want to start there.

Finally, I would agree with all your observations about the Ruger - robust, lots of aftermarket support, etc. You can't go wrong if you accept that a $500 pistol isn't going to inherently outshoot a $2500 (or a $1200) one.

If/when you outgrow the Ruger, it should be pretty easy to sell it on.

I can't speak to the current production - mine is from a couple years ago. But maybe there is a good supply of older used Rugers where you are. Heck, there might even be some hiding in the gunsafes of those hundreds of fw owners you saw that could be sold to a new owner...

-Mark
 
#83 ·
All true but I've seen a gent on my team with a $400 Ruger Mk II 22/45 regularly outshoot $1000 pistols back when I shot bullseye. Sure if you get good, you can outgrow an inexpensive MK II but starting with a Pardini doesn't make a person a marksman either. It's all about having skill to start with and then learning to hone that skill through practice of good techniques. My advice is to start with something decent and shoot it till you feel it's holding you back. You'll know when it's time.
 
#16 ·
Thank you for your answers Yukon!
i have 30.000 swedish kronors to spend on pistol and equipment(3690 USD)
This is the kind of shooting i compete in right now.

you have to be fast and precise, and precision is a big thing ofc. But i think that a ruger would do just fine. You shoot from 12-17 seconds depends on what station you are at, there are 8 stations and sometimes there are 10.

Why do i need this gun to function well on precision shooting?

Here in sweden we have to renew our licenses for our pistols each and every 5 years. And you do that by shooting gold targets .46 out of 50 points,

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/mikethebiker/media/tavla.jpg.html
the target is 60x60 cm big, center is 25mm ..

the 10=50 mm
ring 9=100 mm
ring 8=150 mm
ring 7=200 mm
ring 1=500 mm
which ring you hit= points
This is precision shooting in sweden. Just wanted to point this out so you get a point.

you have to present them to the police which in turn they will send you the renewed licenses. You also sometimes need to compete to show that you really need the guns....
This is why i need a pistol that can at least outshoot me. In the future i will probably buy a fwb or whatever if i feel that the pistol is the problem that i cant get better results. When you talk to people here they tell you get the best directly as your first gun because you will just have to buy it later anyway. I dont agree with that and i know alot of others who don't. Money is not an issue for me but i have to say that i am new to pistol shooting. I have been in competitions, and i have achieved good scores, better then those whose shoot for years.

as a conclusion i want to do both of these things,

on precision shooting my only need there, is to be able to shoot those 46 points nothing else i wont compete on that.
 
#27 ·
Here in sweden we have to renew our licenses for our pistols each and every 5 years. And you do that by shooting gold targets .46 out of 50 points,

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/mikethebiker/media/tavla.jpg.html
the target is 60x60 cm big, center is 25mm ..

the 10=50 mm
ring 9=100 mm
ring 8=150 mm
ring 7=200 mm
ring 1=500 mm
which ring you hit= points
This is precision shooting in sweden. Just wanted to point this out so you get a point.
I thought I'd posted this. Must not have taken.

http://www.indecorous.com/bullseye/rings.html

Those are our target sizes, shot one-handed. Iron sights or red dots with no magnification may be used.

Our 50-foot target features a .9" 10-ring. I'd say that any Ruger with a factory target barrel (say, all bull, slab, and fluted barrels over 5") will happily group at half that size at that range, with good ammunition. That's slow fire--10 shots, 10 minutes.

The outdoor (25/50-yard) targets are scaled up for the range, but as the author points out, they're scaled a little too big if you strictly compare ring size in minutes of arc. Rugers are used by the outdoor guys, who are usually shooting 2700 matches--a 90-shot match each with rimfire, centerfire (anything over .32), and a .45 ACP. Rugers are less popular there, mostly because the average 2700 shooter has already spent thousands on their other guns (plus ammo, reloading equipment, travel, match fees, etc), so they'll opt for something more expensive than the Ruger. That said, I know of a couple outdoor masters using Rugers.

Timed fire is 5 shots in 20 seconds, rapid is 5 in 10 seconds. There, the 10-ring measures 1.8" at 50 feet.

I think you'll be more than happy with the Ruger's stock upper. And probably the trigger as well.

PS--I watched your video. The second guy from the left, the little one dressed in black? Tell him to get his finger off the trigger until he's on target. :D Off target, off trigger, on target, on trigger.
 
#18 ·
Well, im 100% sure its going to be a cheap option(ruger) im not sad. Wife apparently needs a new kitchen and bathroom restoration.... feels good to be poor again :bthumb: 4-5 weeks until the new shipment comes from the United states, i hate waiting.

But i will keep this thread updated with my competition activity when my pistol arrives.
 
#36 ·
Mark II pistols also lack the safety lock in the main spring housing (MSH); they have wider "ears" on the back of the bolt; the hammer doesn't have a chunk milled out of it; and the mag release is at the heel of the frame.

I think most people prefer the design of the Mark II, except for the position of the mag release.
 
#37 ·
Nice input!

Im going to try one out next week and hopefully buy it. He wants 365 $ for it. I dont know if its worth it you guys tell me?. But it seems that the mark II where made a little more ''made in the america with pride'' rather than these new ones which by any means is nothing wrong with. But still there are a couple of gimmicks on mark 3 that i don't like. LCI, magazine disconnector...
 
#38 ·
I have several MKIII's, never owned a MKII but have shot several. If that's what you want, you can make a MKIII into a MKII except for the magazine release and that's not desireable anyway.

The MKIII is the current model. You can buy it new and have many choices. If you don't like the trigger, the mag safety or the LCI you can fix those inexpensively. You can improve on the "fit" and finishing if need be. I've removed my mag safeties except on the gun that novices usually shoot. My aftermarket barrels have no LCI but I wish they did. It's so easy to tilt the gun slightly to see whether a round is loaded or not. (You don't want that to be your only safety check, but it's a good one.)

I don't mean that there is anything wrong with the MKII but IMO there is no reason to buy one in preference to a MKIII. I would certainly buy a MKII at the right price and around here $365 would be the right price. Same with a MKIII.
 
#41 ·
I have several MKIII's, never owned a MKII but have shot several. If that's what you want, you can make a MKIII into a MKII except for the magazine release and that's not desireable anyway.
This is not true. Except for the 22/45 mkiii, you CAN put in a mark 2 mag release, and it will work fine.

It also IS desireable in a number of ways. First, you can use either mkii OR mkiii magazines in a mkiii pistol with a mkii release. Second, there are fewer feeding problems using the mkii release. The biggest drawback is that mag changes are a little slower.

Bottom line is - if you want a mkii, you are better off buying one than converting a mkiii into one. The cost of all the replacement parts for a conversion is more than the price difference of the 2 pistol types.
 
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