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Old 04-21-2017, 07:39 AM
JStacy
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Split rims for RGB's



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I know cheap ammunition lets get beyond that and see if some good answers come forward.
I have had split heads on RGB's in most of my MK III guns. I call them "puffers" because they put out a puff of smoke when the rim splits. The retrieved cases are split along the fold lines of the case head.
Most of my MK II's do not split the case heads on the RGB's and none of my rifles or Contender split the RGB case head.
Now with all of that said I just got a MK III 678 Hunter from a fellow RFC member and it shoots RGB quite well and yesterday I fired 100 rounds with out a split case head.
It seems the common element is the LCI on the MK III's. The Hunter upper had the LCI removed . I am not sure the cause is head space or chamber ? The chambers do not have a "carbon ring" that prevents the bullets from seating completely . A loaded round will drop in the chambers.
Reasonable thoughts and personal experience not "junk ammo" I know it is lower quality ammo but it shoots quite good from some of my guns.
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Old 04-21-2017, 07:58 AM
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You seem to have the issue narrowed down to the gun and not the ammo, as long as it doesn't happen in other guns you must be right. I'm not an expert but would be suspicious of a headspace issue, shooting a variety of other brands may confirm that as the problem.
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Old 04-21-2017, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JStacy View Post
I know cheap ammunition lets get beyond that and see if some good answers come forward.
Oh HECK no.. we can't let that one slide by!

We ALL know what dirty initials 'RGB' = (Roy G. Biv) right?



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Old 04-21-2017, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JStacy View Post
Reasonable thoughts and personal experience not "junk ammo" I know it is lower quality ammo but it shoots quite good from some of my guns.
Correct me if I'm wrong but "RGB" = Remington Golden Bullets? In any case, I've NEVER had that issue in any of my MkIIIs. I've used inexpensive rounds and good quality stuff with NO problems. Only issue I've ever had was leading from the dread Remington ThunderBolts.

In fact, the Golden Bullets always performed well in all my Rugers. I am an unashamed neat freak so go to great lengths to keep everything spotless. Does your issue happen with all of your guns? Just wondering, is it possible you got a bad batch of ammo that could somehow been overpowered or does it happen with every RGB you've used?

Hopefully SGW will chime in with some of his wisdom and make us feel dumb for not thinking of it in the first place... He knows some stuff!
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Old 04-21-2017, 09:47 AM
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Despite what you said about lack of carbon ring, that would be the top of my list. If something keeps the round from seating all the way so it's not completey enclosed by the bolt recess and the chamber you get cases bulging at the back and possible splits. Is something else getting in the way? Dirt caked in the headspace or impeding the extractor? Chamber deformed from being peened by the firing pin? I don't think the LCI would do it but you could try removing it or give it a good cleaning. Make sure it can move easily. I've never had a problem when shooting RGB's that was the fault of the ammo. I've had some that were solved by cleaning.
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Old 04-21-2017, 12:13 PM
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Well , wheels turning, the Hunter upper I put on one of my MK III 512 grip frame. The 512 would split RGB's occasionally so ............................ The put together gun had the 512's grip frame and bolt and it did not split RGB's !!!!! must have been the chamber . Also I have two Tac sol uppers , tight almost match chambers, and they never split a RGB !!! Chamber on some of my MK III's
seems to be different than some MK II chambers ! The split case phenomenon only seemed to occur with some of my MK III's, I have several.
I wonder if there was an intentional change in the chambers when the MK III's came out? However the Hunter MK III has no problems with split cases ?
Manufacturing anomaly I guess.
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Old 04-21-2017, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JStacy View Post
It seems the common element is the LCI on the MK III's. The Hunter upper had the LCI removed . I am not sure the cause is head space or chamber ? The chambers do not have a "carbon ring" that prevents the bullets from seating completely .
I think you're onto something with the head space. It seems to me that Ruger tends to cut the bolt recess excessively deep. The result is light strikes and "puffers" if anything partially prevents the round from fully seating against the chamber.

It doesn't have to be carbon ring. It can be the LCI, or the extractor as well. Have you tried your 512 upper with the LCI removed?

My MK3 had the LCI removed, and a VQ extractor installed early on. It has never had a "puffer". My MK2 never had a "puffer" until recently. I was trying a new extractor that is shorter than the VQ. It doesn't hold shells nearly as well as the VQ, and I think it slightly holds the case into the recess when the bolt is in battery. Lots more FTFires than with the VQ extractor (same ammo), and has occasional "puffers".

I put another VQ extractor in today. I suspect my next range visit will be far less frustrating.
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Old 04-21-2017, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JStacy View Post
Well , wheels turning, the Hunter upper I put on one of my MK III 512 grip frame. The 512 would split RGB's occasionally so ............................ The put together gun had the 512's grip frame and bolt and it did not split RGB's !!!!! must have been the chamber . Also I have two Tac sol uppers , tight almost match chambers, and they never split a RGB !!! Chamber on some of my MK III's
seems to be different than some MK II chambers ! The split case phenomenon only seemed to occur with some of my MK III's, I have several.
I wonder if there was an intentional change in the chambers when the MK III's came out? However the Hunter MK III has no problems with split cases ?
Manufacturing anomaly I guess.
I rather doubt it Jim, Ruger sticks pretty dang close to what SAAMI lists for .22 rimfire chamber specifications. If the chamber was O.S., you'd get split rims, and cases, much more frequently than occasionally. Headspace is easily checked if you have a good caliper that will read depth, and there again, if headspace is out of spec, failures will be much more frequent, but there is a fix for it being too long.
Consider, if you will, the rim on all .22 rimfire cartridges is thin metal so that the firing pin can detonate the primer mix. Could just be a case of some cases having an inordinately thinner rim from the extrusion process.

You're the one person here on RFC who got me to at least try some of the Remington Golden Bullets, once again. I've done that and found that they are getting a bit better.
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Old 04-21-2017, 06:14 PM
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SGW I too think the RGB's are getting better. We shot some from my friends 22/45 4" and they shot well out of his gun with a notable louder pop than the SV he was using . We declared them armadillo accurate at 33 yards ! I have an old Mark I 51/2" that shoots them quite well so several of my guns shoot them well. My 10" Match contender barrel will shoot them into 1/2" at 50 yards.

TE the 512 has a filler and LCI removed. I have had a couple of MK III that still had the LCI and split the rims so I traded them off.

Mainly I have thousands of RGB's so I have to shoot them as plinkers and small game hunters.

None of my Rugers liked the new CCI SV segmented HP. The tac sol uppers shot them into about 1" at 33 yards, good back yard varmint load.

We have raccoons and armadillos damaging our property so I keep a 22/45/Tac sol 6" loaded with the SV HP's . They work well on armadillos and make a nice 3/4" exit hole and create a good leak !
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Old 04-21-2017, 07:06 PM
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I wouldn't admit this in polite company...

But besides being dirty, I have several rifles that just LOVE RGB's....
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Old 04-21-2017, 09:51 PM
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I use the RGB 36g HP often, especially in my Kimber 1911, and every now and then I get a split. I actually thought it was the ammo, being bulk and not very expensive. Being it was priced so low ( even in the height of the shortage) I forgave the occasional split.
I use it in all my 22lr pistols, and none of my pistols are immune to this with this ammo. I do find this ammo fairly accurate though for the price.
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